No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,511
    Thanks @Birdleson, and @barryt007 , and of course @ColonelSun
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,511
    agreed @Birdleson . Thanks for helping
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,252
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I’m asking all of you to not get sucked back into this petty squabble. We had seemed to be getting back on track. Let the mods handle the malcontents, do not engage.
    +1
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,387
    Has anyone else seen American Animals yet? Would be interested what you think.
  • JeremyBondonJeremyBondon Seeking out odd jobs with Oddjob @Tangier
    Posts: 1,318
    echo wrote: »
    Has anyone else seen American Animals yet? Would be interested what you think.

    Or for that matter, The Imposter. Loved that one.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited September 2018 Posts: 23,883
    @Pierce2Daniel, I can understand your frustration. I personally just wait for Deadline or Baz to report something rather than get caught up in the circus here. By my observation they have been especially accurate and objective, and I wouldn't be surprised (although I have no basis for this except a hunch) if EON leak info to the latter.

    I have been advised by a few members here that The Hollywood Reporter and Variety are also pretty good, and as I remember, the latter has also been reasonably on point but appears to engage in a bit more speculation. Recently they've suggested that the date could move, which of course is something we're all concerned about, but have no hard data about. Time will of course tell if they were onto something or whether their speculation was out to lunch.

    As you said yourself, all the media are focused on trying to get updates on progress, so we're bound to get some news within the next month or two, at least from Baz or Deadline. They will comment when and only when they have something concrete either way, so no news is actually good news imho. For now, it would be best to be patient and hope that it's all on track.
    --

    Has anyone heard anything more on those built sets that were rumoured last weekend to be coming down?
    --

    Or for that matter, The Imposter. Loved that one.
    I plan to see both at some point shortly. I shall report back when I do.

    I shall add though that I started viewing Danny Boyle's work after he was announced and didn't see how he would be compatible with Bond, so I'm not sure if my impressions of Layton will be any more accurate.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,257
    @peter and @ColonelSun are not one and the same person and I for one highly value their input.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 19,339
    "bondjames wrote: »
    Has anyone heard anything more on those built sets that were rumoured last weekend to be coming down?
    --

    I haven't heard that !
    They are getting rid of them,writing them off ?


    DarthDimi wrote: »
    peter and @ColonelSun are not one and the same person and I for one highly value their input.

    Totally agree,DD,well said.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited September 2018 Posts: 23,883
    barryt007 wrote: »

    I haven't heard that !
    They are getting rid of them,writing them off ?
    I recall reading some twitter speculation here on the weekend that it could happen. One source said it would, and another said it wouldn't. Then I didn't hear anything more.

    Even if it happens, it could mean anything though - including that they've reconceptualized some of the action.

    Anyway it was just speculation and I was curious to learn if anything more was known at this stage.
  • Posts: 19,339
    bondjames wrote: »
    I recall reading some twitter speculation here on the weekend that it could happen. One source said it would, and another said it wouldn't. Then I didn't hear anything more.

    Even if it happens, it could mean anything though - including that they've reconceptualized some of the action.

    Anyway it was just speculation and I was curious to learn if anything more was known at this stage.

    What a waste though,if it happens.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    barryt007 wrote: »

    What a waste though,if it happens.
    True, but I don't want to unnecessarily alarm you. It was just conflicting rumours on twitter and I can't even recall if the individuals were connected with the business or not.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,589
    EON's secretiveness can be a blessing or a curse. Most often, their tight control of information and letting only certain things leak out, keeps everyone on the edge of their seat. I think they do this intentionally and usually quite skillfully. However, there are other times, like now, in which tight lips do nothing but frustrate and irritate fans. In this case, it's not suspense we're going through; it's torture.
  • Posts: 5,767
    TripAces wrote: »
    EON's secretiveness can be a blessing or a curse. Most often, their tight control of information and letting only certain things leak out, keeps everyone on the edge of their seat. I think they do this intentionally and usually quite skillfully. However, there are other times, like now, in which tight lips do nothing but frustrate and irritate fans. In this case, it's not suspense we're going through; it's torture.
    Then Focus on the bright side of life :-).



  • edited September 2018 Posts: 1,661
    I think fans assume writing a Bond screenplay is relatively easy? I mean we all know the basic structure, but it's hard to come up with fresh stuff and if you're interested in 'character' (which Babs is) then you have to find a way to delve into Bond's personality but not lessen his macho persona.

    Look at the Predator franchise. Simple concept. Alien comes to Earth, hunts people then kills 'em. Can't get more simple than that. Look at most reviews of The Predator (2018). Awful storyline, stuff reshot. Very easy to screw it up. Shane Black joins Star Wars' Rian Johnson in the 'hated directors/writers' club.

    Basically it all sounds easy in theory - Bond goes on mission, has some action scenes, kisses girl, kills henchman, blows up base, kills bad guy, kisses girl again. The End.

    And then you write the storyline and everyone has their opinion: "change this, add that, blah blah blah" and you end up with a storyline the producers don't like: Hodge's screenplay! It's a minor miracle any big budget film turns out good. I'm guessing there is so much alteration to the screenplays it's a surprise when most of it makes sense and flows well!
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,511
    @fanbond123 : bang on the money.
  • fanbond123 wrote: »
    I think fans assume writing a Bond screenplay is relatively easy? I mean we all know the basic structure, but it's hard to come up with fresh stuff and if you're interested in 'character' (which Babs is) then you have to find a way to delve into Bond's personality but not lessen his macho persona.

    ...

    Basically it all sounds easy in theory - Bond goes on mission, has some action scenes, kisses girl, kills henchman, blows up base, kills bad guy, kisses girl again. The End.

    And then you write the storyline and everyone has their opinion: "change this, add that, blah blah blah" and you end up with a storyline the producers don't like: Hodge's screenplay! It's a minor miracle any big budget film turns out good. I'm guessing there is so much alteration to the screenplays it's a surprise when most of it makes sense and flows well!

    Well put.

    Look at SPECTRE (a Bond film that I personally feel seems to be very underrated). The online armchair narratives would push that it's a "soap opera, family drama, a brother angle that ruins it, awful ending, boring, terrible script" etc. -- basically, as far-stretched as you can take subjective observations.

    Many of those folks might also scream for the return of a 'conventional' Bond film. And yet SPECTRE, to me, seems the most conventional Bond film we've seen in the Craig era. By far.

    -Thrilling pretitles, dropping Bond stylishly in mid-mission.
    -Conventional M 'briefing'.
    -Bond's flat appears.
    -Conventional Q scene.
    -Maybe the most Bondian sequence of locations imaginable: London, Rome, the Alps, the North African desert.
    -Car chase in a beautiful city between a leading-edge Aston Martin and Jaguar
    -Sequence in the most OHMSS-inspired spot on the planet I could imagine
    -Massive story echoes to OHMSS, a fan 'favorite'
    -The return of SPECTRE itself, and Ernst Stavro Blofeld
    -A story that dares to end resonantly for the character

    Now, I can already hear the counterarguments. "It's not the ideas, it's their execution." And you know what? That's perfectly fine. I might even agree with you, in more than a few of those cases.

    But that's exactly my point. Echoing @fanbond123.

    These things are incredibly hard to get right. They're even harder to get done.



  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    edited September 2018 Posts: 8,252
    AgentM72 wrote: »

    Well put.

    Look at SPECTRE (a Bond film that I personally feel seems to be very underrated). The online armchair narratives would push that it's a "soap opera, family drama, a brother angle that ruins it, awful ending, boring, terrible script" etc. -- basically, as far-stretched as you can take subjective observations.

    Many of those folks might also scream for the return of a 'conventional' Bond film. And yet SPECTRE, to me, seems the most conventional Bond film we've seen in the Craig era. By far.

    -Thrilling pretitles, dropping Bond stylishly in mid-mission.
    -Conventional M 'briefing'.
    -Bond's flat appears.
    -Conventional Q scene.
    -Maybe the most Bondian sequence of locations imaginable: London, Rome, the Alps, the North African desert.
    -Car chase in a beautiful city between a leading-edge Aston Martin and Jaguar
    -Sequence in the most OHMSS-inspired spot on the planet I could imagine
    -Massive story echoes to OHMSS, a fan 'favorite'
    -The return of SPECTRE itself, and Ernst Stavro Blofeld
    -A story that dares to end resonantly for the character

    Now, I can already hear the counterarguments. "It's not the ideas, it's their execution." And you know what? That's perfectly fine. I might even agree with you, in more than a few of those cases.

    But that's exactly my point. Echoing @fanbond123.

    These things are incredibly hard to get right. They're even harder to get done.



    It’s interesting, you’re breakdown of SPECTRE does indeed look like it would be would be a great Bond film; it’s actually far more effective than the actual film .
    Unfortunately the execution of most of these points was lacking and the film as a whole was muddled.

    The right screenwriter could do wonders within the framework of your SPECTRE breakdown.
    Imagine what McQuarrie could do with this.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited September 2018 Posts: 23,883
    AgentM72 wrote: »
    Now, I can already hear the counterarguments. "It's not the ideas, it's their execution." And you know what? That's perfectly fine. I might even agree with you, in more than a few of those cases.

    But that's exactly my point. Echoing @fanbond123.

    These things are incredibly hard to get right. They're even harder to get done.
    You've read my mind. Indeed it's all about the execution, otherwise anybody could make a Bond film. Many have tried over the past 50 years, and nearly all have fallen woefully short. Having said that, this isn't something that anyone can take for granted, and one is only as good as one's last (or last few) films. Legacy can only take one so far.

    No doubt it's extremely difficult, but most things worth doing in life are. This is a high stakes product with millions of $ at stake.

    At the end of the day we have to trust the film makers to get it right, and I'm sure we all hope they do so in 2019.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 842
    talos7 wrote: »

    Haha, that's just it. I'm not inventing anything. That's all real. It *is* a great Bond film! So it's also an interesting question to discuss why it doesn't feel that way to many people.

    I have my own theories, but they're best saved for another thread.




  • Red_SnowRed_Snow Australia
    Posts: 2,545
    TripAces wrote: »
    EON's secretiveness can be a blessing or a curse. Most often, their tight control of information and letting only certain things leak out, keeps everyone on the edge of their seat. I think they do this intentionally and usually quite skillfully. However, there are other times, like now, in which tight lips do nothing but frustrate and irritate fans. In this case, it's not suspense we're going through; it's torture.

    I'm curious as to how Boyle talking about his involvement with B25 well before he was announced has/will effect any announcements made about future crew/casting decisions.

    Had he not spoken about it publicly beforehand, how long would have EON waited to make an official announcement? If things fell apart creatively before an announcement had officially been made, could all the media brew-ha-ha of the last few months largely been avoided?

  • Posts: 16,226
    I'm enjoying the rapport here. This is quite entertaining.
    Been off line a day and it seems there is still no news. Oh well.
  • Posts: 4,619
    I feel that is centrally what is so frustrating about the current predicament.

    The longer we wait without news from Eon, the more likely they have abdicated the 2019 slot.

    However, they won’t announce a delay without agreeing a new date first.


    So, we could be looking at a few days (maybe even a few hours) of news that someone has come in to direct and the film is still due for 2019. Alternatively, we could wait well into the new year and stay in the same holding pattern with Bond 25 in the books for 2019 with no realistic chance it’ll meet that date.

    Personally, I’m growing restless of @peter and @ColonelSun non-updates. Firstly, I’m fairly certain they’re the same person and their ‘updates’ are from Variety.
    Well said. What I find baffling is that many people here defend EON when they make mistake after mistake after mistake and attack people who dare to criticize them. It's safe to say most people here do not want Michael Bay to direct Bond 25, but I suspect if EON announced him as the director tomorrow, most people here would try to convince themselves and others what a great choice he is!
  • Posts: 5,767
    talos7 wrote: »

    It’s interesting, you’re breakdown of SPECTRE does indeed look like it would be would be a great Bond film; it’s actually far more effective than the actual film .
    Unfortunately the execution of most of these points was lacking and the film as a whole was muddled.

    The right screenwriter could do wonders within the framework of your SPECTRE breakdown.
    Imagine what McQuarrie could do with this.
    Put McQuarrie in a 50-year-old Franchise, and he would be in the same Situation as the other Bond directors. And that´s not the same as sitting down with Cruise and hatching their Baby. @fanbond123 mentions Shane Black´s The Predator. Now look at the films Shane Black has directed: Two lower budgeted films he had free Hand on, and two high Budget vehicles. The former are sharp on every Corner, every line hits ist mark, the Story flows, their both a blast. The latter two are so-so.

  • Posts: 16,226
    Well said. What I find baffling is that many people here defend EON when they make mistake after mistake after mistake and attack people who dare to criticize them. It's safe to say most people here do not want Michael Bay to direct Bond 25, but I suspect if EON announced him as the director tomorrow, most people here would try to convince themselves and others what a great choice he is!

    Good point. I've been feeling that could apply to Bond casting as well. Most of the potential replacement names mentioned I just don't see as Bond.

    If Eon were to announce tomorrow that Craig has bailed, and for the first time in the series an A list American actor has been cast as 007..............and that actor is Tom Hanks...................... there would be countless threads discussing his potential as Bond.

  • edited September 2018 Posts: 842
    boldfinger wrote: »

    Put McQuarrie in a 50-year-old Franchise, and he would be in the same Situation as the other Bond directors. And that´s not the same as sitting down with Cruise and hatching their Baby. @fanbond123 mentions Shane Black´s The Predator. Now look at the films Shane Black has directed: Two lower budgeted films he had free Hand on, and two high Budget vehicles. The former are sharp on every Corner, every line hits ist mark, the Story flows, their both a blast. The latter two are so-so.

    Indeed. Writers and directors -- any professional filmmaker, really -- finds themselves in a similar boat on any franchise tentpole. And each franchise is different.

    It's a give and take relationship. Any collaborative undertaking on this scale, with this kind of investment behind it, will be. There are opportunities for personal expression and creativity everywhere in the process, but to expect these projects to be the uniquely the vision of a core creative personality -- director or otherwise -- just isn't practical.

    That's what irks me about flippant, superficial review comments like "bad screenplay" or anything that tries to lay blame solely at a writer's/director's feet. That reviewer rarely has any idea what that person had to battle through in the making of that film, or how many arguments they were on the right side of and ended up losing along the way.
  • Posts: 5,767
    I guess I should stop putting all the blame on Mendes then ;-)...
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    edited September 2018 Posts: 1,261
    DonnyDB5 wrote: »

    Your sources?

    It's on a need to know basis, old boy.
  • boldfinger wrote: »
    I guess I should stop putting all the blame on Mendes then ;-)...

    Haha. I'm always surprised how quickly fandom seemed to turn on the man who was such a driving force in bringing them a near-universally acclaimed masterpiece in Skyfall.

    And yet, there are two sides to every coin. My logic above doesn't absolve writers and directors from imperfection, either. Plenty to discuss about what works and doesn't work in a film like SPECTRE, and it's not as if there's a fine line where "good director decisions" exist on one side and "bad producer mandates" live on the other.

    Despite what some would have us believe. ;)
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited September 2018 Posts: 15,723
    Somewhat B25 related:

    Danny Boyle's (still untitled) musical comedy will be releasing earlier than expected, as it's opening day moves up from Sept 13th to June 28, 2019.

    https://deadline.com/2018/09/danny-boyle-richard-curtis-comedy-eyes-sept-2019-release-two-months-before-james-bond-1202365674/
  • AgentM72 wrote: »

    Well put.

    Look at SPECTRE (a Bond film that I personally feel seems to be very underrated). The online armchair narratives would push that it's a "soap opera, family drama, a brother angle that ruins it, awful ending, boring, terrible script" etc. -- basically, as far-stretched as you can take subjective observations.

    Many of those folks might also scream for the return of a 'conventional' Bond film. And yet SPECTRE, to me, seems the most conventional Bond film we've seen in the Craig era. By far.

    -Thrilling pretitles, dropping Bond stylishly in mid-mission.
    -Conventional M 'briefing'.
    -Bond's flat appears.
    -Conventional Q scene.
    -Maybe the most Bondian sequence of locations imaginable: London, Rome, the Alps, the North African desert.
    -Car chase in a beautiful city between a leading-edge Aston Martin and Jaguar
    -Sequence in the most OHMSS-inspired spot on the planet I could imagine
    -Massive story echoes to OHMSS, a fan 'favorite'
    -The return of SPECTRE itself, and Ernst Stavro Blofeld
    -A story that dares to end resonantly for the character

    Now, I can already hear the counterarguments. "It's not the ideas, it's their execution." And you know what? That's perfectly fine. I might even agree with you, in more than a few of those cases.

    But that's exactly my point. Echoing @fanbond123.

    These things are incredibly hard to get right. They're even harder to get done.



    Spectre is the right start for me, which is why I usually rate it the most highly of the Craig films, followed by Quantum, a severely underrated film.
    Well said. What I find baffling is that many people here defend EON when they make mistake after mistake after mistake and attack people who dare to criticize them. It's safe to say most people here do not want Michael Bay to direct Bond 25, but I suspect if EON announced him as the director tomorrow, most people here would try to convince themselves and others what a great choice he is!

    No, they wouldn't. There would be a general feeling that Eon jumped the shark.
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