No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    JamesStock wrote: »
    What if they blend YOLT's garden of death (which I absolutely love the concept) with a FRWL (book) type ending where the film would have him fade out due to some exotic plant poisoning? If they used Blofeld as the villain, they could show him back in control, allowing Bond26 to take off from there.
    JamesStock wrote: »
    What if they blend YOLT's garden of death (which I absolutely love the concept) with a FRWL (book) type ending where the film would have him fade out due to some exotic plant poisoning? If they used Blofeld as the villain, they could show him back in control, allowing Bond26 to take off from there.

    Could be good, two great elements of the novels.

    @JamesStock do you work for the London Financial Times?
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    Yes, we need a gritty spy thriller. A film that has action with visceral fist fights, gripping car chases, Bond actually spying and doing some detective work to uncover and solve; with some throwaway casual sex thrown in and of course a main Bond girl. The story needs to have audiences invested, the atmosphere needs to be incredibly immersive, the music needs to touch us almost on a spiritual level and there has to be legit stakes where we actually care what's happening and really feel the weight of the risks Bond takes...I think Fukunaga can pull this off......and no super tight suits. Fortunately Fukunaga knows how to dress and knows how to wear a suit.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    The FRWL cliffhanger ending would work IF the next film is to be a continuation of B25. The Craig era is self-contained and considering this is his last, the next era won’t be a continuation of the timeline kicked off in 2006.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    The FRWL cliffhanger ending would work IF the next film is to be a continuation of B25. The Craig era is self-contained and considering this is his last, the next era won’t be a continuation of the timeline kicked off in 2006.

    That has never been stated by EON or anyone involved.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    The FRWL cliffhanger ending would work IF the next film is to be a continuation of B25. The Craig era is self-contained and considering this is his last, the next era won’t be a continuation of the timeline kicked off in 2006.
    That has never been stated by EON or anyone involved.
    Craig implied it many times, starting with the “going on a high” comment he made last year the day he confirmed he was coming back as Bond.
  • Posts: 4,619
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited September 2018 Posts: 4,343
    I think that there are far more compelling ways to handle this idea of Bond dying rather than just kill off the character. Far more Flemingesque ways. Like in YOLT. Forgetting about his past and his identity as a spy is such a clever way to “kill off” 007, without doing it literally. Which would be something quite banal.

    “A man lives inside his head. That’s where the seed of his soul is”. ESB
  • Posts: 17,814
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 1,661
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    How can Bond die? It's impossible. Bond dies in Bond 25. He's alive in Bond 26!

    Er... right. How does that make any sense?

  • edited September 2018 Posts: 4,619
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?
    fanbond123 wrote: »

    How can Bond die? It's impossible. Bond dies in Bond 25. He's alive in Bond 26!

    Er... right. How does that make any sense?
    Bond is an experienced middle aged agent in Bond 20. He is a young rookie agent in Bond 21. How? It's impossible!
  • Posts: 17,814
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    Because I've never bought into the idea. I also don't enjoy watching films where the hero dies no matter the film – even less so in a franchise where you know there will be more films coming after it. There's enough reboots around as it is.
  • Posts: 4,619
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    Because I've never bought into the idea. I also don't enjoy watching films where the hero dies no matter the film – even less so in a franchise where you know there will be more films coming after it. There's enough reboots around as it is.
    Every new Bond era is a reboot anyway. I don't think anybody believes the Bond in LTK was already an agent back in 1962.
  • Posts: 1,661
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 4,619
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P
    If Bond was a 30-something guy in 1962, how can he be still under 40 in 2006? Have you heard of the term reboot?
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    As I already said before, it all depends how they’d handle this idea. There are more subtle and intelligent and Flemingesque ways for killing off the character without doing it quite physically.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 17,814
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    Because I've never bought into the idea. I also don't enjoy watching films where the hero dies no matter the film – even less so in a franchise where you know there will be more films coming after it. There's enough reboots around as it is.
    Every new Bond era is a reboot anyway. I don't think anybody believes the Bond in LTK was already an agent back in 1962.

    It's a soft reboot (of sorts). No Bond film or era have ever ended the film with the guy presumed dead - or dead.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 4,619
    An observation regarding the new indiewire article someone posted a link to recently:

    https://www.indiewire.com/2018/09/daniel-craig-bond-25-finale-cary-fukunaga-1202005592/
    "But then Boyle and his “Trainspotting” franchise collaborator John Hodge pitched a more tantalizing idea about reviving the Cold War with a wild twist."

    This twist again! We have still no idea what this movie gold idea by Boyle and Hodge was and we still don't know whether EON has ditsched it or not. I certainly hope it's still very much part of the screenplay.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited September 2018 Posts: 4,343
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    Because I've never bought into the idea. I also don't enjoy watching films where the hero dies no matter the film – even less so in a franchise where you know there will be more films coming after it. There's enough reboots around as it is.
    Every new Bond era is a reboot anyway. I don't think anybody believes the Bond in LTK was already an agent back in 1962.

    It's a soft reboot. No Bond film or era have ever ended the film with the guy presumed dead.

    No Bond film or era ever showed the origins of the character or how 007 got his licence to kill. Until Craig.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P
    If Bond was a 30-something guy in 1962, how can he be still under 40 in 2006? Have you heard of the term reboot?
    Reboot didn't actually happen until 2006. None of the eras were reboots prior to the Craig era. They just ignored the reality of aging and kept the character as it was since 1962. Just like the way they kept Richard Stark's Parker and Don Pendelton's Mack Bolan/Executioner the same while moving him with the times through a series of novels. The pre-Craig Bond was treated that way.
  • Posts: 17,814
    matt_u wrote: »
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    Because I've never bought into the idea. I also don't enjoy watching films where the hero dies no matter the film – even less so in a franchise where you know there will be more films coming after it. There's enough reboots around as it is.
    Every new Bond era is a reboot anyway. I don't think anybody believes the Bond in LTK was already an agent back in 1962.

    It's a soft reboot. No Bond film or era have ever ended the film with the guy presumed dead.

    No Bond film or era ever showed the origins of the character or how 007 got his licence to kill. Until Craig.

    True, but that doesn't have to mean Bond have to be killed at the end.

    I have enough troubles with the Craig era as it is. Having Bond killed at the end will just be the last straw.
  • Posts: 1,661
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P
    If Bond was a 30-something guy in 1962, how can he be still under 40 in 2006? Have you heard of the term reboot?

    Reboot was the first CGI tv show!

    reboot_ca.jpg

    I bet you never knew that. Na na na na na.

    If Bond dies in Bond 25 and we know he will live again in a rebooted Bond 26 - doesn't that undermine the impact of his death? We'll see Daniel Craig's Bond die but we'll know "Bond lives in Bond 26!" Won't that lessen the impact of the death?

    If Eon are going to sell up and stop making films then I suppose you can argue killing off their Bond makes sense. Perhaps.






  • Posts: 4,619
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 and we know he will live again in a rebooted Bond 26 - doesn't that undermine the impact of his death? We'll see Daniel Craig's Bond die but we'll know "Bond lives in Bond 26!" Won't that lessen the impact of the death?
    Sooner or later there will be a new on-screen Wolverine. Does that lessen the impact of Wolverine's death at the end of Logan? Of course it doesn't.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited September 2018 Posts: 4,343
    matt_u wrote: »
    I don't understand why so many people here are so against Bond dying in in one film. he has survived 24 movies, why can't he die in a single one? I have yet to read a comment articulating why exactly Bond dying is such a bad idea.

    Someone wrote that EON would never kill of Bond, because it would lead to worse box office performance. How exactly? As for people saying they would boycott Bond 25 if Bond died in it, COME ON! We all know you would still be first in line to watch it.

    Nope. Wouldn't watch it.
    Ok, but WHY? Why are you so much against the idea of Bond dying in one movie?

    Because I've never bought into the idea. I also don't enjoy watching films where the hero dies no matter the film – even less so in a franchise where you know there will be more films coming after it. There's enough reboots around as it is.
    Every new Bond era is a reboot anyway. I don't think anybody believes the Bond in LTK was already an agent back in 1962.

    It's a soft reboot. No Bond film or era have ever ended the film with the guy presumed dead.

    No Bond film or era ever showed the origins of the character or how 007 got his licence to kill. Until Craig.

    True, but that doesn't have to mean Bond have to be killed at the end.

    You’re right.

    But as I said before they could still handle this idea following Fleming’s material regarding Bond “presumed” dead. For example, having Bond losing his memory not knowing anymore who he really is/was would be like “killing” the character.
  • edited September 2018 Posts: 1,661
    Wolverine doesn't have 24 films. He's a less established film hero.

    If Eon sell up, if Bond 26 is delayed for several years - then yeah, okay, your idea could work. But if we go from Bond 25 - Craig's Bond dies - to two/three years later with new rebooted 'younger actor' Bond, it might feel a bit strange. It will feel like the new Bond is an imposter? Bond dies but this new guy is Bond? I dunno....

  • Posts: 1,497
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P

    It's about Craig's Bond. If they kill his Bond, the following re-boot, 3 or 4 or more years later, will, like CR, introduce a distinct new time-line and a new Bond and, likely, new M, Moneypenny etc.


  • Posts: 1,661
    It's a hard concept to grasp. Feels a bit gimmicky. Batman has never died in his films. I doubt Indiana Jones will die in the next Indy film. Possible, but unlikely.

    Death is meant to be permanent. Bond dying but returning in the next film does undermine the basic meaning of death! Superman died in the comics but returned. He's an alien so he's got a good excuse. ;)

    I suppose Craig's Bond dying would provide a shock ending and make the film more memorable? Hmm... I think it's a risky thing to do.



  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    edited September 2018 Posts: 8,230
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P
    If Bond was a 30-something guy in 1962, how can he be still under 40 in 2006? Have you heard of the term reboot?

    Have you heard of the term Floating Timeline?

    Craig is the only reboot.
  • Posts: 1,661
    Floating Timeline? No, not heard of that exact term. Doctor Who has a floating timeline, I guess. Past, present and future continuity.

    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - fair enough. It will divide some fans but I'm sure they'll get over it.

  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,230
    ColonelSun wrote: »
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    If Bond dies in Bond 25 - and it's a clear non-ambiguous death - we see his body, he is buried - how can he return in Bond 26? He's dead! LOL

    The only way to kill off Bond is not to show his actual death. I dunno, Bond falls off a mountain and we think he's dead but da da daaaaaaaaaaaa!..... he survives.

    That could work. Ish. Maybe. If we close our eyes and pretend it's not silly.

    :P

    It's about Craig's Bond. If they kill his Bond, the following re-boot, 3 or 4 or more years later, will, like CR, introduce a distinct new time-line and a new Bond and, likely, new M, Moneypenny etc.


    We all know that, I'm sure. The issue for me, @ColonelSun, is that if Craig's Bond were to bite the dust then all bets are off regarding what can be done with the character. The internet is already up in arms about Elba being Bond, a woman being Bond, Bond being gay, etc. If Bond were to be killed and then simply brought back to life with the next film no questions asked, there'd be no reason for any of those things to be an issue anymore. And that's a problem for me because it means Bond wouldn't be Bond anymore - that slippery slope would be truly crazy. The character most definitely will have died, in more ways than one.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    IF this is the idea, I don’t think they will handle it in Logan style, killing off 100% the character. They would probably go for a more Flemingesque route, or something like how Wayne was presumed dead in The Dark Knight Rises. Fleming never 100% killed off Bond and neither EoN would do it, I suppose.
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