CharlieHebdo

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  • Posts: 15,124
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Brainwashing works like a charm, and Abrahamic religions are dualistic-you can use it to whatever cause you choose.

    Anything good done in the name of Islam would have been done anyway in the name of regular human decency. The countless gruesome attrocities perpetually committed in the name of Islam, is due to mostly one thing-Islam.

    So what is the conclusion?

    Errr ban religion?
    No. Ridicule it. Make it a joke. Make it socially questionable to believe in fairies. Put it in peoples faces 24/7 that religiosity is a childish state of mind & that magical thinking is for toddlers.

    Amen, if I may say so, to that.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    now science can explain that everything was cause and effect from the Big Bang onwards. OK we can't explain what triggered the Big Bang yet so if you want to call that 'God' feel free but once 'he' had lit the fuse he retreated to a safe distance and we were left on our own so what exactly are you worshipping there? A cosmic zippo lighter?
    Sonisall & I are :)) =))
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    The bottom line is: What deserves more respect-freedom of expression or sharia law?
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    Posts: 1,261
    A user on FB remarked, he would have preferred for them terrorists to be arrested alive and then have them caricatures tattoed on their bodies. And how about them arrive in their "paradise" or whatever, onyl to be told: Virgin? What virgins? There are no virgins waiting for you. Sorry, mates, somebody fooled you. Okay, this might be called satiremode. Not my ideas, though.
  • edited January 2015 Posts: 15,124
    A user on FB remarked, he would have preferred for them terrorists to be arrested alive and then have them caricatures tattoed on their bodies. And how about them arrive in their "paradise" or whatever, onyl to be told: Virgin? What virgins? There are no virgins waiting for you. Sorry, mates, somebody fooled you. Okay, this might be called satiremode. Not my ideas, though.

    They can't do that, it would be considered inhuman treatment. Because, you know, that is really awful and wrong. I joke, I joke, but some comments blaming the victims I read online are appalling.

    And I am watching the news, it says the girlfriend of one of the gunmen may have fled the country and be in Syria. Depressing. Although now that she is free she can watch TV all she wants and see the caricatures of her beloved Mohammed everywhere.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    Ludovico wrote: »
    some comments blaming the victims I read online are appalling.
    Agreed. Nothing excuses or even adequately explains gunning down unarmed people who haven't murdered, raped or tortured anyone.
    ~X(
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Only a complete A-hole would blame the victims.
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    Posts: 1,261
    With the girl friend of the third terrorist believed to have been in Turkey way before the killings (according to German TV), the question might be, who was the woman at the super market? Or was that only a mistake at the hands of the media?
  • Posts: 4,617
    much of the information given out was wrong and this was clearly wrong
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    patb wrote: »
    much of the information given out was wrong and this was clearly wrong
    It normally is in these instances. I've seen the same thing in other cases elsewhere. Press jumping the gun again.

  • Posts: 15,124
    DrGorner wrote: »
    Only a complete A-hole would blame the victims.

    I will show you some opinion articles/blog posts if you'd like. They don't say it in so many words, but that is pretty much what they imply. One even says that, while a crime, the murders were not terrorism and compares Hollande to Bush. Hollande to Bush. No joke.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Sad people.
    So someone out shopping, thinking what they'll cook for tea, while
    Keeping their little kid happy. Is somehow to blame for a deranged
    Terrorist with a machine gun killing people.
    Once again sad,sad people.
  • edited January 2015 Posts: 11,425
    Ludovico wrote: »
    A user on FB remarked, he would have preferred for them terrorists to be arrested alive and then have them caricatures tattoed on their bodies. And how about them arrive in their "paradise" or whatever, onyl to be told: Virgin? What virgins? There are no virgins waiting for you. Sorry, mates, somebody fooled you. Okay, this might be called satiremode. Not my ideas, though.

    They can't do that, it would be considered inhuman treatment. Because, you know, that is really awful and wrong. I joke, I joke, but some comments blaming the victims I read online are appalling.

    And I am watching the news, it says the girlfriend of one of the gunmen may have fled the country and be in Syria. Depressing. Although now that she is free she can watch TV all she wants and see the caricatures of her beloved Mohammed everywhere.

    I heard somewhere that the 70 virgins or whatever it is, is possibly a mis-reading of the Koran and that it actually says '70 white raisins'. Imagine their faces...

    http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2006/02/do_raisins_not.php
  • Posts: 15,124
    DrGorner wrote: »
    Sad people.
    So someone out shopping, thinking what they'll cook for tea, while
    Keeping their little kid happy. Is somehow to blame for a deranged
    Terrorist with a machine gun killing people.
    Once again sad,sad people.

    The guy was talking more about Charlie Hebdo's work than the bystanders. Still not an excuse.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I use the basic premise that in the west we have free speech and
    Freedom of expression. This may annoy some politicians but even
    They up hold the principle.
    Sadly those who cannot defend their views with discourse and
    Reasoned argument, always turn to the gun and the bomb. There
    Reasoning is " if we can't persuade you, we'll kill you !"
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I love her, even more.
  • Posts: 1,993
    Much has been written about the reasons young men and women become terrorists.
    Alienation and disenfranchisement are often cited among the reasons. Assuming that to be the case, how are alienation and disenfranchisement assuaged? With these three individuals, what could have been done and whose responsibility was it to fulfill their hopes and dreams and erase their dissatisfactions? Family, friends, society?

    While mining the shock of their acts, the media makes them victims by detailing their lives of disappointment, alienation, and unrealized dreams by providing a context for their actions.

    There is no context, no justification.








  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    True, but many people come from run down areas, yet they still work
    Pay their taxes and get on with life, to try and do better for their kids.
    I do think it is a disgrace that the working people have had to take all
    The cuts to try and dig us out of the hole the Bankers, got the whole
    Western world in to. They have done more damage to us than a terrorist
    Gunman. Yet no arrests of Bankers ?, no cuts to their Bonuses.
    I have no answers but if politicians keep treating the poor of society like
    Something they stepped in, all kinds of trouble is going to emerge.
    Sorry Rant over.
  • KerimKerim Istanbul Not Constantinople
    edited January 2015 Posts: 2,629
    While a very impressive rally is taking place in Paris, a Hamburg tabloid was firebombed for printing the Charlie Hebdo cartoons.

    news.yahoo.com/arson-attack-german-paper-ran-charlie-hebdo-cartoons-065348454.html

    Edit: Also, CNN just reported that a Belgian newspaper received a bomb threat and was evacuated for also printing Charlie Hebdo cartoons.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2015 Posts: 23,883
    I personally feel it was a mistake for Hollande and particularly Netanyahu to attend the rally today. Obviously ,it is not illegal for them to do so, but I personally would have just preferred if the public marched in solidarity and not the leaders front and centre. Why? Since I don't want any excuse for further incitement, and even I am personally not happy with seeing Netanyahu there.

    With regards to Islamism. I think we should read more about Wahabbism, which is the sect within Islam that has been the most vociferous in inciting violence against non-Muslims and Muslims alike. Interestingly, it originates in Saudi Arabia (the country from where 15/19 hijackers on September 11 originated from, and which is single handledly responsible for supporting the petro-dollar in our fiat based currency system). That country and its leaders (The House of Saud) are the source of most of the problems we face, including inequality (by propping up an inflated dollar). However, no one focuses on it. Inconvenient I suppose.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Good point, just let the people march.
  • Posts: 15,124
    The leaders had to walk too, they have to show support to the very democracy that elected them. I am glad they are both there. Especially since Charlie Hebdo was just as mean and nasty towards François Hollande and Orthodox Jews (and probably Netanyahu). It shows they can take a joke for what it is: a joke.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    True, but they are politicians, and it can be seen as a bit self serving to be there too. That's not the case with the broader public who are grieving without any benefit from being there.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    bondjames wrote: »
    I personally feel it was a mistake for Hollande and particularly Netanyahu to attend the rally today. Obviously ,it is not illegal for them to do so, but I personally would have just preferred if the public marched in solidarity and not the leaders front and centre. Why? Since I don't want any excuse for further incitement, and even I am personally not happy with seeing Netanyahu there.

    Well I'm perfectly happy with leaders of Muslim countries to turn up to show their solidarity with the rest of the world that they agree people be allowed to mock Mohammed, Jesus, whoever.

    Strangely I don't see many of them there - presume they didnt fancy having their heads hacked off by a rabid public when they returned to their countries.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2015 Posts: 23,883
    bondjames wrote: »
    I personally feel it was a mistake for Hollande and particularly Netanyahu to attend the rally today. Obviously ,it is not illegal for them to do so, but I personally would have just preferred if the public marched in solidarity and not the leaders front and centre. Why? Since I don't want any excuse for further incitement, and even I am personally not happy with seeing Netanyahu there.

    Well I'm perfectly happy with leaders of Muslim countries to turn up to show their solidarity with the rest of the world that they agree people be allowed to mock Mohammed, Jesus, whoever.

    Strangely I don't see many of them there - presume they didnt fancy having their heads hacked off by a rabid public when they returned to their countries.

    Maybe they were worried about incitement in Paris to begin with given justifiable public anger & outrage. They may have had their heads hacked off right then and there. Isn't guillotine a French word.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    bondjames wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I personally feel it was a mistake for Hollande and particularly Netanyahu to attend the rally today. Obviously ,it is not illegal for them to do so, but I personally would have just preferred if the public marched in solidarity and not the leaders front and centre. Why? Since I don't want any excuse for further incitement, and even I am personally not happy with seeing Netanyahu there.

    Well I'm perfectly happy with leaders of Muslim countries to turn up to show their solidarity with the rest of the world that they agree people be allowed to mock Mohammed, Jesus, whoever.

    Strangely I don't see many of them there - presume they didnt fancy having their heads hacked off by a rabid public when they returned to their countries.

    Maybe they were worried about incitement in Paris to begin with given justifiable public anger & outrage. They may have had their heads hacked off right then and there. Isn't guillotine a French word.

    Well until the 'peace loving majority' we keep being told so much about come out vociferously against the terrorists then is it any wonder people are suspicious of them? Muslims in Paris could easily have had a march today saying 'this is not being done in our name and we respect people's right to mock the prophet' if they so desired. The police would have protected them if they had fear of reprisals but I don't think there would have been.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2015 Posts: 23,883
    bondjames wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I personally feel it was a mistake for Hollande and particularly Netanyahu to attend the rally today. Obviously ,it is not illegal for them to do so, but I personally would have just preferred if the public marched in solidarity and not the leaders front and centre. Why? Since I don't want any excuse for further incitement, and even I am personally not happy with seeing Netanyahu there.

    Well I'm perfectly happy with leaders of Muslim countries to turn up to show their solidarity with the rest of the world that they agree people be allowed to mock Mohammed, Jesus, whoever.

    Strangely I don't see many of them there - presume they didnt fancy having their heads hacked off by a rabid public when they returned to their countries.

    Maybe they were worried about incitement in Paris to begin with given justifiable public anger & outrage. They may have had their heads hacked off right then and there. Isn't guillotine a French word.

    Well until the 'peace loving majority' we keep being told so much about come out vociferously against the terrorists then is it any wonder people are suspicious of them? Muslims in Paris could easily have had a march today saying 'this is not being done in our name and we respect people's right to mock the prophet' if they so desired. The police would have protected them if they had fear of reprisals but I don't think there would have been.

    You have a point there. I don't think Muslims believe that it is correct to mock the prophet. Then again, in all fairness, I don't think you can expect Catholics to have a march saying we respect people's right to mock the Pope. Perhaps a march saying we tolerate that right but not respect it. I don't think religious people of any persuasion could be expected to march for that.

    I'm playing devil's (no pun intended) advocate here, but hopefully you get my point. At the end of the day, I'm not in favour of religion either, but I accept it for what it is, and the fact that it influences others.

    Wahabbism is the problem IMO.
  • Posts: 15,124
    bondjames wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I personally feel it was a mistake for Hollande and particularly Netanyahu to attend the rally today. Obviously ,it is not illegal for them to do so, but I personally would have just preferred if the public marched in solidarity and not the leaders front and centre. Why? Since I don't want any excuse for further incitement, and even I am personally not happy with seeing Netanyahu there.

    Well I'm perfectly happy with leaders of Muslim countries to turn up to show their solidarity with the rest of the world that they agree people be allowed to mock Mohammed, Jesus, whoever.

    Strangely I don't see many of them there - presume they didnt fancy having their heads hacked off by a rabid public when they returned to their countries.

    Maybe they were worried about incitement in Paris to begin with given justifiable public anger & outrage. They may have had their heads hacked off right then and there. Isn't guillotine a French word.

    Well until the 'peace loving majority' we keep being told so much about come out vociferously against the terrorists then is it any wonder people are suspicious of them? Muslims in Paris could easily have had a march today saying 'this is not being done in our name and we respect people's right to mock the prophet' if they so desired. The police would have protected them if they had fear of reprisals but I don't think there would have been.

    Actually, many Muslims were in Paris marching. Yes, the Muslim community in France has its share of fundies. But many are Westernized, some are even atheists and secularist, although Muslim by culture. The oppressive burden of Islamic faith is often first felt by the members of a community.
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