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Comments
I agree with you.
It doesn't sit right with me too.
Yes! Exactly!
I don’t find myself upset either, it’s just a criticism I have in an otherwise decent movie.
No apologies needed! I understood perfectly what you meant.
;)
Yes, it used in both CR and LALD.
Going forward, we don't need callbacks. The Bond theme and the characters who support Bond will be callback enough. The new Bond doesn't need to recall events from someone else's timeline.
Exactly, you nailed it!
I'd liked to see Bond drive an Alfa Romeo (although not the new one, but the most fitting), I've seen the type 33 and it's really great looking!
There is.
One of his last lines is "You have all the time in the world". The song plays over Madeline and Mathelide together, remembering Bond.
If you insist on being completely literal, it doesn't apply to Bond and Tracy either. Because she dies at the end too, just like Bond does in NTTD. Is that different in some way?
I would say that lyrics are supposed to have a bit of lyricism to them and aren't supposed to be taken exactly literally.
That's silly. I'm so tired of 'fans' constantly pinning the most treacherous of motives onto the makers of the films I like. Every time I come here it's all about how bad the recent, massively successful and popular films were, and how underhand and awful Broccoli and Wilson are. It's tiring. I like these films. I've had a rubbish day at work and I have to read about how the films are like are somehow trying to spoil the old films I like.
To you. To others it does.
Exceeds it even. There are some for whom the relationship between Bond and Tracy feels unearned, conveyed through nothing but a rather tacky montage, and with two actors who have zero chemistry, one of whom is a walking plank.
See? It's easy to say everything's rubbish.
Care to elaborate?
To be honest, I wished they've just did what have they done in Casino Royale, many people found the Vesper-Bond romance worked despite of them not having some sort of love theme, compared here with Madeleine, where they've put a lot more effort, but the romance was empty and shallow.
And I can safely say that Tracy could be an equivalent to different Bond actors' eras: like Countess Lisl for Moore, Elektra King for Brosnan for example, both have shades of Tracy in some angles, but they've never used that song, because they're not Tracy.
Again, I have no problem with Bond mentioning it, but what makes it more problematic was the fact the song itself was played.
It's not the problem, the problem was the using of it for different situation, it's like again, playing 'If There Was A Man' from The Living Daylights in another romance, when that song reminds me of Bond and Kara's relationship.
It's no different to the usage of We Have All The Time In The World in Bond and Madeleine's romance when that song was originally for Bond and Tracy.
It's stealing another identity, more like identity theft.
It's no different to using 'Where Has Everybody Gone?' to Primo or any other henchman, when that song was made for Necros in TLD.
The thing is, there are some songs that holds a particular significance and therefore couldn't be used because of that.
It's like playing 'Vesper's theme' from CR in all of Madeleine's scenes, considering that Madeleine reflected some aspects of Vesper (especially the betrayal in NTTD PTS).
Really? But what @CrabKey was talking here is the ending, and the ending of OHMSS hits hard for most, whereas Bond's death in NTTD is still divisive (some may even hate the film for that ending alone), meanwhile many people liked OHMSS and ending is one of the reasons, and the ending of OHMSS hits harder because it's faithfully shot from the book, meanwhile the ending of NTTD never came from any of the books.
When I say the end of NTTD doesn't resonate like the end of OHMSS, that's my opinion. Nowhere have I suggested that's the opinion of everyone. What is silly is your need to point out not everyone shares that opinion. Really?
He loves her, as he tells her, he leaves his job for her, they travel around the world, she has his child, they become his family. He even chooses to die for her. He only does one of these for Tracy.
As it was in OHMSS, but that's fine. I think it worked perfectly well here.
Yes, you've said all of that, and I've already replied to it. I find it fine.
I get where you're coming from, you've explained it, you don't have to repeat it. I've explained why I don't mind it, there it is. Neither of us is *correct*, neither is *wrong*.
Yes really. Do you really find that Lazenby has great chemistry with... anyone?
I don't find the end of NTTD divisive: it's kind of impossible for me to! :)
And as we can only talk about our own personal reactions when we're talking about finding something of quality or not, I find it resonates just as well as OHMSS. You may not, but you can't tell me it doesn't resonate as well as if it's a fact.
He said the same to Vesper, planning to retire with her, they're even travelling the world together (the last time they're in Venice right?), and possibly Bond would be even planning to have a family with her.
So, if all of those songs like those that I've mentioned would be played in future Bond films, would it be fine for you?
For example, using 'Where Has Everybody Gone' for another henchman in a future Bond film, or playing If There Was A Man or Experience of Love when Bond was caught in a relationship in a future Bond film, would you find it fine too?
That's very true. She was the other big love, more of a lost one in a way.
Well I'd obviously prefer not to hear Experience of Love again(!), but yeah, I'd probably get over it. I'd probably be more curious about what the filmmakers were trying to say by bringing those back than this one. Do you want me to be upset about it?
It’s a film, for crispes sake!
Bond dying worked for some of us.
It’s just a film!
I love NTTD. Unapologetically. Emotionally, I rank it up there with my favourite films (from the first two Godfather films, Apocalypse Now, Raging Bull, Goodfellas, Serpico, Dog Day Afternoon, Jaws….)
My wife loves NTTD (she enjoys most Bond’s as a passing, fun evening when a new film comes out. That’s pretty much it).
August 25 was my birthday (yes, I share this date, and my bald head, with Mr. Connery), and we watched NTTD. We had a couple of martinis and loved every second of the film. And by the end, we were both bawling like babies, but also felt the power of what the character sacrificed.
On top of this stupidity, we also had a Montreal artist capture, in painting, Bond’s final moments. This was my birthday gift (and those who have connected with me on IG have seen it).
This film, like any other film, works for some, not for others.
And if you actually read what @mtm was saying (instead of lecturing or trying to instigate an argument), you’ll see he’s pretty measured and was being reasonable. In fact, he’s on record as seeing faults with this film, but he also sees the positives.
Maybe a good question for the NTTD haters to consider is: What’d you think about people who like the film? Are they “stupid” for liking it? Are they your “enemy”? If not, then try and have a conversation with them.
And if so, well, god help you…
I'm glad you had a nice birthday, sounds fun. Apart from the crying of course! :D
Thanks, 😂. It was a perfect evening!
Well said. Unless you're making a film, (and even then to a limit), don't judge people for having opinions on something that is meant to be fun. Us James Bond fans are one of the luckiest fandoms in the world. We have many books, movies, video games, and many other forms of media based on this fictional character. All of those products have more than one success. Not many other fandoms have that. There is such a thing as disagreeing while being respectful of each other. Us Bond fans generally are. Let's remember that.
Your question is ill-considered and inappropriate. It reads as bait to start an argument. I hope you'll think better of it and delete it.
Yes indeed, I like all of the films and I'm not ashamed to admit it. Some I prefer to others, and some have issues, and I think it's fun to chat about those, but also to share in a bit of praise of them. Conjuring up stories about how awful the producers must be etc. doesn't appeal to me at all and I don't really have interest in trying to convince folks to like these films less. I'm certainly happy to try and persuade them that the bits they may not enjoy might not be as bad as they thought, though!
"This never happened to the other fellas..."
Later:
"For James..."
"For James..."
"For James..."
"For James..."
Pierce Brosnan enters the room:
"The writings truly were on the wall for him, don't you think Paloma?"
Paloma enters the room:
"Ay si, que tragedia..."
Thank you, @peter same about you. I always try to be kind... but try living with me! ;)
@CrabKey , unfortunately I do think you missed @mtm’s points, and;
my questions were not baiting in any way.
In fact, I hope one would take them as being rhetorical!
I do think you did miss my point on this as well- and that’s not baiting either. I’ll leave it at that.
Edit: @MaxCasino , I hear you… sometimes I actually feel terribly that my wife is STILL living with me, and my poor kids STILL come back to visit. I know i can be the grumpy bear.
No one is perfect, 😂.
@peter 's post does make a lot of sense, though, @CrabKey. Since NTTD's release, the film has been called lots of things, ugly things, that drag its fans into the mudpool with it. I myself was lectured on what constitutes a "true" Bond fan, and how I, as a consequence of my appreciation for NTTD, am not a "true" Bond fan. And then something about "Babs" having to be fired. And then something about people who love NTTD having been brainwashed by Marvel's MCU and whatnot. To me, Peter's post doesn't read as bait at all; in fact, I have been wondering the same thing. Are we, indeed, considered stupid for liking NTTD?
Another important point is the fact that we are talking about our opinions of films, not about hard, scientific facts. Yet many are willing to die on that rather silly hill. People from both sides, I might add. I think @peter's very level-headed post holds true for us all, regardless of which side we're on. These courtroom dramas about who's right about a bloody film have already forced many of our friends away from certain threads, and even from this forum. Let's not forget that most of us want to engage with fans with varying opinions because the perspective of someone else can be interesting and entertaining. We're not here to allow the biggest mouths their victory in the My Taste Is Better Than Yours game we're not willing to play. This isn't the YouTube comment section...