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Then and Now; This Week - Spectre

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  • GettlerGettler USA
    Posts: 326
    I remember seeing this one in theaters. My first Bond film on the big screen. My brother and I took my Grandfather (long time Bond fan) to see it and sure enough, it surpassed my expectations. It was a great audience too. People cheered at the DB5, laughed at the jokes and such. It was very exciting. Now, every time I watch it at home I'm still captivated by the film. It's a refreshing experience for me. The cinematography and the score (don't care what you say about Newman), the acting and what not all blend perfectly.

    for me, it's a tie.
  • tanaka123tanaka123
    Posts: 4,325
    Gettler wrote: »
    I remember seeing this one in theaters. My first Bond film on the big screen. My brother and I took my Grandfather (long time Bond fan) to see it and sure enough, it surpassed my expectations. It was a great audience too. People cheered at the DB5, laughed at the jokes and such. It was very exciting. Now, every time I watch it at home I'm still captivated by the film. It's a refreshing experience for me. The cinematography and the score (don't care what you say about Newman), the acting and what not all blend perfectly.

    for me, it's a tie.

    Yeah I really liked Newman's score too. Just a shame that he pretty much copied and pasted it for Spectre.
  • GettlerGettler USA
    Posts: 326
    Yes, there were recurring motifs and what not, but that didn't bother me too much. Could he have done more original stuff? Sure. But is the SP score still good? Yes it is. Then again I am a sucker for the ambient sound he's brought to the Film.
  • tanaka123tanaka123
    Posts: 4,325
    Gettler wrote: »
    Yes, there were recurring motifs and what not, but that didn't bother me too much. Could he have done more original stuff? Sure. But is the SP score still good? Yes it is. Then again I am a sucker for the ambient sound he's brought to the Film.

    Yeah it's not a bad score by any means. A film is supposed to take you into its world and this took me out. Right from the PTS I was sat in the cinema thinking, isn't that from Skyfall. It was just annoying having that punctuate the movie, it took me out of it rather than drawing me in.
  • GettlerGettler USA
    Posts: 326
    I would like to think Newman did some alternates that were original, but if anything, it'd be a different sound to the same cue.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I found the SF score to be very impressive personally, and it fit the film like a glove.

    I liked the ambient sound that Newman brought to SP as well, but like the film, I found the score generally to be quite lacklustre, with nowhere near the panache that he brought to his SF effort. It was a redux, but without the flair.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    edited January 2016 Posts: 7,314
    I can remember being disappointed when "Bond 23" was delayed. Craig wasn't getting any younger and there was some concern that his tenure might be shortened over this. There was even some faint chatter about losing him altogether if this went on long enough, a la Dalton. Fortunately, that didn't happen and Skyfall was a rousing success. Was it worth the wait? I'm not sure. Who knows how differently things might have turned out without the delay.

    I was very surprised to see such unanimous praise from the critics. Hearing phrases like "it's the best Bond ever" certainly made me skeptical. Indeed, I told myself to temper my expectations. It worked. Even though I had a few quibbles here and there, I ended up leaving the theater pretty satisfied. It also helped that this was my girlfriend's first Bond film in the theater. She was so excited and I am so grateful that she has taken a huge interest in the series.

    To my surprise, Skyfall still holds up well today. I keep waiting for it to slip in my rankings but it never does. I can remember at the time that I enjoyed it as a one off story but didn't want to see another Bond film like it again. I suppose I'll save the events leading up to SP for another time. For now, I'd just like to say that I still enjoy SF just as much as I did on that first viewing in Nov. 2012.

    Seeing as a couple of people didn't update the scores, let's do just that with my vote included.

    Then- 3
    Now- 4
    Tie- 9
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,204
    I remember 2010's announcement that Bond23 would be delayed already worsened which was then for me a pretty crummy year. Finally sometime in late summer there was a comment by Mickey G somewhere that it was looking like things would get rolling soon, and before long it was announced Bond23 would be ready for release in 2012...followed by a new Bond film every two years.
    When SF was released it was huge. I had already known that Harris was Moneypenny, M would die and the gunbarrel would be once again be crappily tacked on to the end (thanks to the Mi6 website), so I knew what to expect in those regards.

    However, I wasn't disappointed and loved it, tying with CR as my fave Craig film and in my overall top 10. Many people I knew thought this was the definitive Bond film of all time. Then again, in 1985, most people I knew thought AVTAK was the greatest Bond film of all time. Interesting thing about SF for me was that it didn't look the same in the different theatres I saw it in. The 1st digital print I saw was washed out and bland looking. Next time you pop in your blu-ray, scale back the color to about half and you'll see what I mean. Then I saw it at the Cinerama and it was rich and old school looking. Beautiful. The audience cheered during the DB5 sequence and some even cried during the Dench death scene. Everyone was engaged in the the film.
    These days I find myself appreciating SF somewhat less, feeling it was a bit overrated. In addition, It's not one I pop in repeatedly like I can do for the early films. Next to SP it's probably my least watched Bond film. Still solid, but hard to really rank with the others. Maybe once the blu-ray for SP comes out I'll have another Bondathon and be able to re evaluate it.

    Then: 8
    Now: 6
    so I'll say
    THEN.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    Thanks chaps
  • ForYourEyesOnlyForYourEyesOnly In the untained cradle of the heavens
    Posts: 1,984
    Skyfall? Then for sure. The film worked a lot better in the cinema than it did in my house.

    Then- 5
    Now- 4
    Tie- 9
  • M_BaljeM_Balje Amsterdam, Netherlands
    Posts: 4,534
    On 12 or 13 December it was 20 years a go that i have seen Goldeneye.
    The 7th actor mabey can make change to beat it, but it will hard to beat that GE whas my first Bond movie in the cinema. The whole cast must be good (mabey unknown/no complanes) and good story and you must see movie at 15 times In 20 years. Goldeneye get ''Tie'' from me.

    I defend my self being afraid to dislike i haven't watched Bond movies in whyle and i think it a whyle a go i watched Goldeneye. Don't vergot that moost people who playing in Bond movies or are seen in the documentries over the years are dead or no longer part of it. I think it be nice if Daniel Craig left, we get good some good features about his era, but also look back to Brosnan era.

    Tomorrow Never Dies & The World Is Not Enough: Tie.
    Die Another Day: Then. Only 5-6 times in 13 years.

    Casino Royale: Tie. Then i hated, stil hated for big part. I like Twine parts, some things are typical Bond but dislike/not understand the story. The violence be problem. But overall i prefer CR above Skyfall. Skyfall worse Bond movie ever, i dislike it more then DAD. I iam in consider to rank 24/24 as worse Bond movie ever made. QOS: Then. Skyfall: Tie.

    Then- 5
    Now- 4
    Tie- 10
  • daltondalton
    Posts: 1,631
    Then- I wasn't too terribly fond of Skyfall upon its initial release. The plotholes and other issues with the film really kept me from enjoying the film, as I remember sitting in the theater picking apart Silva's omnipotent scheme rather than enjoying the film. Subsequent viewings on Blu-ray were much the same.

    Now- Having just watched Skyfall a couple of weeks ago for the first time in more than a year, my opinion of it has drastically changed. For whatever reason, the issues I had with the film didn't bother me in the latest rewatch. Maybe it was the abysmal story and script for Spectre that got me to forgive Skyfall's comparatively meager shortcomings. Whatever the reason, though, I'd now say that this is easily a Top 10 Bond film.

    Then - 3
    Now - 4
    Tie - 2
  • AstonLotusAstonLotus
    Posts: 1,394
    Then - Critics were calling Skyfall the '' BEST BOND EVER!!! '' but i was wise enough to realise that english critics are bias when it comes to Bond and say that with nearly every Bond film.I saw the film with low expectations and was still very disappointed.I couldnt understand what the fuss was about.Was i the only one who noiticed what an absolutely ridiculous screenplay this had? How silly it was that Bond survives the opening sequence? How laugh inducing the Home Alone climax was?

    Now - My opinion hasnt changed.It is definetly the worst Bond film ever in my book.Spectre is no masterpiece and not much better but i got SOME entertainment value out of it.

    Then - 1.

    Now -1.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    edited February 2016 Posts: 4,423
    Correct scores for Skyfall -


    Then- 5
    Now- 4
    Tie- 9

    I have no idea what the above post voted, so screw it.

    Never Say Never Again

    Then – Whilst in the middle of ITV's Bond-a-thon, I was expecting to see the final Roger Moore film – I heard he had done seven! - when they showed a Sean Connery outing, NSNA. Most perplexing! I checked out the TV guide that week; an unofficial Bond film, starring our Seannery.

    I was bit perturbed to see a Bond film, without any of the usual tropes. I could have got into it, yet it was so dull. Bits that I enjoyed were Connery performance, the health clinic scrap and.....

    Now – Try as I might, I never really appreciated NSNA, despite Connery's portrayal.

    Then -
    Now -
    Tie - 1

    We'll be moving on to our latest Bondian epic, Spectre, in March!
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    I saw NSNA before I saw OP, and also before I had seen TB.

    I thought it was brilliant and that it was awesome to see Connery return to the role. He was in top form throughout. Much of the cast was inspired, or at least I thought so back then.

    With the years that initial excitement over an alternative Bond film and the return of Connery has diminished. Qualitywise, TB was a much better effort.

    Then -1
    Now -
    Tie - 1

  • Mathis1Mathis1
    Posts: 7,532
    I saw NSNA on St Stephens Day in 1983. it was supposed to go head to head with Octopussy, but they got cold feet or something. I came away feeling very bored and let down by Connerys return especially since Connery had a big hand in its production, ( choosing Director, actors and bringing in Dick Clement and Ian LeFrenais to "polish" Lorenzo Semple Jnr script. OP beat it hands down, quality wise! Save for Connery and Barbara Carreras sexy, bonkers Fatima Blush (who Famke Janssen, I reckon, paid homage to as Onnatop in GE, to a lesser extent) and Alec Mckeown as Q, it was a pretty dull affair. Still, I'd rather watch it than DAD, so, if I was placing it in my list it would be 23! Today, it hasn't improved any. Connery and Carrera and McKeown, the film, dull, with unexciting action. TB was indeed far better.
    Then - 1
    Now -
    Tie - 2
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    bondjames wrote: »
    Casino Royale

    Then
    CR was one of the greatest theatre experiences I have ever had, along with GE[/b]

    Yes CR was and still is a top 3 Bond film. GE for me was and still is borderline average and inferior to the Dalton era.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I thought he was his most "Bondian" in SKYFALL, but I probably enjoyed his performance most in the first two. In SPECTRE, from the moment we first see his face, actually before that, the way he sashays up those stairs in that tuxedo and mask, his portrayal made me very uncomfortable. There is just something weird, almost prissy, about Craig in that movie. I have a visceral reaction each time I see it.

    DC's best performance and best film is CR. Hands down. He clearly read the book beforehand.
  • JohnHammond73JohnHammond73 Lancashire, UK
    Posts: 4,151
    Not keen then, not keen now. SC and BC are decent but Edward Fox I can't stand and Kim Basinger a bit weak.

    A tie....

    Then - 1
    Now -
    Tie - 3
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Always thought NSNA was inferior to TB. BUT it still has Sean and is a decent Bond film. Weaknesses include the score and Rowan Atkinson.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    NSNA

    Then:
    The first time I saw this film on a bad VHS copy I thought it was a complete PoS. I was truly disappointed. What the hell was this, I thought? Boring as can be, with a horrendous score, misery inducing title song, no gunbarrel, an older Connery and none of the flair and panache of EON's benchmark original. OP blew this out of the water, I thought. Moore was king. Connery was a has-been.

    Now:
    That experience was so disappointing, that I didn't come back to NSNA until a few years ago (I think it was around the time of the 50th anniversary) when I purchased it on blu ray.

    I still think it's a weak effort overall (based on what it could have been) but my impressions of it are much better now I'll admit.

    Why? Well, because I now know what to expect. Also, I see now that EON themselves have indeed cribbed from it for their more recent efforts. Onatopp is very much based on Blush (I recalled that the first time I saw GE in the theatre actually). Almaric's insecure and jealous Greene from QoS has shades of Klaus Maria Brandauer's Largo. Older, out of date, irrelevant 007 was done again in SF. New M was done recently with GE (Dench) and then SF (Fiennes). Finally, the Jinx beach scene in DAD followed by spirited sex mirrored the Blush encounter (when she's water skiing).

    Additionally, some of the scores we've had in the past 20 yrs, while not quite of the same poor quality as NSNA, are certainly closer to Legrand's work than Barry's.

    So this is definitely a Now for me.

    Then - 1
    Now - 1
    Tie - 3
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Sean is still better in the role in 83 than Roger though (OP). I still love Rog, but he's only there with Eon because Sean quit.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,250
    Never Say Never Again

    The kid version of myself truly enjoyed this film because

    a) it had but a low bar set for films
    b) it didn't understand what puddle of mud this abysmal movie came from

    Then - 2
    Now - 2
    Tie - 3
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Harsh Dimi. Harsh.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    Saw the movie upon release in the cinema, it was a great year to be 007 fan, two movies by the best two Bonds yet. And both delivered.

    Then - 2
    Now - 3
    Tie - 3
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    I first saw NSNA on television at some point in the 80's. I was so young that I had no idea it wasn't an official part of the series. It had Sean Connery in it so why would I think anything else? I do remember being confused by seeing a different M, Moneypenny and Q. Where did these people come from? However, beyond that, I enjoyed pretty much everything else about it. It was just another enjoyable James Bond adventure.

    Now, after learning the history behind it and seeing it through an adult's eyes, I don't enjoy it quite as much. It's not as bad as some people make it out to be though. On the whole, the cast is pretty good. Brandauer and Carrera were a great pair of villains. Bernie Casey is an underrated Felix Leiter. The whole thing would have been irrelevant without Connery, who seemed to be genuinely satisfied to be playing Bond for the first time in almost twenty years.

    With that being said, it's not a film that I care to watch all that often. I'm going to have to give this a THEN.

    Then - 3
    Now - 3
    Tie - 3
  • Crazysoul95Crazysoul95
    Posts: 3,336
    Then - 3
    Now - 3
    Tie - 4
  • ThighsOfXeniaThighsOfXenia
    Posts: 1,596
    Then - 4
    Now - 3
    Tie - 4

    Unfortunately.
  • tanaka123tanaka123
    edited February 2016 Posts: 4,325
    Terrible then and terrible now. And I mean terrible, not even in a DAD way, which I still really enjoy watching. I taped it off the TV back in 1999 when ITV had a Bondathon and after a couple of viewings taped over it.

    Then - 4
    Now - 3
    Tie - 5
  • ForYourEyesOnlyForYourEyesOnly In the untained cradle of the heavens
    Posts: 1,984
    I don't think this film has changed over time. Horrendous. Completely outclassed by Octopussy. All this does is sully the memory of Connery (and Thunderball).

    Then - 4
    Now - 3
    Tie - 6
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