FRWL Observation Relating to Broz

2

Comments

  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Even Lazenby bad his own swagger and Brosnan (bless him) couldn't run (I mean he looked silly doing it)!
  • edited April 2015 Posts: 11,425
    AceHole wrote: »
    AceHole wrote: »
    Connery's 'mannerisms', if he had any, flowed from a concept (of the character's persona) – they were not studied or pre-planned gestures, they were part of the inherent movement of the 007 persona he created on screen, and ad-libbed.


    To expand slightly: everything about Connery’s physical acting flowed from the concept of a strong, commanding alpha - the one in control and supremely confident.

    The cheeky, irreverent grins ; his calm but always deliberate & decisive movements, none of which were wasted, were his basis of the character.
    Watch his performances closely (DN & FRWL in particular) and you will see that he NEVER wastes any movement. Every movement is intended, every aspect of his kinetic acting has a pre-destined purpose. He is never hurried. His movement is always deliberate, based on the assumption that he is in control. Always the dominant player…
    Except for a few scenes with M, where his demeanor is more that of a reluctant, rather obnoxious student who respects his mentor but does not accept his lower pecking order.

    Sean was a hypnotic actor not because of his line delivery or ‘method’, à la De Niro (the things most people associate with good actors) – but because he was simply the best physical actor of his generation.
    THAT’s why he could never be surpassed as James Bond. Because 007 is an inherently physical role. He never waxes lyrical. He just… DOES.

    Brilliantly put. So so true.

    Connery personifies the idea that action is actually character in the best possible way. He conveys so much about the character just by the way he moves. Brilliant.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Seconded.
  • edited April 2015 Posts: 11,189
    Connery had the advantage (in the beginning) of not realising just how popular the film series would eventually be. True the books were very popular but how often does a film series translate THAT successfully onscreen? The answer is not all that much.

    Hence he was not intimidated by the legacy the series would go on to have and it could be a reason why he seemed so casual in the films.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Even Lazenby bad his own swagger and Brosnan (bless him) couldn't run (I mean he looked silly doing it)!

    And so did Roger Moore of course but it never stopped him trying! :D
  • Posts: 11,189
    Craig sometimes looks silly running.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Craig sometimes looks silly running.

    Don't we all (mostly)!
  • Posts: 3,327
    Pierce is often maligned for his little tie-straightening tic. Fair enough. If you dislike it, you dislike it. However, whilst watching FRWL last night, I noticed that, after Bond polishes off Red Grant, he--yes he does!--straightens his tie. Just thought I'd mention it.

    And? Is this thread for real?

    When Connery straightened his tie, we were only the 2nd Bond film in, with no tie-straightening gone before it, so it wasn't meant to be a nod to anything.

    Plus, the scene wasn't forced. Bond just got into a deadly scrap, killed Grant, and then straightened himself up afterwards. It wasn't forced, or cheesy, and didn't happen in the middle of a tank scene, or underwater, and wasn't accompanied by any comedy music cues. It was all played out in a very serious manner.
  • Posts: 11,189
    (It doesn't happen in the middle of the tank chase. It happens at the end.)
  • Posts: 11,189
    (Sorry for nit-picking).
  • Posts: 2,483
    Pierce is often maligned for his little tie-straightening tic. Fair enough. If you dislike it, you dislike it. However, whilst watching FRWL last night, I noticed that, after Bond polishes off Red Grant, he--yes he does!--straightens his tie. Just thought I'd mention it.

    And? Is this thread for real?

    When Connery straightened his tie, we were only the 2nd Bond film in, with no tie-straightening gone before it, so it wasn't meant to be a nod to anything.

    Plus, the scene wasn't forced. Bond just got into a deadly scrap, killed Grant, and then straightened himself up afterwards. It wasn't forced, or cheesy, and didn't happen in the middle of a tank scene, or underwater, and wasn't accompanied by any comedy music cues. It was all played out in a very serious manner.

    Pierce's instantiations weren't a nod to anything; they were intended as a Broznian trademark. And all instances throughout the series--including DC's cuff straightening--were intended to highlight the importance Bond places on personal aesthetics, and that looking good, even in the most bizarre, dangerous and chaotic of circumstances, was the essence of cool. You may not like Broz's delivery or its contexts, but all of these things are of a piece.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2015 Posts: 23,883
    Pierce is often maligned for his little tie-straightening tic. Fair enough. If you dislike it, you dislike it. However, whilst watching FRWL last night, I noticed that, after Bond polishes off Red Grant, he--yes he does!--straightens his tie. Just thought I'd mention it.

    And? Is this thread for real?

    When Connery straightened his tie, we were only the 2nd Bond film in, with no tie-straightening gone before it, so it wasn't meant to be a nod to anything.

    Plus, the scene wasn't forced. Bond just got into a deadly scrap, killed Grant, and then straightened himself up afterwards. It wasn't forced, or cheesy, and didn't happen in the middle of a tank scene, or underwater, and wasn't accompanied by any comedy music cues. It was all played out in a very serious manner.

    I tend to agree with you. The FRWL scene was natural and not a nod or a silly trademark. It fit the scene perfectly. So did one of the best tie straightening scenes in the series, which ironically, was done by a villain. Namely, Georgi Koskov, when hearing that Kara had found him (I think it happened shortly after the scene below bu I could be wrong - we did not know who is on the line, but his discomfort was evident in the tie straightening and look on his face):

    general-georgi-koskov.jpg

    Brosnan's tie straightening was stupid imho because it was done underwater & therefore seemed (at least to me) to be something which appeared unnatural and forced. Craig's cuff straightening is almost as bad because he had just been shot while in the crane and once again, the act seemed unnatural and 'played for the cameras' compared to Connery's actions in FRWL or Georgi's in TLD.
  • edited April 2015 Posts: 11,425
    What do you mean? after getting shot with a depleted uranium bullet the first thing I always do is check my cuffs are okay.

    What @bondjames and others are highlighting is the poor conceptualisation of the character that we've been seeing for a long time - poor attention to detail. Correct me if I'm wrong but they used to discuss Bond's behaviour and actions with military types to get an idea of how someone with a Navy background would act. It probably helped that in the early days a lot of the crew had military experience. Straightening ties and popping cuffs doesn't cut it - it makes Bond look like a City trader about to strike a big deal. It looks vain and a bit silly.

    I do think Connery conveyed a believable military bearing. Craig does as well, albeit more squaddie than RN Commander. I'd prefer it if they left out things like the cuff popping though - really hope it doesn't appear in SP.
  • Posts: 11,189
    Half the stuff we see in Bond isn't exactly realistic or "natural". Who would really say"he had lots of guts" or "he's branched off" after seeing someone being killed?
  • Posts: 15,125
    I actually really enjoyed the cuff links adjustment in SF and the tie straightening in GE. It's in TWINE that it is rubbish: underwater it looks utterly force.
  • Posts: 11,189
    ...or "he got the point".

    These lines are invented to amuse the audience.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    Getafix wrote: »
    What do you mean? after getting shot with a depleted uranium bullet the first thing I always do is check my cuffs are okay.

    What @bondjames and others are highlighting is the poor conceptualisation of the character that we've been seeing for a long time - poor attention to detail. Correct me if I'm wrong but they used to discuss Bond's behaviour and actions with military types to get an idea of how someone with a Navy background would act. It probably helped that in the early days a lot of the crew had military experience. Straightening ties and popping cuffs doesn't cut it - it makes Bond look like a City trader about to strike a big deal. It looks vain and a bit silly.

    I do think Connery conveyed a believable military bearing. Craig does as well, albeit more squaddie than RN Commander. I'd prefer it if they left out things like the cuff popping though - really hope it doesn't appear in SP.

    Roger Moore also had military training for the record.
  • Posts: 11,425
    Dragonpol wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    What do you mean? after getting shot with a depleted uranium bullet the first thing I always do is check my cuffs are okay.

    What @bondjames and others are highlighting is the poor conceptualisation of the character that we've been seeing for a long time - poor attention to detail. Correct me if I'm wrong but they used to discuss Bond's behaviour and actions with military types to get an idea of how someone with a Navy background would act. It probably helped that in the early days a lot of the crew had military experience. Straightening ties and popping cuffs doesn't cut it - it makes Bond look like a City trader about to strike a big deal. It looks vain and a bit silly.

    I do think Connery conveyed a believable military bearing. Craig does as well, albeit more squaddie than RN Commander. I'd prefer it if they left out things like the cuff popping though - really hope it doesn't appear in SP.

    Roger Moore also had military training for the record.

    National Service?
  • Posts: 11,425
    I believe Dalton's father was with special forces during WW2, so may be a bit of that rubbed off?
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    Getafix wrote: »
    Dragonpol wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    What do you mean? after getting shot with a depleted uranium bullet the first thing I always do is check my cuffs are okay.

    What @bondjames and others are highlighting is the poor conceptualisation of the character that we've been seeing for a long time - poor attention to detail. Correct me if I'm wrong but they used to discuss Bond's behaviour and actions with military types to get an idea of how someone with a Navy background would act. It probably helped that in the early days a lot of the crew had military experience. Straightening ties and popping cuffs doesn't cut it - it makes Bond look like a City trader about to strike a big deal. It looks vain and a bit silly.

    I do think Connery conveyed a believable military bearing. Craig does as well, albeit more squaddie than RN Commander. I'd prefer it if they left out things like the cuff popping though - really hope it doesn't appear in SP.

    Roger Moore also had military training for the record.

    National Service?

    Yes, and he was stationed in West Germany after the war.
  • Posts: 2,483
    Getafix wrote: »
    What do you mean? after getting shot with a depleted uranium bullet the first thing I always do is check my cuffs are okay.

    What @bondjames and others are highlighting is the poor conceptualisation of the character that we've been seeing for a long time - poor attention to detail. Correct me if I'm wrong but they used to discuss Bond's behaviour and actions with military types to get an idea of how someone with a Navy background would act. It probably helped that in the early days a lot of the crew had military experience. Straightening ties and popping cuffs doesn't cut it - it makes Bond look like a City trader about to strike a big deal. It looks vain and a bit silly.

    I do think Connery conveyed a believable military bearing. Craig does as well, albeit more squaddie than RN Commander. I'd prefer it if they left out things like the cuff popping though - really hope it doesn't appear in SP.

    Vanity is a wildly underrated trait. Indeed, certain cretins would term it a flaw. At any rate, I suspect many Bond fans do not appreciate the importance of aesthetics to the films. Indeed, I would go so far as to say Bondian aesthetics, and Bond's aesthetic sensibilities, are the most important aspects of the films' unicity, and their success.

  • Posts: 2,483
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Half the stuff we see in Bond isn't exactly realistic or "natural". Who would really say"he had lots of guts" or "he's branched off" after seeing someone being killed?

    Indeed. If realism is your bag, I cannot understand why you'd be a Bond fan. Bond is about escapism, spectacle and outrageousness, not gritty, workaday realism. Even DC's Bond hardly qualifies as realistic.

  • Posts: 11,425
    Getafix wrote: »
    What do you mean? after getting shot with a depleted uranium bullet the first thing I always do is check my cuffs are okay.

    What @bondjames and others are highlighting is the poor conceptualisation of the character that we've been seeing for a long time - poor attention to detail. Correct me if I'm wrong but they used to discuss Bond's behaviour and actions with military types to get an idea of how someone with a Navy background would act. It probably helped that in the early days a lot of the crew had military experience. Straightening ties and popping cuffs doesn't cut it - it makes Bond look like a City trader about to strike a big deal. It looks vain and a bit silly.

    I do think Connery conveyed a believable military bearing. Craig does as well, albeit more squaddie than RN Commander. I'd prefer it if they left out things like the cuff popping though - really hope it doesn't appear in SP.

    Vanity is a wildly underrated trait. Indeed, certain cretins would term it a flaw. At any rate, I suspect many Bond fans do not appreciate the importance of aesthetics to the films. Indeed, I would go so far as to say Bondian aesthetics, and Bond's aesthetic sensibilities, are the most important aspects of the films' unicity, and their success.

    The production design and look of the films is one of the things I've always particularly loved, so you're barking up the wrong tree on this one.

    Any way, what I'm talking about is Bond's character not the look of the films. I accept that Bond may perhaps actually be vain. He certainly cares a lot about his appearance, clothes etc. But not appearing vain is something I think Bond would take great steps to ensure.
  • Posts: 2,483
    I dunno. I'm loath to quote TWINE, but Bond does burble out, "I take pleasure in great beauty." Bond bitches at Vesper about her choosing him a tailored tux, and then examines himself minutely in the mirror. In QOS he bails on Fields' hotel choice, saying "I'd sooner stay in a morgue." and then picks out the swankiest hotel in all Bolivia. I'm sure I could multiply these examples at least five-fold. The point being that Bond hardly hides his borderline obsession with aesthetics. He is simultaneously flamboyant and exceptionally masculine, which is one of the things that makes the character so interesting.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2015 Posts: 23,883
    I dunno. I'm loath to quote TWINE, but Bond does burble out, "I take pleasure in great beauty." Bond bitches at Vesper about her choosing him a tailored tux, and then examines himself minutely in the mirror. In QOS he bails on Fields' hotel choice, saying "I'd sooner stay in a morgue." and then picks out the swankiest hotel in all Bolivia. I'm sure I could multiply these examples at least five-fold. The point being that Bond hardly hides his borderline obsession with aesthetics. He is simultaneously flamboyant and exceptionally masculine, which is one of the things that makes the character so interesting.

    Good examples and your points about flamboyance and masculinity are well taken.

    Having said that, from my humble perspective, adjusting one's tie underwater when chasing a shooter or adjusting one's cuffs after having been shot with a high powered machine gun just seem like lazy filmakers taking the whole thing one step too far and closer to Austin Powers or Iron Man than James Bond.

    Keeping relatively calm and collected while sitting naked & tied to a bottomless chair as some guy tries to remove elements of your manhood with nothing but a simple rope - now that is a good example of James Bond bravado while under pressure.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2015 Posts: 23,883
    double post
  • I once saw a documentary on body language... mostly hogwash, I must say... but it did show how every time HRH Prince Charles arrives somewhere very public he does a routine cuff-link and pocket flap check as a kind of nervous tic until he returns to his comfort zone. When I first saw Skyfall that was what popped into my head at that moment and that's what I always took these traits to be, not a conscious action.
    Agreed the TWINE one is silly.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    People seriously have a problem with Brosnan and his tie-straightening? Seriously? I look at all the problems in the Brosnan era - DAD and the horrible CGI and overuse of gadgets, TWINE and the poor villains and crap Bond girl, TND and its by-the-numbers approach - and the tie-straightening is the least of the Brosnan era's problems. Nitpicking the tie-straightening is like amputating the dog's leg after you've shot it in the head.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Now what if Connery had straightened his tie (maybe checked his cufflinks and combed his hair) during the fight with Grant?
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Craig sometimes looks silly running.

    I think Craigs running is athletic! It looks good!
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