Then and Now; This Week - Spectre

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  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,599
    I was absolutely blown away when I first saw it opening weekend. I ended up seeing it four more times afterwards in the cinema. It automatically skyrocketed to my #2 spot and will more than likely stay there.

    Today- It is still one of my favourites, however maybe due to the fact that I've seen it probably more than any other Bond film, it has lost a little excitement for me.

    Then-2 I wish I could tie, but just can't
    Now-
    Tie- 1
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    royale65 wrote: »
    I aim to please @Thunderfinger

    You always do.

    Everyone should aim to please Thunderfinger.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    That's cause we know what you can do with your little Thunderfinger
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,250
    Definite tie. Loved it the first time, still love it today. This years marks the 10th B-day of this splendid movie and it's something I for one with celebrate.

    Then-2
    Now-
    Tie- 2
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,722
    It's one of my favorites now, but...

    Then-3
    Now-
    Tie- 2

    It's a then because it was my first ever Bond film on the big screen, so it was a special experience that I've never been able to replicate.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,999
    Back in 2006, I was actually optimistic.

    Then-4
    Now-
    Tie- 2

    Now I see it as, amongst other things, the start of EON stepping away from Bond, and making other films.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,328
    Casino Royale
    Then
    I always thought Craig would be an interesting Bond. I'd seen the trailers and the jumping from crane to crane took my breath away. So I was already really optimistic. The PTS didn't let me down, and the titles blew me away. This sure was Bond far closer to what Fleming had written then anything I'd seen in the cinema's before. I did go and see it four times while travelling around the world, on 4 different continents.

    Now
    Hence this film will always be very special to me. Is it the best? No, I still think FRWL and Thunderball are better, but a top-3 film it sure is. The crane jumping still gets me, and it has some extremely Bondian moments, even though he's still learning.

    Then-4
    Now-1
    Tie-3
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    Any more views before we move on to QoS chaps?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2016 Posts: 23,883
    Casino Royale

    Then
    CR was one of the greatest theatre experiences I have ever had, along with GE. It restored my faith in the franchise, which had been seriously damaged as a result of the previous two entries in particular.
    Brilliant from start to finish, this film didn't put a foot wrong as far as I was concerned. Even David Arnold, who I was never was a fan of, delivered a fantastic score against the odds that echoed and channeled Barry.
    This film has received plaudits since it came out, and it deserves every bit of it as far as I'm concerned. Near perfection in Bond movie making.
    Daniel Craig delivered a refreshing and signature James Bond performance for the ages here.

    Now
    I last watched this on my pre-SP Bondathon late last year and it hasn't lost any of its lustre for me. Even after watching all 23 (at the time) films, when I came to CR I could tell it was special compared to most. It remains for me a superior achievement & one of a handful of Bond films that defines what the series is about.

    I dislike going for the tie, but I have to in this case. Whenever I need to appreciate how great the legend of James Bond can be, this is one of the films I put in the blu ray player.

    Then - 4
    Now - 1
    Tie - 4
  • When I first saw Casino Royale I was very disappointed. Where was the baddie's lair and the plan for world domination? I felt like the card game went on forever. On subsequent viewings I realise we see very little of the card game.

    Since then, my tastes have err.... sophisticated somewhat and I appreciate CR a lot more. The biggest flaw which was pointed out to me and now mars my view of it is that Bond wins by sheer dumb luck. In a terribly contrived finale, each player has a progressively more brilliant hand than the other. They should made it so that Bond won through clever cheat or bluff. Also, the shootout is Venice was an unwelcome action scene.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    Boom! It's only another Bond epic!

    Quantum of Solace

    Then –
    Unlike Casino Royale, I was not terribly impressed with the promotional work on Quantum of Solace. A tired revenge film? That would put lie to a quantum of solace, surely?

    I only took two friends to see Quantum of Solace when it was released in cinemas, compared to six for Casino Royale, and four for Die Another Day. So, I was already cheesed off.

    When Quantum of Solace finished, I was underwhelmed. Two long years, for this? It was over as quick as a flash. Especially when one compares it to Casino Royale. The editing was confusing and quick, as well. I needed to see it again, maybe. I remember feeling disappointed when Bond and M are interrogating Mr. White. Good, I thought, a really meaty dialogue scene. But it was interrupted for another action scene. I wanted answers to Casino Royale!

    One friend loved it, and the other friend wasn't overly enamoured. Perhaps the marketing has to take some share of the blame. Instead of a balls-to-the wall revenge flick, we had a rather sombre, even thoughtful film, which moved with the pace of a bullet.

    A couple of weeks passed, and I was going for a job interview. When I got back to Bath, I had a couple of hours to kill. So, on the spur of the moment, I decided to see Quantum of Solace again. Imagine the staff at Odeon, seeing a chap, all suited and booted, walking like Connery, seeing a Bond film on his own. Anyway, I enjoyed Quantum the second time around. I was expecting the crash cutting editing this time. And underneath that crazy editing was buried a strong film.

    Now –
    I've seen Quantum over half a dozen times – and it is still getting better. I love the quieter, character moments; the way the Camille is a warning for Bond, to not get caught up in vengeance, for example. Forster delivers a slick film, where the highlight is a subtle character study from Craig.


    Then -
    Now - 1
    Tie -
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,250
    When I went to see QOS, I wanted CR 2.0 but felt buggered into a CR 0.5 instead. Same Bond, same world, but brought to us in a very poor cut. Furthermore, the completely wasted character of Fields felt like such a Brosnan-era mistake, it angered me. I had seen the bright light two years before, but shadows were already thrown over the entire thing. It reminded me of what had happened in the mid 90s, when GE had me excited for the awesome new take on Bond that neither TND nor any of the other Brosnan Bonds were ever able to duplicate.

    Worst of all, QOS was the first Bond film that made me stand up after the end credits and say, "wait, it's over already?" A Bond film that played barely over 90 minutes was an insult. Say what you want about MR or DAF or even TMWTGG, but at least they provide a lot more content. I'm not saying poor material stretched to two hours is better than good material squeezed into 90 minutes, but I prefer my Bond film enjoyable and long and in 2008, QOS delivered neither. It was in some sense the antithesis to CR. The foul stench of AWTD made things even worse...

    Yet after two of three more viewings, I began to see some of the light again. QOS really does pay off after multiple viewings. Its inherent problems will most likely never go away, but I can appreciate the good things too. Great Bond, underrated score, underestimated villain and some incredibly cool stylistic choices make QOS a pretty good Bond film for me now that I've grown "accustomed" to it.

    Then -
    Now - 2
    Tie -

  • gumboltgumbolt Now with in-office photocopier
    Posts: 153
    Then - Growing up in the 80s, it was always a thrill when ITV (in its many regional guises back then) showed a Bond movie. Sunday nights and Bank Holidays in particular. The Bond "seasons" were three or four films over as many weeks, with little or no continuity or themes in the selection. It was a big, prime time deal. My little self would watch after my bath, sprawled in my PJs on the living room carpet. I can still remember the commercial break captions - properly designed for the movie, not just the channel logo with the film title typed on. And the best bit was the opening titles - they would, pre-widescreen TV, bring on the black strips for the titles and then expand (or squash) the picture at the end. I used to be curious as to when they would end and begin the effect - the handling of Octopussy was a particular high point.
    Now - Since DVD I have stopped watching Bond films on TV. ITV still cut them and they don't seem to respect them as much as they used to with the scheduling. The last real hurrah was in 1999 when they showed them all in order, with TND world premiere the finale. Different era. We're all consumers now, the films are digital content. The romance has gone!
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,250
    @gumbolt, so where do you stand on QOS, sir? :p
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,599
    Then- I enjoyed immensely in theaters back in 08. It was a lot shorter and I left the theater thinking it was as good if not better than CR

    Now-Not as much as back in 08. Everytime I watch it, I always look at it at what could it have been.

    Then- 1
    Now- 2
    Tie-
  • gumboltgumbolt Now with in-office photocopier
    Posts: 153
    Oh I've just realised that this thread is about the movie Quantum of Solace (2008) rather than a nostalgic "then and now" thread about the quantum of solace we get from thinking about old ITV transmission techniques. Damn my drink and my pills, barely holding me together.
  • gumboltgumbolt Now with in-office photocopier
    edited January 2016 Posts: 153
    Then - I was baffled and disappointed by QOS. It bored me at times. Left the cinema in a bad way.
    Now - It has improved on subsequent viewings and certainly is not the worst Bond movie, so it has improved in that regard. It looks fabulous but its missing something still - I think script and direction were below par.
    So much, much better now.
    Then 1
    Now 5
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,250
    I hope we'll do NSNA, @Birdleson. :) I'd love to. :)
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited January 2016 Posts: 17,823
    I hated it on my first viewing. Now it's one of my top ten. How things change...
    Then - 1
    Now - 6
    Tie -

  • gumboltgumbolt Now with in-office photocopier
    Posts: 153
    Hope that edit worked @Birdleson. Thanks for the tip.
  • edited January 2016 Posts: 1,098
    I won't say here what i really think about QOS, but what i will say it was probably the most disappointing cinematic experience i have ever had, and even today the film is barely any better to watch on the small screen. :(
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2016 Posts: 23,883
    QoS

    Then
    I so anticipated this film prior to its release, as the follow up to CR, which literally took my breath away. I remember leaving the theatre after my first watch not entirely satisfied, but not entirely dissatisfied either - it was a strange feeling. I knew there was a rather good film underneath it all, but it had gone by so fast and in such a blur that I hadn't really taken it all in.
    All I knew after that first experience was that it looked fantastic (the colours were classic Bond and popped on the screen), the characters were interesting (but in a different way from CR), and Daniel Craig had completely solidified his position as James Bond in my mind (in fact, Daniel Craig was the best thing about this film I thought, by far).
    Being a Bourne fan at the time, I could see the obvious influences, and shrugged: well that must be the direction they're going to go with from now on with Bond...not entirely my cup of tea, but at least the car chase and the Slate fight were worthy, I thought.

    Now
    As with many here, this film continues to grow on me with every watch.
    The quick edits are still annoying (only because I truly believe the film would be a clear top 10 for many including myself if we could only see more of some of the amazing action sequences, including the rooftop chase at Siena) but are more tolerable.
    I love its brief running time, its sliced to the bone no nonsense plot and its amazing cinematography (in non-action scenes at least).
    Daniel Craig is still the best thing about this film, and I actually think this is his last great performance as James Bond - there is a raw energy about his portrayal here, a determination, strength of purpose and vigour, that Sam Mendes has not been able to really capture imho.

    So this is definitely a Now.

    Then - 1
    Now - 7
    Tie -
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,823
    bondjames wrote: »
    Daniel Craig is still the best thing about this film, and I actually think this is his last great performance as James Bond - there is a raw energy about his portrayal here, a determination, strength of purpose and vigour, that Sam Mendes has not been able to really capture imho.
    Agreed. However in SPECTRE Dan rocked the casbah with his ease in the role. It's like he didn't give a fork any more, and that SO worked for the character IMO.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,823
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I disagree. I feel he lost his way in SPECTRE and probably is the major factor for my feeling ill at ease with the film.
    We must agree to disagree then, because IMHO Dan's just been great in every film- even in SF which is my least favourite.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I haven't minded him in the four he's done, but I think he's just brilliant in the first two. So darn authentic. Reminds me of early Connery, Dalton and to a lesser extent early Moore.

    He just seems less energetic or dangerous in the Mendes films. I realize he's playing an older Bond, but still.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,823
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I have a visceral reaction
    My visceral reaction was "YEAH, BABY!!!" :))
  • Aziz_FekkeshAziz_Fekkesh Royale-les-Eaux
    Posts: 403
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I thought he was his most "Bondian" in SKYFALL, but I probably enjoyed his performance most in the first two. In SPECTRE, from the moment we first see his face, actually before that, the way he sashays up those stairs in that tuxedo and mask, his portrayal made me very uncomfortable. There is just something weird, almost prissy, about Craig in that movie. I have a visceral reaction each time I see it.

    More prissy than Moore in AVTAK or Brosnan in TWINE?

    As far as visceral reaction, I have no clue what you're talking about here. Craig was absolute aces in SP. A great, subtle performance at ease that is still efficient and deadly.

  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    I liked QOS well enough when I finally bought the dvd (didn t get to see this one at the cinema), but I wasn t wowed by it, as I had been by CR. Just for that, it felt a bit disappointing.

    Now I enjoy it a lot more, not comparing it to the others. It is its own thing, and that is a damn fine Bond film.

    Then-1
    Now-8
    Tie-

  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    Great thoughts chaps. And yes dear @Birdleson, we'll be doing NSNA soon..
  • Posts: 9,853
    While I don't comment on this thread I have to sadly admit Quantum of Solace was better when it first was released then it is now not that I don't like the film any less. I love the movie the issue is then there was so much promise regarding Quantum the orgnization and so many questions and while the questions were basically answered in Spectre they were answered so poorly that it kind of tanrishs Quantum of Solace.
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