It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
^ Back to Top
The MI6 Community is unofficial and in no way associated or linked with EON Productions, MGM, Sony Pictures, Activision or Ian Fleming Publications. Any views expressed on this website are of the individual members and do not necessarily reflect those of the Community owners. Any video or images displayed in topics on MI6 Community are embedded by users from third party sites and as such MI6 Community and its owners take no responsibility for this material.
James Bond News • James Bond Articles • James Bond Magazine
Comments
Oh well, anything to shoot down Brosnan. :-\"
The characters are cartoon like and Bean is, IMO, amongst the worst villains in the series. Brosnan's performance is typically weak, unfocused and tonally inconsistent.
And the score. Well the score is hands down the worst in the series. Music is so important to Bond. I have never understood how so many people can just overlook how appalling the GE score is and still claim it's a top ten movie.
I am not a fan of any of the Brosnan films. They are pretty much the bottom four in the series for me, but I do actually think TND is far and away the best of them. Or perhaps least bad is most appropriate. Wai Lin raises the tone IMO. She and Brosnan make a good pairing. Arnold's score is fresh and different. Not a classic score but a massive improvement on Serra.
And like others have said, GE still had an 80s look and feel, whereas parts of TND have a slick style to them that is occasionally reminiscent of the 60s Bonds.
The plane jump at the start of GE is one of the most embarrassing sequences in the history of film, not just Bond. Almost as bad as the kite surfing IMO. Totally utterly implausible/ impossible and an insult to TSWLM, which it clearly apes.
Brosnan's first appearance on screen in GE, hanging upside down in a toilet cubicle, like some over enthusiastic cottager, sort of sums up the tone of his tenure for me.
TND has a dreadful ending and really flags towards the end, but overall it is definitely the best of the Brosnan era, and the only one I might actually consider rewatching.
Like anything else in the movies, it's not about reality anyway- it's about making it LOOK real, and sadly the GE fall failed as badly as Kirk's rock face fall in Star Trek V. :))
Which happens if you start relying more on CGI than the real stuff, a message Tom Cruise and his MI franchise of recent have understood better than EON.
Camera filter, FX shot, whatever, it doesn't look good. I don't give a crap about what technique they used, I didn't write anything about it, I don't know anything about... I'm just saying it looks fake, which should be pretty obvious for anyone with a human eye. If that is the result of a 'camera filter' of some sorts, I am so glad they don't film it like that nowadays…
And what has it got to do with Brosnan? Or are you saying that Brosnan did the cinematography on Goldeneye too? If that's the case, well I am hugely impressed! :) Starring and filming at the same time! Wow! What more did he do? Script, location scouting, production design, stunt coordination, special effects? I guess Brosnan did everything didn't he, and that he in reality is responsible for every element in the film, both good and bad…?
I'm not sure what you're getting at here...? Martin Campbell is a far better Bond director than Spottiswoode, the action in GoldenEye is perhaps the best in the series, and the cinematography is more evocative.
Not sure why I'm being made fun of for those opinions honestly.
Yeah, its interesting… First he makes fun of you for praising the cinematography, then he makes fun of me for criticizing it. :-? Seems like he's a bit confused to me… :P
That's why they say the likes of "de gustibus non est disputandum".
Wow!
Examples! Let's actually compare the films as opposed to just saying one's better than the other!
Take the tank chase & the motorbike escape... both great vehicle action scenes, but I find the bike escape a bit more thrilling, it's photographed from a greater number of inventive angles, and had great character interaction as a plus. And of course, better music & an explosion at the end (yea). The tank chase was excellent though, and the statue gag was the cherry.
Seriously why do some of you bother? This is a discussion of why people like GoldenEye more than Tomorrow Never Dies. When some of you come in and don't like either film just to say OH THOSE SPECIAL EFFECTS SUCK BOOOOOO!!! Nobody cares anymore. This is beyond a broken record. We get it. You don't like Pierce and his movies. We don't need to be reminded in every single thread about him! MOVE ON ALREADY! Sheesh. ~X(
See you in the hair thread. ;)
I have no hair left! They stripped it from me! Whatever is left of me...whatever I am...I'M BLOFELD! 8-X I really need to stop staying up late...
And what they forget is the Bronson films saved Bond after the lackluster Dalton films which sorry fan boys the majority of the public hated not just because serious but because sub par efforts by the the B team. No if it wasn't for the Bronson films we wouldn't have the Craig films. Granted the Craig films are far better... and yes you could argue another actor could have replaced Dalton and we have still gotten to this point. But alot of folks were rooting for Pierce to be Bond and the films were more popular and made Bond cool again.
In TND when he says we'll finish this together, everyone in the audience groaned.
:)) Thanks.
What's this in reference to?
No, cry me a river...
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that TND is better from an action direction standpoint. The PTS, the BMW, & the bike chase are far superior to anything in GE, including the comedic tank chase.
The hand to hand combat however was not comparable - GE is far superior. Compare 006/007 fisticuffs to the nonsensical fight in the Carver press factory for instance or the fight in the soundproof room in Hamburg. One is visceral and close.....you feel it. The others are almost childlike in comparison.
Yes, GE uses poor models in some pretty obvious areas. Yes it uses a very visible back screen in the PTS. That's because the movie had an absolutely miniscule budget. I'm not sure why that was (bad financial of MGM?) but I know they had next to nothing to make that film compared to the budget for TND. TND is more......but not necessarily better.
Where GE wins in my opinion is in characters. I personaly just love them. Ouromov, Natalya, Boris, Trevalyn, Mishkin....and to a lesser degree Wade & Zukovsky. In fact the only one I disliked from the start was Dench's M, so you can imagine my relief when she was recently dispatched...., I feel the same way about SF (with the exception of the new MP who I don't really like....let's see what they do with her character going forward). SF & GE are similar in that the characterizations work for me. Less so in TND (although it's still not bad compared to Brosnan's last 2 outings).
Where GE wins in another way for me is in the sort of romantic, old school impression it gave me.....like an old shoe.....there were memories of Moore from TSWLM at the start (back screen projector & implausibility notwithstanding....let's not forget the amazing opening jump!), Connery from GF in the DB5/Ferrari chase, Dalton from TLD in the Russian settings....and of course it had a bit of a throwback to the cold war feel with 006's backstory. TND seemed very modern, very high tech, but lost me since it did not have any quiet romanticism in its cinematography (unlike the similarly modern for its time TSWLM for instance, that took time to be somewhat old school romantic & cinematic during the Egyptian scenes that were absolutely stunning). So TND just came across too high tech for me.
As said before loved Natalya. She was a throwback for me to the brainy yet feminine Euro babes of the 60's with the funny accents. Loved it.... especially after the generic North American trying too hard to be Bond's equal/South American bimbo pair in LTK. Much better too than the action babe from TND in my mind.....and Miss Lois & Clark.
Finally, I liked Serra's score quite a lot. Particularly the Goldeneye Overture and Little Surprise for You. Both modern and industrial sounding. I preferred this to Arnold's TND score, although TND was one of his better efforts IMO.
So that's my view on the GE vs TND debate. They're both very good Brosnan efforts.
The friends I went to see GE with loved it, as did the audience.
Where did you see it?
GE was very well received in 1995. Nearly everyone at my work place was talking about it when it came out. Bond was back. Accept no substitutes
The motorcycle chase in TND is better than the motorcycle escape in GE, I'll give you that. What GE has though are much better hand to hand fight scenes and a better climax (I like the climax in TND but the machine gun fire bits get a little repetitive after awhile. GE's is fresher and builds to the climactic fist fight). In terms of pure action the two films are very even (I rank both in the top 5 or so of the series as far as action goes).
I think that aside from that however GE has it beaten (and even the action sequences it may squeeze by. I dunno, it's pretty close). Even as a Carver defender I still am of the opinion that 006 is a better main villain. In terms of henchmen it isn't even close (then again, see my username, I am quite bias).
It is Campbell's direction that really pushes it past. It has that post-Cold War industrial murky atmosphere, Bond's relevance comes into question, there's an energy to the film, and the dynamic between Bond and Natalya is BY FAR the best of the Brosnan era.
I like Wai Lin (I'm a TND supporter. Mid-tier Bond film for me) but Natalya is one of the best Bond girls in the entire series, both on paper and on screen.
I'm not sure if I've given enough reasons WHY I think GE is better. I was only questioning why you, someone I've corresponded with for awhile on this site, was mocking my opinions.
This isn't a thread about Cinematography and special effects. It's about why you like one over the other. But no It had to be turned into another Brosnan film nitpick thread. I don't need to cry thank you. I have no more tears to shed. 8-|