Who should/could be a Bond actor?

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  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,249
    Pingu for Bond, you spiecists!
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Aerq8ALPeg-14.png
  • 00Agent00Agent Any man who drinks Dom Perignon '52 can't be all bad.
    Posts: 5,185
    Rumor has it, he was already screen tested

  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    That is as bad as the DAD gunbarrel. No wonder he didn t get the part.
  • Posts: 15,111
    00Agent wrote: »
    Rumor has it, he was already screen tested


    My son recognised Pingu right away and insisted to watch this.
    bondjames wrote: »
    True. One of Craig's best scenes in CR is when he witnesses Vesper in the shower. Another one is in the PTS with Dryden. Roger Moore and Sean Connery did that many times in their films in their own way, and so did Dalton (although he arguably didn't need to because his visage was intimidating enough). That is a key requirement for a good Bond actor in my mind. Understated subtlety, with an innate ability to convey tons with just with a look.

    Maybe that's for the controversial thread but I never found Dalton menacing as Bond. I thought he was far more threatening (and charming for that matter) in The Rocketeer.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Ludovico wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    True. One of Craig's best scenes in CR is when he witnesses Vesper in the shower. Another one is in the PTS with Dryden. Roger Moore and Sean Connery did that many times in their films in their own way, and so did Dalton (although he arguably didn't need to because his visage was intimidating enough). That is a key requirement for a good Bond actor in my mind. Understated subtlety, with an innate ability to convey tons with just with a look.

    Maybe that's for the controversial thread but I never found Dalton menacing as Bond. I thought he was far more threatening (and charming for that matter) in The Rocketeer.
    I always feel like he could snap at any moment. There's something a bit unhinged about him imho (and I mean that in a good way). I've not seen The Rocketeer.
  • Posts: 15,111
    bondjames wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    True. One of Craig's best scenes in CR is when he witnesses Vesper in the shower. Another one is in the PTS with Dryden. Roger Moore and Sean Connery did that many times in their films in their own way, and so did Dalton (although he arguably didn't need to because his visage was intimidating enough). That is a key requirement for a good Bond actor in my mind. Understated subtlety, with an innate ability to convey tons with just with a look.

    Maybe that's for the controversial thread but I never found Dalton menacing as Bond. I thought he was far more threatening (and charming for that matter) in The Rocketeer.
    I always feel like he could snap at any moment. There's something a bit unhinged about him imho (and I mean that in a good way). I've not seen The Rocketeer.

    Maybe because he got beaten up in that bar brawl but I never thought he looked like he could measure up to his adversaries physically.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Ludovico wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    True. One of Craig's best scenes in CR is when he witnesses Vesper in the shower. Another one is in the PTS with Dryden. Roger Moore and Sean Connery did that many times in their films in their own way, and so did Dalton (although he arguably didn't need to because his visage was intimidating enough). That is a key requirement for a good Bond actor in my mind. Understated subtlety, with an innate ability to convey tons with just with a look.

    Maybe that's for the controversial thread but I never found Dalton menacing as Bond. I thought he was far more threatening (and charming for that matter) in The Rocketeer.
    I always feel like he could snap at any moment. There's something a bit unhinged about him imho (and I mean that in a good way). I've not seen The Rocketeer.

    Maybe because he got beaten up in that bar brawl but I never thought he looked like he could measure up to his adversaries physically.
    That's a good point actually and I can understand where you're coming from. That fight is one of the worst in the series (folks have a go at Rog, but in my opinion his fights were significantly better than that farce, with the AVTAK barn shambles being an exception perhaps).
  • Posts: 15,111
    But at least Moore Bond came out mostly with the upper hand, however unlikely or unconvincing he was as a fighter. Dalton gets beaten up or struggles so much one has to wonder if it only needs to be a cracking shot to become a Double 0.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    I think their point was that Dalton-Bond was more human and not a superhero-- that he could get hurt, and his life was truly in danger on assignment.

    I didn't mind Dalton-Bond's fights (didn't love them either), minus the bar brawl (this must be my least favourite of the series).

    It's a shame about Moore. His fight scene in Saida's dressing room in TMWTGG showed a man of intimidating size. I would have liked for them to play up on this element: RM wouldn't have had to move around a lot like a Lazenby or Connery, but when he did, they could have played off his imposing height and width.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    The reason I've always enjoyed the Roger Moore fights (outside of AVTAK's barn encounter) was precisely because he did come across as an everyman. A wearied agent who wasn't superhuman and who seemed physically outmatched many times, but still was able to overcome his opponents, usually with a bit of smarts. It sort of matched the manner in which he played the character, and even though his age was never acknowledged in the films, it all sort of fit nicely.

    As I said on the MI thread, I feel that Tom Cruise adopted this approach recently for MI:RN and it works for him for exactly the same reason. He's aging and we see it in the weariness he brings to the fights. No more the young whippersnapper of MI:2.
  • Posts: 15,111
    I understand Dalton Bond was not a superhero but as a Double 0 surely he should be an elite, or at least a capable fighter with far above average skills. I think making him overall weak in hand to hand combat hurt his tenure and his popularity. Brosnan was not a plausible fighter but he came off as a winner nevertheless.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,249
    Funny thing about the Timothy's barfight is that it takes me right out of the movie. Carey overplays it and worst of all that big indian guy with the happy face is in there whom I knew of the A-team and/ or McGuyver an/or airwolf. Whichever it was. He's a fun person but not much of an actor and certainly no Bond-film material.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    I wouldn't disagree with anything you said @Ludovico; these two Bonds do kind of scrape the barrel when it comes to physicality.

    I was watching the Alec vs Bond fight the other day, and, Christ, Sean Bean looked f****** fierce! That's a man who knows how to fight.

    And although this is indeed Brosnan's best scrap of the series, he does look choreographed, like his moves are step-by-step; Bean looks like he's "unleashing" his combat skills.

  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    and, yes @CommanderRoss, the bar-fight scene, even for the time, was terrible. By '89 we were getting great action from Batman and LW 1&2, DH, and Indy.... LTK didn't break the mold with the bar scene... However, that tanker truck finale was beautiful.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,205
    Blame or credit for an effective fight sequence falls more on the Director and fight choreographer. Put Rog or Tm in the hands of the CR crew and they would look great.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    talos7 wrote: »
    Blame or credit for an effective fight sequence falls more on the Director and fight choreographer. Put Rog or Tm in the hands of the CR crew and they would look great.
    Agreed. The CR & GE fights are some of the best in the series.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    talos7 wrote: »
    Blame or credit for an effective fight sequence falls more on the Director and fight choreographer. Put Rog or Tm in the hands of the CR crew and they would look great.

    I very much doubt that. You need some physicality from the actor somewhere along the line and Moore in particular just wasn't very adept at selling that stuff on screen. He was a lover Bond, not a fighter. Not that I hold it against him.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2018 Posts: 23,883
    I personally was quite satisfied with Moore's encounters at Kananga's lair, at Saida's quarters, at the pyramids and with Chang. Certainly not close to Connery level but as I said earlier, more than adequate for me given his age and in line with his portrayal.

    Severe brutality is not a requirement for me for a decent and enjoyable fight,
  • Posts: 15,111
    peter wrote: »
    I wouldn't disagree with anything you said @Ludovico; these two Bonds do kind of scrape the barrel when it comes to physicality.

    I was watching the Alec vs Bond fight the other day, and, Christ, Sean Bean looked f****** fierce! That's a man who knows how to fight.

    And although this is indeed Brosnan's best scrap of the series, he does look choreographed, like his moves are step-by-step; Bean looks like he's "unleashing" his combat skills.

    Sean Bean can do no wrong like my mother-in-law says. He's the one who sells that fight. Talking of GE what happened to Trevelyan's scar at the end?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I was always under the impression that Trevalyn was more feral because he actually hated Bond and wanted to kill him in a most painful manner. He had something to prove. Bond was merely defending himself for the most part. So I thought that was all intentional.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Yes @Ludovico: he sells this one-on-one with a naturalness; yes he’s fierce, and yes, he’s trying to kill Bond in the most painful of ways as @bondjames said, BUT, the actor was always in control and made it look completely natural.

    Brosnan, the actor, looked as if he was going through what they trained for in rehearsals. He doesn’t flow with the combat. Not the way Bean does. Not by a long shot.

    What’s more disappointing is to see how generic Brosnan-Bond became in his fight sequences. The training that they were trying to convey in GE never made a comeback.

    The same disappointment could be said for DC to a degree; with Mendes came a more stylized way of fighting that took a step away from DC-reality; both fights with Patrice (although I loved them) weren’t as grounded as what we saw in his first two films (the less said about the casino fight, the better).

    This is why I didn’t love the Hinx battle as much as I was hoping. Even if Bond was on the losing end of this battle, I was hoping to see him lose while using his unarmed combat training (instead of just throwing punches and hopping up on a bar to swing a kick— seemed very Moore’ish in parts). I wasn’t necessarily in fear for Bond’s life as I was in the stairwell fight or the excellent Slate punch-up...

    And what’s this about a missing scar??
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2018 Posts: 23,883
    While I like the GE fight very much (top five) I agree that it does have an over-choreographed 'stop' 'start' feel to it at times and I also agree with @peter that Brosnan does appear a bit rehearsed. He comes across a bit effete to me in that encounter (partly because of his thin frame too) while Bean is all masculine aggression.

    It's only with the printing factory fight in TND that I realized it would be difficult for him to be really effective in a fight scene. He just couldn't throw a punch credibly imho. To quote him, he didn't "put his back into it".
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    That was a very nice set-up in the printing factory, and then the fight started...

    I don't know why films do this: they introduce something about the character through action (Brosnan/Craig's unarmed combat training; Martin Riggs' martial arts), only to drop the trait in subsequent films (and usually they don't replace it with something better).
  • Posts: 16,153
    bondjames wrote: »
    While I like the GE fight very much (top five) I agree that it does have an over-choreographed 'stop' 'start' feel to it at times and I also agree with @peter that Brosnan does appear a bit rehearsed. He comes across a bit effete to me in that encounter (partly because of his thin frame too) while Bean is all masculine aggression.

    It's only with the printing factory fight in TND that I realized it would be difficult for him to be really effective in a fight scene. He just couldn't throw a punch credibly imho. To quote him, he didn't "put his back into it".

    His added bulk in DAD helped in that department I thought. To bad there wasn't really a more solid fisticuffs sequence in that film along the lines of the Sean Bean fight.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Yes, @ToTheRight, he was quite a bit bigger in DAD, but, if I remember correctly (I haven't seen the film in a very long, long time), when he's in the clinic, he sucker-punches a man (so he can put him in a wheelchair and scope out the clinic); that punch stands out as being something if really thrown, would do more damage to Brosnan's knuckles/fingers than to his intended target.
  • Posts: 16,153
    peter wrote: »
    Yes, @ToTheRight, he was quite a bit bigger in DAD, but, if I remember correctly (I haven't seen the film in a very long, long time), when he's in the clinic, he sucker-punches a man (so he can put him in a wheelchair and scope out the clinic); that punch stands out as being something if really thrown, would do more damage to Brosnan's knuckles/fingers than to his intended target.

    True. It's almost like a light pop. Connery's punch to the guard as he escapes Palmyra in NSNA would have been more like it.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Yes, Sean knew how to throw his weight behind it (plus he has those big Scottish fists that strike like a hammer!).
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Sean has been a fighter himself and grew up in the worst corners of Glasgow. The man beat up a gang of six hooligans.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    While I like the GE fight very much (top five) I agree that it does have an over-choreographed 'stop' 'start' feel to it at times and I also agree with @peter that Brosnan does appear a bit rehearsed. He comes across a bit effete to me in that encounter (partly because of his thin frame too) while Bean is all masculine aggression.

    It's only with the printing factory fight in TND that I realized it would be difficult for him to be really effective in a fight scene. He just couldn't throw a punch credibly imho. To quote him, he didn't "put his back into it".

    His added bulk in DAD helped in that department I thought. To bad there wasn't really a more solid fisticuffs sequence in that film along the lines of the Sean Bean fight.
    A beer belly isn t an advantage in a fight.
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