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Does E = mc² or mc³? The Science in Bond Films Thread

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  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Could use more of that 1970s-era science.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Physiology, I think. Open for correction if someone has specialized experience and knowledge.
    But in TOMORROW NEVER DIES, OO7 performing mouth to mouth resuscitation on Wai Lin underwater won't work.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Could this real world stunt be worked into a Bond film.



    Longer version here. youtu.be/fiFbDF90MvI
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,266
    It seems more like something for a Michael Bay film, but yes. Why not? :)
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    Could this real world stunt be worked into a Bond film.



    Longer version here. youtu.be/fiFbDF90MvI

    That s cool, but most people on this forum would whine and moan and whine about the attrocious cgi.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    edited November 2017 Posts: 13,941
    Yeah, maybe so. A real world stunt that's too over the top for James Bond.

    As if.
    ED-TY07101-2__83935.1407189684.300.300.jpg?c=2
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Is that for real? It looks it but once it's on the wall it looks too perfect.

    I don't think it's inconceivable to put in a Bond film but the difficulty would be coming up with a contrivance to set the ramps up in the script. The broken bridge in TMWTGG one thing but a workman leaving these two perfectly angled ramps up against a wall for no reason I can conceive of a bit far fetched.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    edited November 2017 Posts: 13,941
    My thought was the architecture at the bottom has the curve/slope equivalent to the ramp up the wall.
    (Also good for skateboarders. Needs a shorter vehicle than a full sized Aston Martin, though.)
    Running up the wall (car chase here) allows the unexpected escape plan.
    Where the wall is the side of a bridge, OO7 goes up then over and down onto another roadway.
    Between could be a river or railway or other impassable obstacle.

    Of course, I don't buy the idea the latest Bond films don't allow for these concepts.
    013C27C2889C0024FF8080813C277FE1.jpg
    Aston Martin Cygnet
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    new%2Bscientist%2Bjune%2B79%2Bjames%2Bbond%2B007%2Bmoonraker.jpg
  • barryt007barryt007
    Posts: 19,339
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    Physiology, I think. Open for correction if someone has specialized experience and knowledge.
    But in TOMORROW NEVER DIES, OO7 performing mouth to mouth resuscitation on Wai Lin underwater won't work.

    That ending really pisses me off.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    My thought was the architecture at the bottom has the curve/slope equivalent to the ramp up the wall.
    (Also good for skateboarders. Needs a shorter vehicle than a full sized Aston Martin, though.)
    Running up the wall (car chase here) allows the unexpected escape plan.
    Where the wall is the side of a bridge, OO7 goes up then over and down onto another roadway.
    Between could be a river or railway or other impassable obstacle.

    Of course, I don't buy the idea the latest Bond films don't allow for these concepts.
    013C27C2889C0024FF8080813C277FE1.jpg
    Aston Martin Cygnet

    If they built a bridge specially and designed the ramp in as part of the architecture it could work.

    But not with that car which is an utter disgrace to the badge. Just a crappy off the shelf Toyota IQ in an Aston skin which they brought out so the emissions across the range complied with some EU law.

    http://www.carbuyer.co.uk/reviews/aston-martin/cygnet/hatchback/review

    Bond would not be seen dead in this abortion of a car.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Yeah, okay. They could find something else.
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  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    So GE's plane catch stunt was possible then, just.

    I like the way they swerve into the opening in the plane. It could have gotten quite messy if they'd caught the propeller instead.


    https://www.thenational.ae/lifestyle/watch-james-bond-style-base-jumpers-leap-off-mountain-into-plane-1.680030
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,266
    Very interesting! Thank you for that, @bondjames.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    My pleasure @DarthDimi. It's very well filmed. They apparently needed 100 tries to make it work and of course the plane wasn't free falling as it was in the film. I'm still not convinced that the scenario as depicted in GE could be done.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Very awesome, @bondjames, I just saw it posted on another thread with a YouTube link.

    I get both GOLDENEYE and DIE ANOTHER DAY vibes on this one, in good ways.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    Thanks @RichardTheBruce. I edited the post above to include the youtube clip. You're right, I'd totally forgotten about the DAD Switchblades. From what I understand those don't exist (although I'm sure the US military wouldn't tell us if they did).

    Those guys are pretty brave to swerve into the cabin like that. I'm sure it would have been quite painful had they slammed into the fuselage (which they probably did in the many failed attempts they made).
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Switchblades yes, but just as much I was referring to the surfer inserts in the pre-title opening. The striking reality of more than one human being executing these stunts is pretty compelling.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,941
    Questionable science in DIE ANOTHER DAY, don't think it's mentioned here so far.

    Colonel Moon says his hovercraft will "float right over" the minefields in the DMZ.

    Wikipedia says:
    Hovercraft use blowers to produce a large volume of air below the hull that is slightly above atmospheric pressure. The pressure difference between the higher pressure air below the hull and lower pressure ambient air above it produces lift, which causes the hull to float above the running surface. For stability reasons, the air is typically blown through slots or holes around the outside of a disk- or oval-shaped platform, giving most hovercraft a characteristic rounded-rectangle shape. Typically this cushion is contained within a flexible "skirt", which allows the vehicle to travel over small obstructions without damage.

    So i'm thinking the high-pressure air below the hull is a force applied downward. Which would easily trigger any land mines.

    That or the skirt running around the craft. They do look great on screen, though.

    29964.jpg
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    Questionable science in DIE ANOTHER DAY, don't think it's mentioned here so far.

    Colonel Moon says his hovercraft will "float right over" the minefields in the DMZ.

    Wikipedia says:
    Hovercraft use blowers to produce a large volume of air below the hull that is slightly above atmospheric pressure. The pressure difference between the higher pressure air below the hull and lower pressure ambient air above it produces lift, which causes the hull to float above the running surface. For stability reasons, the air is typically blown through slots or holes around the outside of a disk- or oval-shaped platform, giving most hovercraft a characteristic rounded-rectangle shape. Typically this cushion is contained within a flexible "skirt", which allows the vehicle to travel over small obstructions without damage.

    So i'm thinking the high-pressure air below the hull is a force applied downward. Which would easily trigger any land mines.

    That or the skirt running around the craft. They do look great on screen, though.

    29964.jpg

    Very true. I've always thought this odd as something must be supporting the weight of the hovercraft. Newton's third law seems to indicate that the column of air would exert a downward force equal to that of the hovercraft and thus surely trigger the mines?
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,339
    It depends on the mines. Nice link here:
    https://science.howstuffworks.com/landmine4.htm

    I always thought these were anti-tank mines, or meant to be, but as they are Bounding (bouncing betty) mines (same link, few pages previous) they must be anti personell. In which case the hovercraft story makes even less sense.

    The jump in the plane has been done before (allthough not from a mountain top!) without the squirrel suits (or whatever they're called). Indeed the part that makes it shoddy is the bad background projection and the rather odd position Bond takes in the plane itself.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,266
    I wouldn't take any vehicle driving or hovering over landmines to be frank. No matter how sensitive the mines are, any unpredicted force or pressure peaks could set it off.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,339
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    I wouldn't take any vehicle driving or hovering over landmines to be frank. No matter how sensitive the mines are, any unpredicted force or pressure peaks could set it off.

    Well there's just a lot wrong with that scene. The mines are anti-personell, they go off, send a charge upwards which explodes and sends schrapnell around. Lovely hovercrafts then, with open cockpits thet protect... absolutely against nothing. If the hovercrafts 'float' over anti-tank mines, which I doubt, they certainly will let the ant-personell ones go off. And then there's the shooting of the mines.....
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    The Mythbusters tested this. DAD actually got it right, the mines wouldn't be triggered.

    Much more testing went into the design of the weight sensors (which were used in place of actual mines) than is shown in this video. Also, in the full episode they repeated the test with the sensors calibrated for anti-personnel weight, and they still didn't go off. This is admittedly a much smaller hovercraft than in the film, but since it's floating on a cushion of air the concern is not weight, but PSI. Although a larger hovercraft would weigh more, that weight would be spread out over a larger area. I'm no expert on the subject of hovercrafts, but I do have some personal experience;
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,339
    Thanks for that @BMW_with_missiles , seems I was wrong, increadable! Now if someone could tell me why Bond is shooting at these anti-personell mines I'd be very grateful!
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    CommanderRoss wrote: »
    Thanks for that @BMW_with_missiles , seems I was wrong, increadable! Now if someone could tell me why Bond is shooting at these anti-personell mines I'd be very grateful!

    @CommanderRoss My theory on that has always been that Bond was firing at the mines to cause them to damage the hovercrafts behind him, using the delay between the charge firing into the air and it exploding to his advantage. I doubt the delay would be that long in real life though, and he would likely just be blowing up his own vehicle.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,339
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    CommanderRoss wrote: »
    Thanks for that @BMW_with_missiles , seems I was wrong, increadable! Now if someone could tell me why Bond is shooting at these anti-personell mines I'd be very grateful!

    @CommanderRoss My theory on that has always been that Bond was firing at the mines to cause them to damage the hovercrafts behind him, using the delay between the charge firing into the air and it exploding to his advantage. I doubt the delay would be that long in real life though, and he would likely just be blowing up his own vehicle.

    Ah, that reasoning makes sense. I didn't get it from the film, but as the sequence actually makes sense I'll see when I watch that film next time if it corresponds to the filming. Thanks again, never too long on a forum to learn ;-)
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,266
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    new%2Bscientist%2Bjune%2B79%2Bjames%2Bbond%2B007%2Bmoonraker.jpg

    @RichardTheBruce
    Where can I find that thing? I wants it; I needs it. My precious.
  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 6,023
    From GE

    It's impossible to mix blanks and real rounds in a semi automatic or full automatic gun. Blanks don't have enough power to pull back the slide, and need a blank plug to do so. Use a real round after that and... Well' I wouldn't want to be the shooter. More infuriati'g, the new MacGuyver series made the same mistake.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blank-firing_adaptor
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,266
    Ow, interesting, @Gerard. I didn't know that.
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