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Uhm….😶
Okay, here’s the thing; none of those examples hold up. Bond gives Quarrel the option not to go to Crab Key sure, but once Quarrel does decide to come along, he still treats him like shit. If you tell a person of another color to “fetch your shoes” then I’m sorry but you come across as a dick doing that. Do you treat people like this?
Even though that scene really isn’t played out like that. Bond looks at Quarrel’s corpse for a few seconds, but nothing about Connery’s composure suggests mourning. Rather it’s the face of somebody who’s disgusted by the sight/smell of burning flesh. The only hint of regret Bond has was during the dinner scene where he casually remarks he’d love to avenge Strangways and Quarrel.
This was also a movie set against the backdrop of British colonialism in Jamaica, and I really only count 1 other race as a main character (Quarrel) because I don’t count White People being given Yellow Face as “inclusive.”
Well no because no characters of African origin are written into the film. So that doesn’t really make sense.
No what makes you ignorant is your continued pushback on ideas that have been explored throughly in this stupid debate. What makes you ignorant is the fact that you believe that by me pointing out the flaws of a film/character that’s over 60 years old that I’m unleashing a relentless attack when I’ve made it quite clear that I still enjoy the film and Connery’s performance. What makes you ignorant is when you pushback against the ideas of basic human decency.
See the problem @CrabKey is that I don’t think you’re capable of having a discussion like this because you’re too attached to these films. The fact you made such a big song and dance over “fetch my shoes” proves it. If you are capable, then I’d love to see your take on the Barn scene on Goldfinger? How about the numerous times Bond has openly slapped women? Got any defenses for those?
Or perhaps it’s time to admit that these movies you grew up watching having not aged well. I mean I’ve done just that! I grew up on the Connery era just as much as you did. I might not have been around for when those films were playing the theaters, but that doesn’t mean I haven’t experienced them. That doesn’t mean that I didn’t endlessly watch those movies on repeat. But I’m at an age now where I can recognize dated attitudes and still enjoy the final film. Whereas I’m not quite sure you’ve reached that point based off our interactions.
It was in the Some Kind of Hero book. Sorry, I should have used that as a source. It did say that he was hard on them, for better material. Even P&W have both said that, in retrospect. So, it is a PART of the creative process, some people don't always see eye to eye. But it worked out in the end. If EON had a problem with any of them, they would have taken action.
IN:
Barbara Broccoli
Greg Wilson
Purvis & Wade
MAYBE:
MGW
OUT:
Chris Corbould (said he was pivoting from SFX to directing)
OMG, he has licence to kill. Slap women is nothing.
Sure It can't be done now, but, man, he has licence to Kill. It's a movie.
Sorry you missed a few letters.
I’d say these last two pages prove otherwise.
Here’s a suggestion; stop defending questionable behavior and maybe people won’t act questionable towards you.
I wasn’t trying to insult you, nor am I actively trying to insult you now. But you when you get so damn adamant in defending dated attitudes then I really don’t know what else to call that other than ignorance at its finest, and that my friend is your problem.
@talos7 :
You’d certainly have the producers there, the writers and I imagine they have script consultants/script editors on staff; as it gets deeper in development, you’d add the director and executives representing the distributors.
When do you think they’ll get around to set design? Do you think it’ll be before casting or concurrent to the casting process?
Set designs happen in preproduction…
There’s also the fact that non-Asian actors play Asian characters, including Dr. No himself. Now, I think Wiseman’s performance is top notch. He’s the prototypical Bond villain; as much of an innovator on how to play Bond’s nemesis as Connery is for playing Bond. But it’s still yellow face. I don’t think the racism in Dr. No is intentional, but it’s still there.
Sorry @DEKE_RIVERS hitting a woman is repugnant. Laying even one unasked finger on a woman should get that finger broken and the nail torn off.
The only time I can recall that James Bond, as written by Fleming, slapped a woman was in the novel, TMWTGG. At 3 1/2 Love Lane Scaramanga shoots a young lady’s bird. She’s in shock and Bond tries to snap her out of it.
There are better ways to get someone out of a shock, but, this action was supposed to be done as a positive or as help.
But Fleming’s Bond never slapped a woman out in violence, as has been done in FRWL and others.
If you think this kind of violent action isn’t sickening, then there’s no more to this discussion, is there. Do you have a mother? A sister? Daughters?
Sometimes he doesn't look like a professional. It's a war veteran doing this shitty job.
No it’s a fictitious character.
And there were other ways of doing a scene like From Russia With Love without smacking the crap out of a woman. Hell, it was based on a book where this same fictitious character didn’t lay a hand on Tatiana.
Fleming's Bond didn't fly either. so what?
You’re soooo right Deke! I never thought of that!! Brilliant how you compare apples to airplanes! Just brilliant!!
It's fiction, Peter. You know that.
I think the point that’s being made is fictional characters can be guided by writers/creators to do all sorts of things. There are things a character can be made to do that tells us something insightful about their personality and background. Then there are things a character can be made to do that tells us more about the inner workings of the writers/creators. If a character performs a particularly deplorable action that a gives us no insight, then it probably should be excised.
Is fiction free from responsibility or accountability to the culture/society in which it’s created?
Should fiction not be subject to the judgments of taste and etiquette?
It's fiction in any case and the truth is that it makes sense within fiction.
But being that fiction is, by definition, whatever you need it or want it to be, then it could just as easily not include deplorable actions.
Wait, what? Fiction?? Are you serious??
All condensation aside, when writing or producing anything, there is a duty and a responsibility in everything one creates.
Fleming didn’t feel the need to smack out Tatiana. The filmmakers didn’t need to either. But i understand that there’s a sect of men out there, still obviously, who thinks slapping out a woman is just, what? A-ok?
It’s fiction, you’re right. And that scene could have been done in any number of ways.
EDIT: @Burgess — I didn’t see your post. Bravo, well stated (you have far more patience than myself in explaining this to Deke, 😂)!
Wait a gosh darn minute here! Are you implying the Cinematic Bond CAN fly? 🤔
Eloquently put!
That makes absolutely zero sense.
Listen, Deke, you think a hero should go around slapping women, and you see nothing objectionable in these actions, bask in that glory. But stop moving goalposts and gaslighting with obscure comparisons.
Just admit you think giving Tatiana a nice smack to the head is cool and be done with it.
In the end, the creator of this character didn’t feel the need to have Bond slap around any women. And he was a fair bit tougher character on the page than he was in the films (how he survived all those tortures and beatings). And the filmmakers didn’t have to have him smack out Tatiana either. It didn’t have to happen. It didn’t move the story forward. It was an over the top reaction from the character and, quite frankly, it was stupid.
Even as a kid I found that slap pretty shocking.
Now as an adult man, it just disgusts me. It was a poor creative choice.
I don't think there's anything wrong with Bond giving a playful slap on the butt when they're on the train. That's how all relationships should be, playful but naughty. Nevermind, Bond asking Paloma to turn around when he's undressing. That's not Bond! Surely theres a happy medium.