The James Bond Debate Thread - 216
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 7,797
    Yes all of them, opinions change. People hated OHMSS, now it's one of the most loved films in the series. We already have some people looking back fondly at DAD and MR.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,629
    thelivingroyale said:

    Yes all of them, opinions change. People hated OHMSS, now it's one of the most loved films in the series. We already have some people looking back fondly at DAD and MR.



    Strangely those same people are being moved into insane asylums. What a coincidence...
  • VirageVirage
    Posts: 1,804
    DaltonCraig007 said:

    If the debut film of Bond #7 is highly unpopular, it won't affect that film because the curiosity and 'new Bond factor' will bring people in. What would be bad for the BO would be keeping the same actor and make a similar film for his 2nd outing. So in other words it would take a string of unpopular movies to start a dip in the box office.



    That is probably the only foreseeable way at the moment to see the franchise end.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi
    Posts: 5,869
    THESIS 124

    David Arnold performs better for films outside the Bond series than for the 007 adventures.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 2,137
    David Arnold performs better for films outside the Bond series than for the 007 adventures?

    I am no great fan of his work for the 007 franchise, he mostly about rearrangements in the drum and bass style. When he got the chance to do original work that could be the new standard he did give us some nice tunes but overal the soundtracks were mostly forgetable.

    I strongly dislike his remix of the Doctor Who theme for the 8th Doctor.

    His music for the Moffat/Gattis Sherlock series however is the proof he can do better. So it is surprising how he managed to fail so spectacular before.

    That said, the original Stargate theme is fairly decent, but the rearrengement by different composers (for the tv show) gave the piece a better balance.

    I would say that as a composer for tv DA has far more succes creativily than for the movies. so agreed.
  • RogueAgentRogueAgent
    Posts: 3,508
    I would say its abit hit and miss so not sure what i think? So will sit on the fence for this one?
  • Samuel001Samuel001
    Posts: 9,932
    I too think he's hit and miss regarding a lot of his work. I though, hold on to hope it's a 'hit' when it comes to Bond, mind, as we deserve a more than decent score for these films.
  • VirageVirage
    Posts: 1,804
    The only film of his I've seen that isn't bond is Hot Fuzz. But I don't see what the problem with Arnold is.
  • DoubleOhhSevenDoubleOhhSeven
    Posts: 1,003
    Hey what happened to my suggestion? :(
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss
    Posts: 810
    I really don't know. I think hi work on Brosnan's films was terrible, but I did like his work on CR and QoS, except that he probably had something to do with getting Alcia Keys and Jack White to produce strange and eerie noises together for a title....screaming. For that alone the three of them should be executed. By Dan.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi
    Posts: 5,869
    DoubleOhhSeven said:

    Hey what happened to my suggestion? :(



    Please read my reply, sir. Also, there's a waiting list for topics. ;-)
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi
    Posts: 5,869
    THESIS 125

    The title 'TomorrowNeverDies' has absolutely no meaning whatsoever.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,629
    Disagree. It fit into the film, even if it wasn't meant to be the title, and does sound like something a media mogul would peddle around in his dialect.
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,046
    Disagree. Since Carver's newspaper was titled "Tomorrow", there is relevance to the title of the movie. Also, since Carver believed that the news was the new form of weaponry, he believed that "Tomorrow" would never die, especially since he'd get exclusive broadcasting rights in China to complete his world domination of the media. Even further, it does make sense, considering that the future can't die because it will always remain the future.
  • Samuel001Samuel001
    Posts: 9,932
    Again, I diagree though the original title would have made much more sense and of course it would, as all film titles should!
  • RogueAgentRogueAgent
    Posts: 3,508
    Assuming we are talking about the paper? i would have to disagree. In general? Ofcourse i disagree! ;)
  • M_BaljeM_Balje
    Posts: 884
    Disagree.

    Tomorrow Never Lies can be a nice subtitle for a future Bond movie, if Eon whant to make a movie in the legacy of Eliot Carver.


    Yesterday is history, today is a memory, You know the rest / Yesterday is history, today is a memory,what it be tomorrow ? / The Lies of yesterday are the future of tomorrow.. :^o
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    Posts: 2,252
    Disagree, what 00Beast said sums it up for me as well.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss
    Posts: 810
    Agree. makes no sense at all. Newspapers die as well...
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,629
    In a really strange way, the title is true outside of the film itself. Today is today, and tomorrow is tomorrow, but once tomorrow comes it is today, and the last today you just left is now yesterday, so tomorrow REALLY never dies. It is always on the horizon, no matter what. And you all have to admit that it beats the original title Tomorrow Never Lies, based off the Beatles tune. Now that one makes absolutely no sense at all.
  • DoubleOhhSevenDoubleOhhSeven
    Posts: 1,003
    DarthDimi said:

    DoubleOhhSeven said:

    Hey what happened to my suggestion? :(



    Please read my reply, sir. Also, there's a waiting list for topics. ;-)


    All you had to do was say so. I didn't know there was a waiting list.

    As for the current topic I agree. The original title would've made perfect sense. But they changed it just because this one sounded cooler.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,629
    But Tomorrow Never Lies really doesn't make much sense at all. I mean, if it is referring to news in general, it lies a good chunk of the time, so in reality a spelling error saved this film's title for the better.
  • VirageVirage
    Posts: 1,804
    Tomorrow is the name of Carvers newspaper. It works.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi
    Posts: 5,869
    Tomorrow Never Lies would indeed have made more sense. At least it would contain a priceless irony, applicable to the film as much as to the real world.

    Virage said:

    Tomorrow is the name of Carvers newspaper. It works.



    But is that enough to have it make sense, I wonder? ;-)
  • DoubleOhhSevenDoubleOhhSeven
    Posts: 1,003
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 said:

    But Tomorrow Never Lies really doesn't make much sense at all. I mean, if it is referring to news in general, it lies a good chunk of the time, so in reality a spelling error saved this film's title for the better.



    How doesn't it make sense? It's ironic as all the "Tomorrow" newspaper seems to do it lie, while assuring us that they don't. The title they used seemed to me like a cheap excuse to get the word "Die" or in this case a variation of the word into the title.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    Posts: 13,629
    DoubleOhhSeven said:

    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 said:

    But Tomorrow Never Lies really doesn't make much sense at all. I mean, if it is referring to news in general, it lies a good chunk of the time, so in reality a spelling error saved this film's title for the better.



    How doesn't it make sense? It's ironic as all the "Tomorrow" newspaper seems to do it lie, while assuring us that they don't. The title they used seemed to me like a cheap excuse to get the word "Die" or in this case a variation of the word into the title.


    So, the very filmed being named Tomorrow Never Lies is like the headline of a newspaper attempting to make its readers believe that it is reputable? I can see that.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 4,555
    Probably one of the most asinine titles ever for a Bond movie, it has to be up there with a View to a Kill, even some argue that Quantum Of Solace, is not above a pile of chicken litter, although it does make a certain amount of sense apparently

    The whole arguement is, apparently is was going to be called 'Tomorrow Never Lies' then they changed it, with the whole media group thing and newspaper headlines. Above all else, it's a poor title, for a poor movie, and a poor James Bond that year (1997) I'm afraid, there's no sense in lying

    Maybe the title does have a certain amount of meaning - but I can't look beyond, well, it's as silly as hell really.. Thesis seems correct


    :-<
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi
    Posts: 5,869
    THESIS 126

    Kevin McClory's acts of bitterness towards EON eventually exceeded the injustice that may have been done to him.
  • 00130013
    Posts: 1,113
    Now this is a thesis I really like.
    I perhaps I'm not the most informed person on that matter but I will give my humble opinion anyway.
    My argument has always been that it's true, McClory and the other guy help to develop the story of Thunderball and SPECTRE. Fleming was very naive (I don't think deliberately bad) in not giving them the proper credits.
    But, and this is my position, McClory should had no rights over the James Bond character and all the elements Fleming previoulsly created. So he could not have made Never Say Never Again, at least with Bond, Moneypenny, M, ecc. He even was credited producer of TB, one of the most succesfull movies, so earning a lot of money, I imagine.
    And I know that it is business... but not everything. For McClory was personal. And the whole thing with Connery was also I mix of business and personal vengence.
    So while I understand the motive and the rationality, I don't condone it. He went too far out of hate. Agree with T-126.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 2,137
    No, why would you say that?

    Fleming tried to screw him out of his rights and probably so did EON. In the end he wanted what was his and the other folks were not going to pay for it if they could help him.
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