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The wink wink, nudge nudge Factor Ratings

chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
edited October 2014 in Bond Movies Posts: 17,804
0 to 5, 5 being near intolerable.

DN- 0
FRWL- 0
GF- 0
TB- 0
YOLT- 0
OHMSS- 1
DAF- 4
LALD- 2
TMWTGG- 3
TSWLM- 2
MR- 4
FYEO- 2
NSNA- 5
OP- 3
AVTAK- 2
TLD- 0
LTK- 0
GE-1
TND-1
TWINE-1
DAD- 1
CR- 0
QOS- 0
SF- 0

This is my take on the WWNN Factor, specifically, the "we know this is just silly, so we'll let the audience know we know it" thing. It is, for my purposes on this thread, a measure of how the character of Bond is written & performed.

Thoughts?

Comments

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited October 2014 Posts: 17,804
    Birdleson wrote: »
    Good idea and pretty fair list, but lets be honest. Even if you love OP, it has more of that stuff (tiger, Tarzan yell, Bond theme being played by Vijay, etc) than any of the rest.
    Agreed, but this is a measure of the Bond character mainly, and in the case of OP he's written & played fairly straight compared to other films IMH(& possibly mistaken)O.
    ;)
  • boldfingerboldfinger
    Posts: 5,767
    0 to 5, 5 being near intolerable.

    DN- 0
    FRWL- 0
    GF- 0
    TB- 0
    YOLT- 0
    OHMSS- 1
    DAF- 2
    LALD- 2
    TMWTGG- 1
    TSWLM- 2
    MR- 1
    FYEO- 1
    NSNA- 5
    OP- 1
    AVTAK- 0
    TLD- 0
    LTK- 0
    GE-1
    TND-1
    TWINE-1
    DAD- 1
    CR- 0
    QOS- 0
    SF- 0


    I have to agree to NSNA, but with all the rest, I seem to be pretty complacent as it seems.
    I can´t rate TMWTGG so winky-nudgy, because Moore does such a leap in owning the role from LALD.
    And MR, while being silly as it can get, is brilliant. Every look of Moore in that film is pure genius.
    In NSNA, the way Bond is written and performed is a major reason for me to largely avoid that film.
    The Brosnans are tough to rate, because Bond was written and performed both more self-conscious and serious at the same time.

  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    edited October 2014 Posts: 13,978
    Viljay playing the Bond theme in Octopussy, makes is no more out of place than Bond now owning the DB5 from Goldfinger (which isn't the same DB5 that he won in Casino Royale), in Skyfall.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Birdleson wrote: »
    MajorDSmythe wrote: »
    Viljay playing the Bond theme in Octopussy, makes is no more out of place than Bond now owning the DB5 from Goldfinger (which isn't the same DB5 that he won in Casino Royale), in Skyfall.

    I disagree. One (SF) is a continuity issue. Yes, it's fan service, but it doesn't brake the fourth wall. The mentioned scene from OP is flat out farcical. It is a blatant move at putting Bond in league with the audience. He obviously recognizes the tune as his own theme song, and his face conveys the absurdity even he sees i the situation.

    Continuity issue? You make it sound as though they had the car from Casino Royale, but they were 1 digit out on the number plate. The Db5 is worse than Vijay playing the Bond them, at least he only plays about 5 seconds of it.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    Birdleson wrote: »
    It's like getting bent that Blofeld doesn't recognize Bond in ONHMSS. SKYFALL works within itself, that's enough for me. OP is full of overblown slapstick.
    Again, agreed, but this has little to do with Bond himself...


  • boldfingerboldfinger
    edited October 2014 Posts: 5,767
    Birdleson wrote: »
    MajorDSmythe wrote: »
    Viljay playing the Bond theme in Octopussy, makes is no more out of place than Bond now owning the DB5 from Goldfinger (which isn't the same DB5 that he won in Casino Royale), in Skyfall.

    I disagree. One (SF) is a continuity issue. Yes, it's fan service, but it doesn't brake the fourth wall. The mentioned scene from OP is flat out farcical. It is a blatant move at putting Bond in league with the audience. He obviously recognizes the tune as his own theme song, and his face conveys the absurdity even he sees i the situation.
    Modern Bond films waving the DB5 in the audience´s face as if saying, "look, this a Bond film, cause we have the Bond mobile", after Bond films being proper Bond films without a DB5 for 30 years is in no way related to continuity and could well be called flat out farcical. And for me as a fan it´s not a service, more like an insult.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    boldfinger wrote: »
    And for me as a fan it´s not a service, more like an insult.
    Nah, "Here's to us" is the biggest insult I can think of...

    :))
  • Some_Kind_Of_HeroSome_Kind_Of_Hero
    edited October 2014 Posts: 6,844
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    MajorDSmythe wrote: »
    Viljay playing the Bond theme in Octopussy, makes is no more out of place than Bond now owning the DB5 from Goldfinger (which isn't the same DB5 that he won in Casino Royale), in Skyfall.

    I disagree. One (SF) is a continuity issue. Yes, it's fan service, but it doesn't brake the fourth wall. The mentioned scene from OP is flat out farcical. It is a blatant move at putting Bond in league with the audience. He obviously recognizes the tune as his own theme song, and his face conveys the absurdity even he sees i the situation.
    Modern Bond films waving the DB5 in the audience´s face as if saying, "look, this a Bond film, cause we have the Bond mobile", after Bond films being proper Bond films without a DB5 for 30 years is in no way related to continuity and could well be called flat out farcical. And for me as a fan it´s not a service, more like an insult.

    Agreed. Sort of. I actually don't mind the DB5 being featured briefly as Bond's recreational vehicle in GoldenEye and Tomorrow Never Dies—those were subtle and unobtrusive enough tributes to the series' legacy. Bond winning himself an Aston Martin from a villain in a poker game in Casino Royale was beginning to push it a bit in terms of brandishing the DB5 before the audience as a symbol of James Bond's James Bondishness. Still I went along with it as part of the "Bond Begins" approach.

    But what really kills it for me is the shoehorned, metafictional "homage" scene in Skyfall with Judi Dench and Daniel Craig joking about the DB5's ejector seat as if they had both lived through Goldfinger themselves. Just the biggest fourth wall breaking WTF imaginable ("fourth wall breaking" in terms of the characters acknowledging that they are in fact fictional characters)—and that the scene appears pivotally right between the second and third acts of this otherwise ostensibly grounded film is even more mind-boggling. Yet Mendes loves the scene (it was his idea after all) and claims audiences applauded it. The man is obviously a talented filmmaker, but that's the sort of thing that worries me about how he views the series and what he thinks should be done with it. As you say, @boldfinger, it's a service for the masses with only a cursory knowledge of / appreciation for the James Bond films, and "more like an insult" for the fans.
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,731
    Moonraker needs a big fat whopping 5, mate.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    AceHole wrote: »
    Moonraker needs a big fat whopping 5, mate.
    I felt there were some really good moments, and Rog was pretty good, so I couldn't bring myself to give it a total fail.
    ;)
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    edited October 2014 Posts: 1,731
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AceHole wrote: »
    Moonraker needs a big fat whopping 5, mate.
    I felt there were some really good moments, and Rog was pretty good, so I couldn't bring myself to give it a total fail.
    ;)

    Plenty of good moments, I still enjoy it and it's nowhere near as bad as many make it out to be - but when it comes to 'winking at the audience because Rog' is being silly' it's right up there :D
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