No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    Tuck91 wrote: »
    I read somewhere today a new Aston will be in the film.
    Do you have a link, by any chance?
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 11,425
    "SP was nowhere close to a perfect film, but, as was discussed, the shit really hit the fan when DC blew out his knee."

    Actually the shit hit the fan when they decided to film that script. Nothing she could say can redeem her as a producer in my eyes. There is just too much going wrong in so many of her movies.

    I think her biggest weakness is her inability to deliver on the writing front. This has been consistently poor pretty much since Cubby’s passing IMO and has hit all time lows at points that are unforgivable. She just doesn’t seem to have that knack to pick the right people or call out some of the shockers on the writing front.

    The underlying plots tend to be weak and the dialogue way too sketchy. It gives the majority of her films a flaccid vibe. They lack real tension or danger.

    Dialogue has improved in the Craig era (as well as delivery) but I still don’t think any of his films hits it out of the park on the writing front.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    Getafix wrote: »
    "SP was nowhere close to a perfect film, but, as was discussed, the shit really hit the fan when DC blew out his knee."

    Actually the shit hit the fan when they decided to film that script. Nothing she could say can redeem her as a producer in my eyes. There is just too much going wrong in so many of her movies.

    I think her biggest weakness is her inability to deliver on the writing front. This has been consistently poor pretty much since Cubby’s passing IMO and has hit all time lows at points that are unforgivable. She just doesn’t seem to have that knack to pick the right people or call out some of the shockers on the writing front.

    The underlying plots tend to be weak and the dialogue way too sketchy. It gives the majority of her films a flaccid vibe. They lack real tension or danger.

    Dialogue has improved in the Craig era (as well as delivery) but I still don’t think any of his films hits it out of the park on the writing front.
    I agree. The writing isn't up to the standards of the past, or what I expect from this franchise. I have also not been too keen on the directorial choices, although there's no arguing that they have brought some interesting elements to the franchise. I sometimes think it's art for the sake of art and covering up the script deficiencies, which would be more readily exposed under a more workmanlike director. Surface gloss.
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    When is waltz going on u s tv and what channel I doubt he say anything on Bond 25
  • Red_SnowRed_Snow Australia
    Posts: 2,539
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    When is waltz going on u s tv and what channel I doubt he say anything on Bond 25

    'Live with Kelly and Ryan' and 'The Tonight Show starring Jimmy Fallon' on Wednesday, 20 December.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 5,767
    jake24 wrote: »
    Tuck91 wrote: »
    I read somewhere today a new Aston will be in the film.
    Do you have a link, by any chance?
    Yeah, it´s from 2010 ;-)...


    Getafix wrote: »
    "SP was nowhere close to a perfect film, but, as was discussed, the shit really hit the fan when DC blew out his knee."

    Actually the shit hit the fan when they decided to film that script. Nothing she could say can redeem her as a producer in my eyes. There is just too much going wrong in so many of her movies.

    I think her biggest weakness is her inability to deliver on the writing front. This has been consistently poor pretty much since Cubby’s passing IMO and has hit all time lows at points that are unforgivable. She just doesn’t seem to have that knack to pick the right people or call out some of the shockers on the writing front.

    The underlying plots tend to be weak and the dialogue way too sketchy. It gives the majority of her films a flaccid vibe. They lack real tension or danger.

    Dialogue has improved in the Craig era (as well as delivery) but I still don’t think any of his films hits it out of the park on the writing front.
    I wouldn´t put it all down to "her", because MGW was heavily involved with some of the most interesting stories of the Moore and Dalton eras, but I did get a wtf moment when she describes in that interview how fantastic the scribes are. I´m way more lenient with P & W than most people around here, I think they are the least problem, but I find Barbara´s praise for them incredible.

    I disagree on your last point @Getafix, I quite liked writing and delivery in CR and QoS. SF already had some major flaws, and in SP also the delivery is many times questionable.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    They have explicitly indicated that 'the car' (not talking about the DB5) is an essential component of what defines modern Bond. This is in lieu of what they have termed 'bad habits' (which I happen to like). So I really wouldn't be surprised if we see another new one being bandied about. Quite frankly, I wish we could go through just one film without 'the car'. That's not what Bond is about as far as I'm concerned.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 5,767
    bondjames wrote: »
    They have explicitly indicated that 'the car' (not talking about the DB5) is a essential component of what defines modern Bond. This is in lieu of what they have termed 'bad habits' (which I happen to like). So I really wouldn't be surprised if we see another new one being bandied about. Quite frankly, I wish we could go through just one film without 'the car'. That's not what Bond is about as far as I'm concerned.
    This.

    I could imagine a number of scenes with Bond and his car, the problem I have is when it´s forced down my throat.
    I really get angry at the perversion and lack of intelligence of people thinking a Bond film needs a Bond car, when I think of the many times Bond didn´t have a special car, in other words in most of the films.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    boldfinger wrote: »
    I quite liked writing and delivery in CR and QoS. SF already had some major flaws, and in SP also the delivery is many times questionable.
    It's true. CR, QoS and SF had pretty decent writing in parts which elevated all three of those films. There was attention to details. I'm not sure who was responsible for that though - the main scribes or the polishers.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 5,767
    Film always has been a product of many people working together. You never can tell who´s the "main" scribe and how much the polishers write. The official credits are contractual, not according to how much each one contributed.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Film always has been a product of many people working together. You never can tell who´s the "main" scribe and how much the polishers write. The official credits are contractual, not according to how much each one contributed.

    This is very true. Ideas go back and forth.
  • boldfinger wrote: »
    Film always has been a product of many people working together. You never can tell who´s the "main" scribe and how much the polishers write. The official credits are contractual, not according to how much each one contributed.

    It's not totally contractual. It's also subject to the Writer's Guild guidelines. For example, Bruce Feirstein was added to The World Is Not Enough's writing credit (so late that the novelization said only, "Based on the screenplay by Neal Purvis & Robert Wade.")

    In a Writer's Guild arbitration, the parties involve submit drafts. In this case, Feirstein was judged to have contributed enough material to merit a screenplay credit.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 12,837
    boldfinger wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    They have explicitly indicated that 'the car' (not talking about the DB5) is a essential component of what defines modern Bond. This is in lieu of what they have termed 'bad habits' (which I happen to like). So I really wouldn't be surprised if we see another new one being bandied about. Quite frankly, I wish we could go through just one film without 'the car'. That's not what Bond is about as far as I'm concerned.
    This.

    I could imagine a number of scenes with Bond and his car, the problem I have is when it´s forced down my throat.
    I really get angry at the perversion and lack of intelligence of people thinking a Bond film needs a Bond car, when I think of the many times Bond didn´t have a special car, in other words in most of the films.

    Yeah, having a new Beemer or Aston every film since 95 has gotten a bit played out to be honest. I'm glad they've made the car having gadgets an occasional event again but even without gadgets, he still doesn't need a new car every film.

    I think give him a personal car that can be used when the script calls for it (a Bentley would be a nice touch but we'd probably have settle for the DB5 as depressing as it is) and give him an MI6 car with gadgets every few years if they have a really cool holy shit sort of idea in the same vein as the underwater Lotus.
  • Posts: 612
    boldfinger wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    They have explicitly indicated that 'the car' (not talking about the DB5) is a essential component of what defines modern Bond. This is in lieu of what they have termed 'bad habits' (which I happen to like). So I really wouldn't be surprised if we see another new one being bandied about. Quite frankly, I wish we could go through just one film without 'the car'. That's not what Bond is about as far as I'm concerned.
    This.

    I could imagine a number of scenes with Bond and his car, the problem I have is when it´s forced down my throat.
    I really get angry at the perversion and lack of intelligence of people thinking a Bond film needs a Bond car, when I think of the many times Bond didn´t have a special car, in other words in most of the films.

    Yeah, having a new Beemer or Aston every film since 95 has gotten a bit played out to be honest. I'm glad they've made the car having gadgets an occasional event again but even without gadgets, he still doesn't need a new car every film.

    I think give him a personal car that can be used when the script calls for it (a Bentley would be a nice touch but we'd probably have settle for the DB5 as depressing as it is) and give him an MI6 car with gadgets every few years if they have a really cool holy shit sort of idea in the same vein as the underwater Lotus.

    He didn't have a new car in Skyfall, and you could argue he didn't in Quantum either (but somehow managed to repaint the Aston when shoving White in the trunk... I personally like it when Bond gets a new car, but I don't like the prototype thing from SP. The new Vantage would do.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    It's not so much about a new car as the powers that be have identified 'cars' as being a critical component of what makes Bond who he is and the films what they are, along with far away locations etc. SF didn't have a new car but it had a huge fan moment with the DB5. They have also stated that other elements represent 'bad behaviour' and are being downplayed.
  • Posts: 16,167
    As much as I love the Aston Martin, I'd be perfectly fine with Q not giving Bond a new decked out car for the next, say 3 or 4 films.
    The fact that Q does not equip Bond with a new gadget laden automobile in FRWL, TB, OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TMWTGG, MR, FYEO, OP, AVTAK or LTK in no way impedes my enjoyment of those films.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    As much as I love the Aston Martin, I'd be perfectly fine with Q not giving Bond a new decked out car for the next, say 3 or 4 films.
    The fact that Q does not equip Bond with a new gadget laden automobile in FRWL, TB, OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TMWTGG, MR, FYEO, OP, AVTAK or LTK in no way impedes my enjoyment of those films.

    Bond did get a car for FYEO, but Bob Simmons blew it.
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 5,767
    boldfinger wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    They have explicitly indicated that 'the car' (not talking about the DB5) is a essential component of what defines modern Bond. This is in lieu of what they have termed 'bad habits' (which I happen to like). So I really wouldn't be surprised if we see another new one being bandied about. Quite frankly, I wish we could go through just one film without 'the car'. That's not what Bond is about as far as I'm concerned.
    This.

    I could imagine a number of scenes with Bond and his car, the problem I have is when it´s forced down my throat.
    I really get angry at the perversion and lack of intelligence of people thinking a Bond film needs a Bond car, when I think of the many times Bond didn´t have a special car, in other words in most of the films.

    Yeah, having a new Beemer or Aston every film since 95 has gotten a bit played out to be honest. I'm glad they've made the car having gadgets an occasional event again but even without gadgets, he still doesn't need a new car every film.

    I think give him a personal car that can be used when the script calls for it (a Bentley would be a nice touch but we'd probably have settle for the DB5 as depressing as it is) and give him an MI6 car with gadgets every few years if they have a really cool holy shit sort of idea in the same vein as the underwater Lotus.

    He didn't have a new car in Skyfall, and you could argue he didn't in Quantum either (but somehow managed to repaint the Aston when shoving White in the trunk... I personally like it when Bond gets a new car, but I don't like the prototype thing from SP. The new Vantage would do.
    QoS featured a car with at least one extra (bulletproof exterior), but it was done in a nonchalant way and not shoved down my throat as in SF. People complain about the Jaws silliness in MR, but the DB5 in SF is at least on the same level. In MR those moments were at least funny in a bizzarre way. And with SP they completely dropped the ball.

  • Posts: 16,167
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    As much as I love the Aston Martin, I'd be perfectly fine with Q not giving Bond a new decked out car for the next, say 3 or 4 films.
    The fact that Q does not equip Bond with a new gadget laden automobile in FRWL, TB, OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TMWTGG, MR, FYEO, OP, AVTAK or LTK in no way impedes my enjoyment of those films.

    Bond did get a car for FYEO, but Bob Simmons blew it.

    I figured the white Lotus was one he already had and was driving around.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    As much as I love the Aston Martin, I'd be perfectly fine with Q not giving Bond a new decked out car for the next, say 3 or 4 films.
    The fact that Q does not equip Bond with a new gadget laden automobile in FRWL, TB, OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TMWTGG, MR, FYEO, OP, AVTAK or LTK in no way impedes my enjoyment of those films.

    Bond did get a car for FYEO, but Bob Simmons blew it.

    I figured the white Lotus was one he already had and was driving around.

    It was red in FYEO. Could be a paintjob, of course.
  • Posts: 4,617
    Interesting debate re the car. One of my issues is that, but going down the regular formula, they deprive Bond of having the opportunity to show his pure driving skill when the odds are against him. I thought the 2CV sequence went O and it is a real shame that we never saw Bond in another British icon: the Mini.
  • Surface gloss is a great description, bondjames.

    We haven't had a well-conceived script since CR.

    Hopefully that's where the money's going this time round.
  • Posts: 11,425
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Film always has been a product of many people working together. You never can tell who´s the "main" scribe and how much the polishers write. The official credits are contractual, not according to how much each one contributed.

    It's not totally contractual. It's also subject to the Writer's Guild guidelines. For example, Bruce Feirstein was added to The World Is Not Enough's writing credit (so late that the novelization said only, "Based on the screenplay by Neal Purvis & Robert Wade.")

    In a Writer's Guild arbitration, the parties involve submit drafts. In this case, Feirstein was judged to have contributed enough material to merit a screenplay credit.

    Remarkable that anyone would fight to have their name associated with TWINE
  • Getafix wrote: »
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Film always has been a product of many people working together. You never can tell who´s the "main" scribe and how much the polishers write. The official credits are contractual, not according to how much each one contributed.

    It's not totally contractual. It's also subject to the Writer's Guild guidelines. For example, Bruce Feirstein was added to The World Is Not Enough's writing credit (so late that the novelization said only, "Based on the screenplay by Neal Purvis & Robert Wade.")

    In a Writer's Guild arbitration, the parties involve submit drafts. In this case, Feirstein was judged to have contributed enough material to merit a screenplay credit.

    Remarkable that anyone would fight to have their name associated with TWINE

    At least much more understandable than claiming the responsibility for Skyfall or Spectre. TWINE it's one of the very very few not Fleming based scripts without anything like a plot hole AND with 007 resembling the Bond of the novels as well. That alone should make it much more appreciated around here.
  • Posts: 1,031
    Getafix wrote: »
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Film always has been a product of many people working together. You never can tell who´s the "main" scribe and how much the polishers write. The official credits are contractual, not according to how much each one contributed.

    It's not totally contractual. It's also subject to the Writer's Guild guidelines. For example, Bruce Feirstein was added to The World Is Not Enough's writing credit (so late that the novelization said only, "Based on the screenplay by Neal Purvis & Robert Wade.")

    In a Writer's Guild arbitration, the parties involve submit drafts. In this case, Feirstein was judged to have contributed enough material to merit a screenplay credit.

    Remarkable that anyone would fight to have their name associated with TWINE

    At least much more understandable than claiming the responsibility for Skyfall or Spectre. TWINE it's one of the very very few not Fleming based scripts without anything like a plot hole AND with 007 resembling the Bond of the novels as well. That alone should make it much more appreciated around here.

    A shame about the quality (or lack of) of acting in TWINE. PB at his worst in this one for me.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Not his finest hour, I admit that myself. But, it's not that bad.
  • Posts: 11,425
    TWINE ranks bottom for me. Below DAD.
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    I want a DB5 chase scene in Bond 25
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    Getafix wrote: »
    TWINE ranks bottom for me. Below DAD.
    For me too. I just viewed TWINE a few days back. There are some interesting ideas in that film (even if they are a bit tired now due to being overplayed in the past decade), but the execution lets the film down imho.

    The dialogue in particular is cringeworthy in some places and terribly pedestrian elsewhere.

    As I said in a mini review on another thread, they tried to have it both ways by peeling back a bit of Bond's psyche while also attempting to deliver the (at the time) expected campish humour. The two elements clash and the actors can't pull it off (I don't blame them, because it's quite difficult to be credible in both realms concurrently).
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