SPECTRE, most fun Bond adventure in decades?

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  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    I wanted to make a distinction. This is about sense of "fun" and adventure. Not a "best" topic. Lol!
    Using @Thunderball007's distinction of the 'sense of fun' as opposed to the viewer having a rollicking good time watching it, then I guess this is the most 'fun' Bond film since Die Another Day, surely?

    The issue I have with the 'fun' Bond films is they may outlive their welcome earlier than those with a serious tone (In the 1930s great comedies by Laurel & Hardy and the Marx Brothers ran to about 70 minutes, whereas Gone With The Wind never seemed to end).

    So the other overly long Bond films - On Her Majesty's Secret Service, Casino Royale and Skyfall - were all far more melodramatic, and more suited to longer running times than Spectre.

    But, let's face it, even the dourest Bond films - Licence To Kill, Skyfall - are still Bond films and as such the sense of fun is never far below the surface.




  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I liked the title song! Hell, I can't stand the movie, but I think I'm in a very tiny minority of people that did enjoy the song, and it probably helps that I waited to see the movie to hear the song for the first time.

    I heard the song before watching the film, and I hated it. It wasn't until I heard it in context of the film that I had an appreciation for it, and now I really like it.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I liked the title song! Hell, I can't stand the movie, but I think I'm in a very tiny minority of people that did enjoy the song, and it probably helps that I waited to see the movie to hear the song for the first time.

    I heard the song before watching the film, and I hated it. It wasn't until I heard it in context of the film that I had an appreciation for it, and now I really like it.
    I honestly can't stand the damn song. It's the most irritating thing about the entire production for me, and put a truly sickening taste in my mouth prior to the film's release.
  • Murdock wrote: »
    He's not speaking for everyone. He's giving his own personal opinion. I think Dalton is the worst Bond but I don't speak for everyone when I say that. If you don't agree with him just ignore him and move on.

    Okay, if it was not him, my bad. But I have seen others here on other threads doing this.

  • Murdock wrote: »
    He's not speaking for everyone. He's giving his own personal opinion. I think Dalton is the worst Bond but I don't speak for everyone when I say that. If you don't agree with him just ignore him and move on.

    But @Murdock, you also aren't one of the people @A_Kristatos is talking about. I completely tolerate people's opposite opinions, but the hijacking described has been beyond infantile for a long, long time. When this happens, people who don't like SP won't even bother to actually comment substantially on why it's not good to them beyond saying, "It sucked," or "worse Bond film ever." On a discussion forum, one line derisions like the above only serve the pride of the poster unleashing them, as they contain no substance or value for anyone else to work off of.

    In writing analysis you make a point and then support it with backed up evidence. When you only do the former, I advise saving your breath, as nobody really cares what you have to say afterward. I used to be far more polite on these issues, but as someone who backs up everything he says, as a true writer should, and who has also tired of random negativity that has no merit, my stores of patience have run thin.

    Thanks Brady! Agreed 100%.
  • For the life of me, I will never understand the fascination with the lighter, fluffier comedic Bond films of the 1970's and early '80's. The lighter, fluffier stuff in Spectre ruined that picture, in my opinion.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2017 Posts: 23,883
    For the life of me, I will never understand the fascination with the lighter, fluffier comedic Bond films of the 1970's and early '80's.
    Not a Moore fan I take it?
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    bondjames wrote: »
    For the life of me, I will never understand the fascination with the lighter, fluffier comedic Bond films of the 1970's and early '80's.
    Not a Moore fan I take it?

    Have you read the guy's posts? :))
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,718
    bondjames wrote: »
    For the life of me, I will never understand the fascination with the lighter, fluffier comedic Bond films of the 1970's and early '80's.
    Not a Moore fan I take it?

    He also seems to hate Craig too.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    I like all the Bond flavours. If I want Fleming, I'll just read it.
  • For the life of me, I will never understand the fascination with the lighter, fluffier comedic Bond films of the 1970's and early '80's. The lighter, fluffier stuff in Spectre ruined that picture, in my opinion.

    Great post Telly! That is a legitimate reason as to why a lot of people did not like Spectre, and you backed up your opinion with an explanation, unlike others who post here. I think the earlier Craig films set a standard so high that a lot of people don't want to go back to the more light hearted tone of some of the earlier Bond films. But that being said, they can't go with a dark tone every single film either, just as it was the right time to go in that direction after the Brosnan films overcompensated in the comedic direction.

    Despite the tone of some of these threads, a lot of people did like the fact that Spectre went towards a lighter, more nostalgic direction than the previous three Craig films. And I know a lot of people here wanted a more traditional Bond movie this time around. Well, they got one, but it seems like more people despised it than liked it, at least amongst the hard core Bond fans. But there is always a time and a place for films with certain tones, and the box office receipts reflected this. And it's not like Spectre went full throttle Moore/Brosnan on us. It still had a lot of dark moments that distinguish the Craig era from the other Bond eras. But a lot of people did welcome the uptick in humor and throwback to the earlier Bond films in Spectre.

    It's hard to tell where Bond 25 will go in terms of tone, but judging by the critical response to this film, it will probably go darker again, especially if it turns out to be Craig's last film. Based on box office returns though, they may look to strike that balance again between a darker and lighter tone. Who knows. Both templates seem to work as long as they don't go too far off center, and I'm okay either way as I have thoroughly enjoyed all four Craig films, imperfect as some of them are. But regardless, I'm sure we will be in for something special for Craig's final outing, if he does indeed come back for Bond 25.


  • Let me list the Jokes in SP I hated: The couch gag, the car stereo playlist gag, the mouse gag, the wearing tuxedo in the middle of a mission gag, the death of Hinx gag, the gag gut to them in the room passionate just after the Hinx fight gag.

    Just submarined what might have been a better than average Bond.

    And the worst gag of all, that Bond and Blo ARE RELATED.

    Good grief.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Most of those don't even classify as "gags," but whatever...
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,978
    As much as I disliked the film, I feel like I'm the only one that laughed at Bond's "Nooo!" once the radio kicks on during the car chase. That was a good way of interjecting a bit of humor into a serious action sequence, without overdoing it.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    As much as I disliked the film, I feel like I'm the only one that laughed at Bond's "Nooo!" once the radio kicks on during the car chase. That was a good way of interjecting a bit of humor into a serious action sequence, without overdoing it.

    Nope, I'm definitely with you there. I think Dan handled the lighter moments wonderfully.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    I have to respectfully disagree with both of you. The whole rome car chase was atrocious. Very little action, and the old man in the fiat and the Frank Sinatra gag is something from the Roger Moore era. The whole scene was crafted around the idea of tying up quantum without dragging the audience into to much though of that, so they won't dare remember Quantum Of Solace. (gasp)
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,978
    I have to respectfully disagree with both of you. The whole rome car chase was atrocious. Very little action, and the old man in the fiat and the Frank Sinatra gag is something from the Roger Moore era. The whole scene was crafted around the idea of tying up quantum without dragging the audience into to much though of that, so they won't dare remember Quantum Of Solace. (gasp)

    Don't let my comment regarding my enjoyment of the line fool you, I find the overall chase to be a heavily, heavily overpriced bore. The whole Moneypenny call certainly doesn't help things, either. I do enjoy a certain shot here and there, but it's mostly thanks to the city looking beautiful at night and a few moments of good cinematography, and not so much the action on screen.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    I have to respectfully disagree with both of you. The whole rome car chase was atrocious. Very little action, and the old man in the fiat and the Frank Sinatra gag is something from the Roger Moore era. The whole scene was crafted around the idea of tying up quantum without dragging the audience into to much though of that, so they won't dare remember Quantum Of Solace. (gasp)

    They didn't forget QoS. They wouldn't have bothered with mentioning and showing Greene if they did. As one of the biggest QoS fans on here, I was not disappointed. The return of Mr. White was the ultimate gift to QoS fans, and I couldn't ask for much more.
  • Posts: 1,680
    They could have had Guy Haines show up at the Spectre meeting if they were really looking for continuity
  • Posts: 11,425
    shamanimal wrote: »
    barryt007 wrote: »
    I have SP at #13 on my list..its entertaining ,even though the ending is meh (but most Bond film endings are meh ).

    Ha! I've always thought that. My favourite Brozza movie (TND) has a flat ending. I hate those 'kill the baddie at the end with a pithy quip' endings. Kudos to the Craig era that it happened only once (SF).

    It's why OHMSS is one of the best endings.

    I enjoyed SP better the second time I saw it. Much more enjoyable than SF for me. Several very nice scenes. For me it's better than SF in pretty much every area.

  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,978
    @shamanimal, it only happened once in the Craig era because that's the only villain he got to kill.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,401
    Why has Bond become so sluggish in recent years? Remember the snappy, breezy Bond films of the 70's and 80's? Its seems like ever since Brosnan took the role, each film there has always been something weighting the films down, preventing them from being the exciting action adventure thrillers they once were. Just like the films became too flamboyant at moments, now they have become too solemn, too grim. Was it really necessary to have a daughter witness the suicide of her father in order to demonstrate that Blofeld is evil? If not, then why is that in there? To me it seems like just as the Moore films gradually got more and more absurd, verging on self-parody, so has the Craig films become more and more self-serious and morose, to the point where it no longer serves any purpose. After a while it becomes noticeable even to the common viewer, and that's when EON have to act - NOW!
  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    Getafix wrote: »
    shamanimal wrote: »
    barryt007 wrote: »
    I have SP at #13 on my list..its entertaining ,even though the ending is meh (but most Bond film endings are meh ).

    Ha! I've always thought that. My favourite Brozza movie (TND) has a flat ending. I hate those 'kill the baddie at the end with a pithy quip' endings. Kudos to the Craig era that it happened only once (SF).

    It's why OHMSS is one of the best endings.

    I enjoyed SP better the second time I saw it. Much more enjoyable than SF for me. Several very nice scenes. For me it's better than SF in pretty much every area.

    Hey @Getafix, you don't like Skyfall???

    Tell us why!

    OK, joking. ;)
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    Tuck91 wrote: »
    They could have had Guy Haines show up at the Spectre meeting if they were really looking for continuity
    And Moishe Soiref!

  • I have to respectfully disagree with both of you. The whole rome car chase was atrocious. Very little action, and the old man in the fiat and the Frank Sinatra gag is something from the Roger Moore era. The whole scene was crafted around the idea of tying up quantum without dragging the audience into to much though of that, so they won't dare remember Quantum Of Solace. (gasp)

    Thank you.

    Oh yes, who could forget the old man in the car gag.

    (groan)

    Just, some awful decisions in this film.

  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    I have to respectfully disagree with both of you. The whole rome car chase was atrocious. Very little action, and the old man in the fiat and the Frank Sinatra gag is something from the Roger Moore era. The whole scene was crafted around the idea of tying up quantum without dragging the audience into to much though of that, so they won't dare remember Quantum Of Solace. (gasp)

    Thank you.

    Oh yes, who could forget the old man in the car gag.

    (groan)

    Just, some awful decisions in this film.
    When Daniel said Bond would be back with more laughs I though he was talking about Connery Humor! Not RM!

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Laughable. If the Craig era had Moore humor, SP would've ended with Bond and Hinx battling to the death at Blofeld's Moroccan base, during which the latter would stop when he looked up and fell in love at first glance with one of Blofeld's lab assistants. We'd also have gotten random shots of pedestrians reacting to Bond doing random things that resembled stock footage.

    If any comparison had to be made, what we get is a retooled style of humor closest to Young's films, and that contention is heavily supported by the movies themselves. Not even the sofa fall and the vehicle Bond pushes with his Aston in Rome feel Moore-esque, because they're almost too normal for what you'd seen in his films.
  • Birdleson wrote: »
    Personally, that has nothing to do with why I don't like SP. I just didn't see the lighthearted romp that many others did; I would have loved that. I found the film to be oppressively dark.

    Interesting you felt that this was still very dark. With several Roger "Mooresque" nods in this movie, it definitely felt a lot more relaxed and lighter than Craig's first three films. But I do agree, it still had plenty of classic Craig dark moments as well, and that is exactly what gave Spectre its unique feel and kept it from going total Pierce Brosnan or Roger Moore on us.

    Sounds like you would have liked something even more towards the tone of Diamonds Are Forever, which isn't necessarily a bad thing either. :D

  • Let me list the Jokes in SP I hated: The couch gag, the car stereo playlist gag, the mouse gag, the wearing tuxedo in the middle of a mission gag, the death of Hinx gag, the gag gut to them in the room passionate just after the Hinx fight gag.

    Just submarined what might have been a better than average Bond.

    And the worst gag of all, that Bond and Blo ARE RELATED.

    Good grief.

    In all fairness, the mouse gag was a direct reference to Silva's rat speech in Skyfall. I thought that scene was very cleverly written. The others I can understand why you disliked them as they may have channeled too far towards Roger Moore than you and others would have liked. And especially with the "baby daddy" arc the Bond/Blofeld relationship took (although again, not a deal breaker for me). But again, as I posted earlier, I think Craig earned a more traditional and lighter film after what his Bond went through the first three films. But again, if he is back for Bond 25, I think you will get your wish as I expect a full turn back to the dark side if this is indeed his finale. If not, at least Craig's Bond finally went out with a happy ending.
  • Creasy47 wrote: »
    As much as I disliked the film, I feel like I'm the only one that laughed at Bond's "Nooo!" once the radio kicks on during the car chase. That was a good way of interjecting a bit of humor into a serious action sequence, without overdoing it.

    Nope, I'm definitely with you there. I think Dan handled the lighter moments wonderfully.

    Agreed. Craig handled all of these as he knows how. Subtlety without going overboard. Even if the dialogue was right out of the Roger Moore handbook so to speak, he handled it well, and it was refreshing to see this which in turn helped break up the darker moments of the film. And it helped give Spectre a more traditional feel while continuing the progression of Bond's reboot under Craig. Bond 25 can go either way if Craig comes back, but as I said above, those disappointed with Spectre may end up loving what comes next. Nothing that has been said, just a gut feeling from me.
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