No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • edited December 2018 Posts: 4,619
    DoctorNo wrote: »
    If another SF came out next it would not make a billion dollars. It's a dead end, not a route to the future. Just ask the DCEU.

    Truer than scripture. The dark and gritty angle is played out. I fear they are headed down that road again and if so, it could get messy.
    Wrong. Batman vs Superman and Justice League were not failures because they were dark and gritty. They were failures because they were abysmal movies. If Nolan made a 4th Dark Knight movie right now, it would be just as successful as the first three were.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    this film guarantees it will be satisfying to the international market that buy the tickets, and the majority of them will be repeat customers.

    Rather a bold claim.

    My main reason for believing that Bond 25 could get messy is that I believe they will learn the wrong lessons from SP. They tried the lighter, more traditional stuff and fell flat on their face. Instead of thinking "maybe we didn't execute correctly, let's try again" they will think, "better go back to the emotional, dramatic territory that made CR and SF huge successes." Cary Fukunaga pretty much already confirms this is the case. Not to mention that it's just about the only way they could get Craig back for another film. He wants to make a "significant" film which takes risks and carries dramatic and emotion weight. That was his MO since day 1, and it shows how of a fish out of water he looked handling the jokes in SP.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    this film guarantees it will be satisfying to the international market that buy the tickets, and the majority of them will be repeat customers.

    Rather a bold claim.

    My main reason for believing that Bond 25 could get messy is that I believe they will learn the wrong lessons from SP. They tried the lighter, more traditional stuff and fell flat on their face. Instead of thinking "maybe we didn't execute correctly, let's try again" they will think, "better go back to the emotional, dramatic territory that made CR and SF huge successes." Cary Fukunaga pretty much already confirms this is the case. Not to mention that it's just about the only way they could get Craig back for another film. He wants to make a "significant" film which takes risks and carries dramatic and emotion weight. That was his MO since day 1, and it shows how of a fish out of water he looked handling the jokes in SP.

    You’re citing two very popular films, both critically and financially. But you think if they go back to these films as inspiration that somehow B25 will become messy? Is that what you’re saying? I’m not being sarcastic.


  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited December 2018 Posts: 8,395
    peter wrote: »
    this film guarantees it will be satisfying to the international market that buy the tickets, and the majority of them will be repeat customers.

    Rather a bold claim.

    My main reason for believing that Bond 25 could get messy is that I believe they will learn the wrong lessons from SP. They tried the lighter, more traditional stuff and fell flat on their face. Instead of thinking "maybe we didn't execute correctly, let's try again" they will think, "better go back to the emotional, dramatic territory that made CR and SF huge successes." Cary Fukunaga pretty much already confirms this is the case. Not to mention that it's just about the only way they could get Craig back for another film. He wants to make a "significant" film which takes risks and carries dramatic and emotion weight. That was his MO since day 1, and it shows how of a fish out of water he looked handling the jokes in SP.

    You’re citing two very popular films, both critically and financially. But you think if they go back to these films as inspiration that somehow B25 will become messy? Is that what you’re saying? I’m not being sarcastic.


    Yes, because these are 12 and 6 years old respectively. It's not so much "inspiration" as retreading old ground. They were popular for their time and added to the franchise, but things move on and I don't think it makes sense to approach the next film like it's still 2006. Culturally we're in a very different place, and if they want Bond 25 to be a success, it should reflect that.
  • edited December 2018 Posts: 727
    I am preparing myself for a grim, relentlessly dark film. Cary being director only reinforces that. Also the least British film of the series.

    Say what you will about Skyfall and Spectre, but they were so British. Even compared to their immediate predecessors. Casino Royale felt very international and Quatum....well, QOS was just generic.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    peter wrote: »
    this film guarantees it will be satisfying to the international market that buy the tickets, and the majority of them will be repeat customers.

    Rather a bold claim.

    My main reason for believing that Bond 25 could get messy is that I believe they will learn the wrong lessons from SP. They tried the lighter, more traditional stuff and fell flat on their face. Instead of thinking "maybe we didn't execute correctly, let's try again" they will think, "better go back to the emotional, dramatic territory that made CR and SF huge successes." Cary Fukunaga pretty much already confirms this is the case. Not to mention that it's just about the only way they could get Craig back for another film. He wants to make a "significant" film which takes risks and carries dramatic and emotion weight. That was his MO since day 1, and it shows how of a fish out of water he looked handling the jokes in SP.

    You’re citing two very popular films, both critically and financially. But you think if they go back to these films as inspiration that somehow B25 will become messy? Is that what you’re saying? I’m not being sarcastic.


    Yes, because these are 12 and 6 years old respectively. It's not so much "inspiration" as retreading old ground. They were popular for their time and added to the franchise, but things move on and I don't think it makes sense to approach the next film like it's still 2006. Culturally we're in a very different place, and if they want Bond 25 to be a success, it should reflect that.

    But you’re assuming they’re “retreading”. Why?
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    peter wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    this film guarantees it will be satisfying to the international market that buy the tickets, and the majority of them will be repeat customers.

    Rather a bold claim.

    My main reason for believing that Bond 25 could get messy is that I believe they will learn the wrong lessons from SP. They tried the lighter, more traditional stuff and fell flat on their face. Instead of thinking "maybe we didn't execute correctly, let's try again" they will think, "better go back to the emotional, dramatic territory that made CR and SF huge successes." Cary Fukunaga pretty much already confirms this is the case. Not to mention that it's just about the only way they could get Craig back for another film. He wants to make a "significant" film which takes risks and carries dramatic and emotion weight. That was his MO since day 1, and it shows how of a fish out of water he looked handling the jokes in SP.

    You’re citing two very popular films, both critically and financially. But you think if they go back to these films as inspiration that somehow B25 will become messy? Is that what you’re saying? I’m not being sarcastic.


    Yes, because these are 12 and 6 years old respectively. It's not so much "inspiration" as retreading old ground. They were popular for their time and added to the franchise, but things move on and I don't think it makes sense to approach the next film like it's still 2006. Culturally we're in a very different place, and if they want Bond 25 to be a success, it should reflect that.

    But you’re assuming they’re “retreading”. Why?

    I already explained: By sticking too closely to what was successful and original over half a decade ago.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    My point is: I don’t understand why you’re assuming this is what the filmmakers are doing? What are you basing your assumptions on? Have you read the shooting draft? Do you know anyone on this project?
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited December 2018 Posts: 8,395
    peter wrote: »
    My point is: I don’t understand why you’re assuming this is what the filmmakers are doing? What are you basing your assumptions on? Have you read the shooting draft? Do you know anyone on this project?

    I'm basing it on the lukewarm reception to SP, both Boyle and Fukunaga as directorial choices and the belated return of Craig. All of these indicate which direction they are headed.
  • edited December 2018 Posts: 727
    Skyfall feels more modern than Casino Royale simply because Bond sports a smart phone. Everything before the smart phone feels like a past era. It's like the mullet, it defines a time.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    edited December 2018 Posts: 9,509
    Boyle and CF are as different in comparison to each other, as both of them are wildly different to Mendes and Campbell @Mendes4Lyfe !!

    P.S.: Let the man speak for himself on this every topic, and one that is worrying you:
    Genres come with tropes and expectations and in the post-modern era, you can deliver exactly what’s expected of the genre, or you can try to twist it in an intelligent way which subverts the genre but still stays faithful to it,” he said. “So, when you’re drawing from a certain style, you can play with audience expectations while still surprising them — and the nature of creativity is that limitations are often times good things, because when you’re facing the overwhelming vastness of creative potential, to have defined routes to take for a story or style are helpful in determining how far you want to veer from it.

    Indiewire states an interesting comparison between the two directors you mentioned above:
    To some degree, Fukunaga has spent a decade auditioning for the sprawling pressures of the Bond franchise, in addition to its style. As David Ehrlich pointed out in these parts not long ago, Danny Boyle (who was previously set to direct the series’ 25th installment before dropping out) never quite gelled with the distinctive rhythms that have made Bond such an indelible cultural entity: Boyle’s jittery narrative techniques are a world apart from the sleek textures of the best Bond adventures, as well as the cool-as-a-cucumber mannerisms of the character himself. Fukunaga, on the other hand, dwells in such places

    And about keeping with the arc, but still maintaining the characters must "change" (which is not retreading, it's developing what was started in CR):
    In his first Bond movie, ‘Casino Royale,’ he brought an incredible amount of vulnerability and humanity to the character, which was a big shift from Pierce Brosnan’s run. In terms of what I can bring to change the character, Bond is on a character arc that started with ‘Casino Royale,’ and I will be carrying that on. There will be changes, I am sure. As in any story, a character has to change in order [to have] a narrative.”

    Make of his words what you will, but I don't see a man retreading; I'm reading of someone that wants to take the best that was shown in CR and further push it down the road.
  • DonnyDB5DonnyDB5 Buffalo, New York
    Posts: 1,755
    Why is Archivo007 reporting on Instagram Cary Fukunaga has dropped out as director? Please tell me this is some sick joke.
  • edited December 2018 Posts: 17,753
    DonnyDB5 wrote: »
    Why is Archivo007 reporting on Instagram Cary Fukunaga has dropped out as director? Please tell me this is some sick joke.


    Is it April 1st already?
  • Posts: 6,709
    Looks like some sick and really not so good joke. Have you read the rest of it? Ridiculous! So Michael and Barbara and Craig will write the film and direct it? Do these guys up at Archivo007 think we are fools?
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    Today is Spain's version of April fool's day. Just a joke.
  • DonnyDB5DonnyDB5 Buffalo, New York
    Posts: 1,755
    I tried putting some of my Spanish to use. Desperate times, desperate measures.
  • Posts: 17,753
    jake24 wrote: »
    Today is Spain's version of April fool's day. Just a joke.

    Close enough then!
  • Posts: 12,466
    My heart can’t take these kind of jokes - or potential realities! Boyle dropping out was painful enough.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Relaaaax... everything's moving full steam ahead.
  • edited December 2018 Posts: 6,709
    jake24 wrote: »
    Today is Spain's version of April fool's day. Just a joke.

    lol, i live in the country next door and I didn't know that. Damned April fool's sort of days. We can't take any of that now, we're too fragile ;) and traumatised. Still suffering from Boyle's PTSD.
  • DonnyDB5DonnyDB5 Buffalo, New York
    Posts: 1,755
    For real. I saw that & nearly had a panic attack.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Univex wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Today is Spain's version of April fool's day. Just a joke.

    lol, i live in the country next door and I didn't know that. Damned April fool's sort of days. We can't take any of that now, we're too fragile ;) and traumatised. Still suffering from Boyle's PTSD.

    @Univex just read your synopsis of how YOLT could be written; something that always bothered me is how we could depict the Garden of Death and make it realistic... I like what you're doing thus far! You may want to write it all down and copyright what you're doing, my friend!
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    That was pretty amusing I have to say. I actually recall wondering if the Boyle departure was an April Fool's joke on the day as well. The photo gave it away though.
  • Blofeld0064Blofeld0064 Milford, Michigan
    Posts: 243
    I almost had a heart attack there!!
  • Posts: 4,619
    Damn. I was so ready post an angry anti-Barbara-Broccoli tirade!
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,203
    Damn. I was so ready post an angry anti-Barbara-Broccoli tirade!

    Do you keep one on file ? :D
  • Posts: 6,709
    peter wrote: »
    Univex wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Today is Spain's version of April fool's day. Just a joke.

    lol, i live in the country next door and I didn't know that. Damned April fool's sort of days. We can't take any of that now, we're too fragile ;) and traumatised. Still suffering from Boyle's PTSD.

    @Univex just read your synopsis of how YOLT could be written; something that always bothered me is how we could depict the Garden of Death and make it realistic... I like what you're doing thus far! You may want to write it all down and copyright what you're doing, my friend!

    Thank you, @Peter, my friend. Very glad you liked it, means a lot! I'm currently working on a new novel, two short stories and a poetry book, so I'm a bit short on time. But if Barbara was on the phone, I'd trow the other stuff on the proverbial drawer ;) immediately. Cheers, my friend.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    edited December 2018 Posts: 9,509
    Keep writing @Univex ! I look forward to reading more of your work. You can rely on me as an editor, if you want an extra set of eyes before sending projects out.

    P.S. free of charge!, and ask @ColonelSun how I dig into this aspect of the craft, lol!
  • Posts: 12,466
    DonnyDB5 wrote: »
    For real. I saw that & nearly had a panic attack.
    I almost had a heart attack there!!

    Me. Too. We need this thing to get into production before any of us pass out!
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