Where does Bond go after Craig?

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  • jamesbond0007jamesbond0007 mississippi
    Posts: 32
    If the series goes anywhere from here in the future they need to trash that out dated DB5
  • 007InAction007InAction Australia
    Posts: 2,531
    More ninja's :)>-
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  • Posts: 9,847
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Truthful adaptation would mean the movies should be set in the 1950's? I don't think, I would like it. If so, we only would have 12 movies. And they will never do TSWLM, as Ian Fleming explicitly had it in the contract with Cubby and Harry, that they might use the title, but not use the novel as such (apparently Fleming disliked it). IMO one of the reasons, why we got 24 (25?) movies in 48 years, is, that they always made Bond a character for the present time. And they used material from the novels in the movies. Not the whole story, but elements of it (LTK).

    If you look at FYEO, LTK, OP, TLD and CR, all of these adapted Fleming faithfully to modern times (whether its scenes, short story or full novel story), so it can be done.

    As for TSWLM, Fleming has been dead a long time now, and I don't think its beyond the wit of man to start legal proceedings with the Fleming estate to use some of the content from that novel, and I doubt the Fleming estate would pass either, if it kept the memory of Ian alive (and maybe a nice wad of cash too). The only part really worth using is the second half of the book, with Viv Michel holed up in a seedy motel by gangsters, and rescued by Bond - but I think this would work well on screen.

    EON are no strangers to legal wranglings to use Fleming material. They've spent decades doing it, ever since TB.

    The issue here is The spy who loved me has already been adapted 3 times

    The title and the character of horror were done in 77
    The main action sequence from the novel was done note for note in for your eyes only
    And Paris always felt like a Vivine substitute (there are two subtle nods to the character the first being the gun under the pillow line the second being the whole Newspaper boy he told me he loved me thing)

    I would far prefer them tackle a novel that hasn’t been cut up and done three different times like Diamonds are forever or the short stories from a view to a Kill and the hildebrand rarity hell even octopussy could be updated and utilized for an interesting plot

    Where was the TSWLM action scene in FYEO? I don't recall gangsters in a remote motel roughing up a broad, and then Bond rescuing her in a shootout. I must have missed that?

    Agreed, DAF hasn't been properly done, nor AVTAK or OP.

    However Hildebrand has been done in LTK, split over 2 characters - Sanchez is that character, whip an' all, and then Milton Krest is name checked as another character (who also owns a boat).

    Shall I quote the passage the killers make their way toward bond in a car bond shoots the driver and car goes over the cliff and it was in both areas
  • edited September 2020 Posts: 3,327
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Truthful adaptation would mean the movies should be set in the 1950's? I don't think, I would like it. If so, we only would have 12 movies. And they will never do TSWLM, as Ian Fleming explicitly had it in the contract with Cubby and Harry, that they might use the title, but not use the novel as such (apparently Fleming disliked it). IMO one of the reasons, why we got 24 (25?) movies in 48 years, is, that they always made Bond a character for the present time. And they used material from the novels in the movies. Not the whole story, but elements of it (LTK).

    If you look at FYEO, LTK, OP, TLD and CR, all of these adapted Fleming faithfully to modern times (whether its scenes, short story or full novel story), so it can be done.

    As for TSWLM, Fleming has been dead a long time now, and I don't think its beyond the wit of man to start legal proceedings with the Fleming estate to use some of the content from that novel, and I doubt the Fleming estate would pass either, if it kept the memory of Ian alive (and maybe a nice wad of cash too). The only part really worth using is the second half of the book, with Viv Michel holed up in a seedy motel by gangsters, and rescued by Bond - but I think this would work well on screen.

    EON are no strangers to legal wranglings to use Fleming material. They've spent decades doing it, ever since TB.

    The issue here is The spy who loved me has already been adapted 3 times

    The title and the character of horror were done in 77
    The main action sequence from the novel was done note for note in for your eyes only
    And Paris always felt like a Vivine substitute (there are two subtle nods to the character the first being the gun under the pillow line the second being the whole Newspaper boy he told me he loved me thing)

    I would far prefer them tackle a novel that hasn’t been cut up and done three different times like Diamonds are forever or the short stories from a view to a Kill and the hildebrand rarity hell even octopussy could be updated and utilized for an interesting plot

    Where was the TSWLM action scene in FYEO? I don't recall gangsters in a remote motel roughing up a broad, and then Bond rescuing her in a shootout. I must have missed that?

    Agreed, DAF hasn't been properly done, nor AVTAK or OP.

    However Hildebrand has been done in LTK, split over 2 characters - Sanchez is that character, whip an' all, and then Milton Krest is name checked as another character (who also owns a boat).

    Shall I quote the passage the killers make their way toward bond in a car bond shoots the driver and car goes over the cliff and it was in both areas

    So a car chase and shoot out is now a direct adaptation of TSWLM? lol. Don't waste my time with crap like this.

    I never saw that as a direct adaptation of TSWLM whatsoever. Where is the seedy motel? The gangsters threatening rape. Bond knocking at the door seeing the vacancy sign? Viv beckoning Bond in, and then him exchanging dialogue with a couple of thugs once indise, knowing something is wrong.
  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    I don't think there is enough Fleming material left to base a whole film around. Maybe used as a PTS or a particular sequence, but that is all.

    Id be pretty pleased if we simply got a Gunbarrel, a great PTS, and then a nice, old school Bond adventure that brings back some of the male fantasy.

    Craig has undoubtedly done some interesting things with the role, but it's the first time I have genuinely felt that I wouldn't actually like to be Bond.
  • edited September 2020 Posts: 3,327
    Roadphill wrote: »
    I don't think there is enough Fleming material left to base a whole film around. Maybe used as a PTS or a particular sequence, but that is all.

    Id be pretty pleased if we simply got a Gunbarrel, a great PTS, and then a nice, old school Bond adventure that brings back some of the male fantasy.

    Craig has undoubtedly done some interesting things with the role, but it's the first time I have genuinely felt that I wouldn't actually like to be Bond.

    I've said many times, with the material left you could use it as the basis for a few movies (ala TLD), as short stories or scenes that can be adapted into a new script, like Maibaum did expertly in the 80's.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited September 2020 Posts: 6,304
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Truthful adaptation would mean the movies should be set in the 1950's? I don't think, I would like it. If so, we only would have 12 movies. And they will never do TSWLM, as Ian Fleming explicitly had it in the contract with Cubby and Harry, that they might use the title, but not use the novel as such (apparently Fleming disliked it). IMO one of the reasons, why we got 24 (25?) movies in 48 years, is, that they always made Bond a character for the present time. And they used material from the novels in the movies. Not the whole story, but elements of it (LTK).

    If you look at FYEO, LTK, OP, TLD and CR, all of these adapted Fleming faithfully to modern times (whether its scenes, short story or full novel story), so it can be done.

    As for TSWLM, Fleming has been dead a long time now, and I don't think its beyond the wit of man to start legal proceedings with the Fleming estate to use some of the content from that novel, and I doubt the Fleming estate would pass either, if it kept the memory of Ian alive (and maybe a nice wad of cash too). The only part really worth using is the second half of the book, with Viv Michel holed up in a seedy motel by gangsters, and rescued by Bond - but I think this would work well on screen.

    EON are no strangers to legal wranglings to use Fleming material. They've spent decades doing it, ever since TB.

    The issue here is The spy who loved me has already been adapted 3 times

    The title and the character of horror were done in 77
    The main action sequence from the novel was done note for note in for your eyes only
    And Paris always felt like a Vivine substitute (there are two subtle nods to the character the first being the gun under the pillow line the second being the whole Newspaper boy he told me he loved me thing)

    I would far prefer them tackle a novel that hasn’t been cut up and done three different times like Diamonds are forever or the short stories from a view to a Kill and the hildebrand rarity hell even octopussy could be updated and utilized for an interesting plot

    Where was the TSWLM action scene in FYEO? I don't recall gangsters in a remote motel roughing up a broad, and then Bond rescuing her in a shootout. I must have missed that?

    Agreed, DAF hasn't been properly done, nor AVTAK or OP.

    However Hildebrand has been done in LTK, split over 2 characters - Sanchez is that character, whip an' all, and then Milton Krest is name checked as another character (who also owns a boat).

    Shall I quote the passage the killers make their way toward bond in a car bond shoots the driver and car goes over the cliff and it was in both areas

    So a car chase and shoot out is now a direct adaptation of TSWLM? lol. Don't waste my time with crap like this.

    I never saw that as a direct adaptation of TSWLM whatsoever. Where is the seedy motel? The gangsters threatening rape. Bond knocking at the door seeing the vacancy sign? Viv beckoning Bond in, and then him exchanging dialogue with a couple of thugs once indise, knowing something is wrong.

    Weren't the two thugs sort of like Jaws and the bald guy?

    I also think the end of QoS was a bit inspired by TSWLM.

    Fleming knew what he was doing when he withheld the adaptation. But the man knew how to write a title. Trying to think of a comparable modern writer who introduced so many phrases to the vernacular. The many cultural riffs on FRWL alone...
  • edited September 2020 Posts: 3,327
    echo wrote: »
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Truthful adaptation would mean the movies should be set in the 1950's? I don't think, I would like it. If so, we only would have 12 movies. And they will never do TSWLM, as Ian Fleming explicitly had it in the contract with Cubby and Harry, that they might use the title, but not use the novel as such (apparently Fleming disliked it). IMO one of the reasons, why we got 24 (25?) movies in 48 years, is, that they always made Bond a character for the present time. And they used material from the novels in the movies. Not the whole story, but elements of it (LTK).

    If you look at FYEO, LTK, OP, TLD and CR, all of these adapted Fleming faithfully to modern times (whether its scenes, short story or full novel story), so it can be done.

    As for TSWLM, Fleming has been dead a long time now, and I don't think its beyond the wit of man to start legal proceedings with the Fleming estate to use some of the content from that novel, and I doubt the Fleming estate would pass either, if it kept the memory of Ian alive (and maybe a nice wad of cash too). The only part really worth using is the second half of the book, with Viv Michel holed up in a seedy motel by gangsters, and rescued by Bond - but I think this would work well on screen.

    EON are no strangers to legal wranglings to use Fleming material. They've spent decades doing it, ever since TB.

    The issue here is The spy who loved me has already been adapted 3 times

    The title and the character of horror were done in 77
    The main action sequence from the novel was done note for note in for your eyes only
    And Paris always felt like a Vivine substitute (there are two subtle nods to the character the first being the gun under the pillow line the second being the whole Newspaper boy he told me he loved me thing)

    I would far prefer them tackle a novel that hasn’t been cut up and done three different times like Diamonds are forever or the short stories from a view to a Kill and the hildebrand rarity hell even octopussy could be updated and utilized for an interesting plot

    Where was the TSWLM action scene in FYEO? I don't recall gangsters in a remote motel roughing up a broad, and then Bond rescuing her in a shootout. I must have missed that?

    Agreed, DAF hasn't been properly done, nor AVTAK or OP.

    However Hildebrand has been done in LTK, split over 2 characters - Sanchez is that character, whip an' all, and then Milton Krest is name checked as another character (who also owns a boat).

    Shall I quote the passage the killers make their way toward bond in a car bond shoots the driver and car goes over the cliff and it was in both areas

    So a car chase and shoot out is now a direct adaptation of TSWLM? lol. Don't waste my time with crap like this.

    I never saw that as a direct adaptation of TSWLM whatsoever. Where is the seedy motel? The gangsters threatening rape. Bond knocking at the door seeing the vacancy sign? Viv beckoning Bond in, and then him exchanging dialogue with a couple of thugs once indise, knowing something is wrong.

    Weren't the two thugs sort of like Jaws and the bald guy?

    I also think the end of QoS was a bit inspired by TSWLM.

    Fleming knew what he was doing when he withheld the adaptation. But the man knew how to write a title. Trying to think of a comparable modern writer who introduced so many phrases to the vernacular. The many cultural riffs on FRWL alone...

    There are loose adaptations littered all over the films - MR>DAD, TMWTGG>LTK, SF>TMWTGG, MR>QOS, etc. Some more looser than others, when you really have to dig deep to look for similarities, such as the very loose ones mentioned above regarding TSWLM, when they could be nothing more than mere coincidences.

    But true adaptations are what we are looking for. FYEO directly takes the characters and plot from the Fleming shorts stories, plus a scene from LALD, OP directly adapts the same short story, as does TLD, and LTK directly adapts scenes from LALD.

    And CR also does so with the entire novel (updated to fit modern times, of course).

    The closest we have had to this in recent times is the torture scene in SP, which is pretty much a direct adaptation of the scene from Colonel Sun.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    I believe Horror had something wrong with his teeth, which seems like it led to Jaws...

    I think they read the source material before writing, which is why we got the Paris location (and nothing else) in (F)AVTAK.
  • echo wrote: »
    I believe Horror had something wrong with his teeth, which seems like it led to Jaws...

    I think they read the source material before writing, which is why we got the Paris location (and nothing else) in (F)AVTAK.
    Like I said, loose (extremely loose) adaptations of Fleming.

    These are more like subtle nods, if anything. Simply not good enough.
  • 007InAction007InAction Australia
    Posts: 2,531
    Rumours Tom Hardy to be cast as next James Bond heat up as bookies suspend bets
    https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/rumours-tom-hardy-cast-next-22708705
  • All these discussions about Hardy and the argument made that he could only do a standalone movie considering his age made me think:

    2022 will mark the sixtieth anniversary of the series and it seems to me unlikely that Bond 26 will be released on this year because of the too short period of time that will have elapsed since the end of the Craig era and the difficulty of imposing a younger (and possibly unknown) actor so soon in the role. If the rumor about Hardy seems unlikely, some have mentioned that his only way to actually get the part, and only for a one-off, would be if Nolan is directing the movie.

    Thus my idea: if Nolan is a name able to generate interest from the general audience, to the point of moving forward from the Craig era, why not make Bond 26 a special entry in the series, allowing a 2022 release. The chosen actor will not sign a multi-pictures deal; thus his successor, thought to remain in the long term, will have a lighter weight on his shoulders than if he had directly followed Craig.
  • Posts: 727
    Please no Nolan. The man has no talent for characterisation and sensuality. It would be the most rigid Bond movie ever. Denis Villenueve please.
  • Posts: 6,709
    Please no Nolan. The man has no talent for characterisation and sensuality. It would be the most rigid Bond movie ever. Denis Villenueve please.

    +1 Indeed.
  • Posts: 727
    Can you imagine a bond film directed by Denis? It would be the most visually lyrical Bond film ever. It would be like Skyfall on steroids.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Please no Nolan. The man has no talent for characterisation and sensuality. It would be the most rigid Bond movie ever. Denis Villenueve please.

    Either of these two would be great.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    Univex wrote: »
    Please no Nolan. The man has no talent for characterisation and sensuality. It would be the most rigid Bond movie ever. Denis Villenueve please.

    +1 Indeed.

    Agreed.
  • Posts: 1,630
    Reminder here: Only the title of TSWLM may be used, not the content. A restriction directly from Ian Fleming.

    As for a "one-off" Bond with Tom Hardy ? Hardly. These producers had but one "one off" and it was not intentional or planned. The "two-only" with T Dalton also was not intentional or planned. By the way -- Tom Hardy is rather short to portray Bond. Given the duration of time between films now, I estimate they'd want a minimum of three. Were the time between films briefer, I'd say more, but three films several years apart places the actor at an age by the end of it -- over a decade -- of being old enough for them to move on.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    The next Bond will do three films.

    If you play the odds.
  • Posts: 727
    Was watching true lies the other day, mate, James Cameroon would tear it up directing a Bond film.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,636
    Was watching true lies the other day, mate, James Cameroon would tear it up directing a Bond film.

    No, he’d make it too long, torture everyone about how right he is, and plagiarize the screenplay.
  • Junglist_1985Junglist_1985 Los Angeles
    Posts: 1,033
    Can you imagine a bond film directed by Denis? It would be the most visually lyrical Bond film ever. It would be like Skyfall on steroids.

    Yes!! Denis is masterful, but don’t count out CJF and Sandgren though. NTTD has the potential to be the most visually artistic Bond ever.

    As for material, I’m going with Moonraker novel adaptation. There’s so much potential there.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,636
    Can you imagine a bond film directed by Denis? It would be the most visually lyrical Bond film ever. It would be like Skyfall on steroids.

    Yes!! Denis is masterful, but don’t count out CJF and Sandgren though. NTTD has the potential to be the most visually artistic Bond ever.

    As for material, I’m going with Moonraker novel adaptation. There’s so much potential there.

    I agree about Denis, I would support him. As for future movie material, I say start adapting other novels. Icebreaker, The Union Trilogy, Trigger Mortis and Forever and a Day (with Anthony Horowitz writing) would be great places to start. Take a break from original screenplays for a while (namely from Purvis and Wade). People want stand alone missions again? The books are mostly them. If they are interested in multiple movie story lines, plan them in advance. Not at the last minute like Daniel Craig’s.
  • edited September 2020 Posts: 3,327
    Since62 wrote: »
    Reminder here: Only the title of TSWLM may be used, not the content. A restriction directly from Ian Fleming.

    Yes I think most here know that by now. Fleming has been dead for over 50 years, and legal issues have never stopped EON, right back to 1965 when TB was trying to get made and McClory had a hold over the rights. Likewise, it took EON years to get the rights to CR too, and the name SPECTRE. So it wouldn't be too difficult for them to get the legal rights, or get permission from the Fleming estate if they wanted to.
    Since62 wrote: »
    As for a "one-off" Bond with Tom Hardy ? Hardly. These producers had but one "one off" and it was not intentional or planned.

    Covid wasn't intentional or planned, but the world may look very different post Covid, including how films get financially backed and greenlit. Whatever was the norm before 2020 automatically gets chucked in the bin now. The world as we knew it is literally changing before our very eyes.

    I can easily see Hardy been picked as a one-off for a one-off movie to ensure it gets the green light to go ahead, because this is the strange world we are now in. Hollywood backers may not give the green light to an unknown young actor now (even though I personally would prefer this).

    Long term plans for a movie franchise won't exist for a long while.

  • Posts: 6,709
    They really should invest in a 10 episode Netflix-like series. And bring their high end quality into it, along with all the talent they usually hire. And adapt the Fleming novels very close to the source material, period and all. With an adaptable credits sequence and a Shirley Bassey/David Arnold collaborative song.

    I think they would nail it, and people would love the escapism, specially now. And then, when things settled down, they'd come back to the classic cinematic big event format, set in the present, with yet another cast.
  • Posts: 727
    That would be brilliant. Use the format to explore deeper themes too. Like Bond not being able to get it up when he hasn’t had a proper mission in a while. And why he needs the thrill to feel alive.
  • Univex wrote: »
    They really should invest in a 10 episode Netflix-like series. And bring their high end quality into it, along with all the talent they usually hire. And adapt the Fleming novels very close to the source material, period and all. With an adaptable credits sequence and a Shirley Bassey/David Arnold collaborative song.

    I think they would nail it, and people would love the escapism, specially now. And then, when things settled down, they'd come back to the classic cinematic big event format, set in the present, with yet another cast.

    Definitely. That would be automatically better than most of the Bond films already, excluding the 60's classics, Dalton's 2 films and CR.
  • Posts: 1,630
    Why would anyone WANT to use TSWLM book material ? Much of it is background on a character's coming of age, and then most of the rest is a battle with a couple thugs in a cheap motel in the Northeastern US. (yawn) A remake of/borrowing of/homage to the film's story would be far more interesting. it would be Bond...and beyond. But seriously, folks ! It could be done without the same degree of jokiness. Plenty of aspects could be improved: Delete Bond learning how to re-program a missile's target from briefly scanning a handy manual (ugh...yes, that really was in there). Rather than have the chosen survivors of apocalypse live under the sea, perhaps they'd stay there but temporarily. (Actually, the whole wipe-out-the-rest-of-humanity idea has many problems: rotting corpses, smell, ruins over much of the earth, not enough folks left to make things. So the evil plan needs some work.) But there's a lot with which to work.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited September 2020 Posts: 5,970
    Univex wrote: »
    They really should invest in a 10 episode Netflix-like series. And bring their high end quality into it, along with all the talent they usually hire. And adapt the Fleming novels very close to the source material, period and all. With an adaptable credits sequence and a Shirley Bassey/David Arnold collaborative song.

    I think they would nail it, and people would love the escapism, specially now. And then, when things settled down, they'd come back to the classic cinematic big event format, set in the present, with yet another cast.
    It's something I'd love to see, but the problem is, despite my continued love for the movies and where they've continued to take it...

    ...but mainly would general audiences be that interested. As Bond fans, of course we love the original Fleming material, but would the series pull in enough numbers to keep the series afloat? I mean, as cool as it would be, I don't think EON or any other studio would trade in the amount of money they make at the box office making the films to make a series. They could maybe do it side-by-side, but again is there a real interest among general audiences to make this series worthwhile.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    Can you imagine a bond film directed by Denis? It would be the most visually lyrical Bond film ever. It would be like Skyfall on steroids.

    Yes!! Denis is masterful, but don’t count out CJF and Sandgren though. NTTD has the potential to be the most visually artistic Bond ever.

    As for material, I’m going with Moonraker novel adaptation. There’s so much potential there.
    Honestly, NTTD looks very Villeneuve already. It’s clear the direction they wanted to go with as they sought out a director like him since the beginning. Fukunaga was such an inspired choice.
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