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The Next American President Thread (2016)

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  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    edited November 2016 Posts: 11,119
    bondjames wrote: »
    I am the fourth for Trump. And Unreservedly so at this point.

    As I've mentioned many times, this thread is almost 90% Clinton backed, so I don't see the point of this poll. It's not like we're a sample of the American electorate or anything. Most of us don't even live there and even if we did, I can appreciate that many of Trump's supporters won't have time to spend on forums like these.
    ----

    It does look like Clinton will take it based on what I've been seeing on tv this morning. The pundits are back to their arrogant pronouncements that it's over.

    As I've said, even though Trump has a lot of support, he has a large electoral map wall that I really don't see how he can surpass. I'm pretty sure he will get many more votes than McCain or Romney however, and they way he has closed out the campaign suggests he will be quite a force (whether it be in new media or politics) going forward.

    Look for either a Clinton electoral map blowout or a Trump blowout against the odds. This can't be close, or healing the divisions will be almost impossible to do going forward. Even now we are seeing vast differences in preferences between ethnic groups, sexes, education levels and coastal vs landlocked states. That is not a recipe for future harmony and understanding.

    Thanks for your vote @BondJames :-). I will gladly add your vote to the tally. It's our democratic right. I respect your choice (Although I firmly disagree, but I respect it).

    So now the results are::
    09 votes: HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON & Tim Kaine (Democratic Party: left of centre, mildly progressive)
    04 votes: DONALD JOHN TRUMP & Mike Pence (Republican Party: right wing, conservative to populist)
    00 votes: GARY EARL JOHNSON & Bill Weld (Libertarian Party: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: JILL STEIN & Ajamu Baraka (Green Party: left wing and very progressive)
    00 votes: EVAN 'DAVID' MCMULLIN & Mindy Finn (Independent: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: Option to WRITE-IN someone else
    01 votes: Option to ABSTAIN from voting

    You see? Plenty of options to choose from :-). As long as people are willing to vote for ideas and issues instead of pictures and persons.


    Clinton:
    @Agent007391
    @jobo
    @Murdock
    @4EverBonded
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    @SharkBait
    @echo
    @FoxRox

    Trump:
    @Jetsetwilly
    @Timmer
    @Germanlady
    @BondJames

    Abstaining from voting:
    @BondJasonBond006
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited November 2016 Posts: 9,020
    I always vote because there is always at least one choice I can vote for without having a bad conscience.

    I could not vote for Trump.
    I could not vote for Hillary.
    Both are dangerous in their own way and will be very, very bad for the US and the World.

    I would not want to have something to do with that. So yes, not voting is anyone's right.

    And it has nothing to do with people in Venezuela or Hong Kong, that's an entirely different situation and topic.

    I would vote for Ross Perot though, the trouble is there is never a Ross Perot around when you need one. :P
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    I would vote for Ross Perot though, the trouble is there is never a Ross Perot around when you need one. :P

    That's why you can 'write-in' in the USA. You can put Perot on the ballot if you like. Governor Kasich of Ohio for instance will write-in John McCain. Then again, you choose to abstain from voting, thus not using your democratic voting rights :-).
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    People in Venezuela and Russia don t get to vote now?
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    People in Venezuela and Russia don t get to vote now?

    March 11, 2018 --> Presidential Elections Russia
    April 08, 2018 --> Presidential Elections Venezuela


  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I am the fourth for Trump. And Unreservedly so at this point.

    As I've mentioned many times, this thread is almost 90% Clinton backed, so I don't see the point of this poll. It's not like we're a sample of the American electorate or anything. Most of us don't even live there and even if we did, I can appreciate that many of Trump's supporters won't have time to spend on forums like these.
    ----

    It does look like Clinton will take it based on what I've been seeing on tv this morning. The pundits are back to their arrogant pronouncements that it's over.

    As I've said, even though Trump has a lot of support, he has a large electoral map wall that I really don't see how he can surpass. I'm pretty sure he will get many more votes than McCain or Romney however, and they way he has closed out the campaign suggests he will be quite a force (whether it be in new media or politics) going forward.

    Look for either a Clinton electoral map blowout or a Trump blowout against the odds. This can't be close, or healing the divisions will be almost impossible to do going forward. Even now we are seeing vast differences in preferences between ethnic groups, sexes, education levels and coastal vs landlocked states. That is not a recipe for future harmony and understanding.
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    edited November 2016 Posts: 11,119
    bondjames wrote: »
    I am the fourth for Trump. And Unreservedly so at this point.

    As I've mentioned many times, this thread is almost 90% Clinton backed, so I don't see the point of this poll. It's not like we're a sample of the American electorate or anything. Most of us don't even live there and even if we did, I can appreciate that many of Trump's supporters won't have time to spend on forums like these.
    ----

    It does look like Clinton will take it based on what I've been seeing on tv this morning. The pundits are back to their arrogant pronouncements that it's over.

    As I've said, even though Trump has a lot of support, he has a large electoral map wall that I really don't see how he can surpass. I'm pretty sure he will get many more votes than McCain or Romney however, and they way he has closed out the campaign suggests he will be quite a force (whether it be in new media or politics) going forward.

    Look for either a Clinton electoral map blowout or a Trump blowout against the odds. This can't be close, or healing the divisions will be almost impossible to do going forward. Even now we are seeing vast differences in preferences between ethnic groups, sexes, education levels and coastal vs landlocked states. That is not a recipe for future harmony and understanding.

    Thanks for your vote @BondJames :-). I will gladly add your vote to the tally. It's our democratic right. I respect your choice (Although I firmly disagree, but I respect it).

    I think there is a good point of doing this 'little election poll'. This is not about proving who's right or showing that Clinton will win on here. Hell, I am still prepared for an upset Trump victory. But I do think it's important that, despite all the flaws of the American democracy, there still is a choice. You can still vote for more people than just Clinton and Trump. You can even write-in someone. YOU can choose to ignore all the expensive negative ads, YOU can choose to start a new political party in the USA, YOU can choose to focus on a complete new party, the 'Trump Party' or the 'Freedom Caucus Party' for instance.

    There is no person in the USA jailing you for that like it's happening now in Hong Kong, or Russia. Even more so, if we all 'hate' ourr systems so much, then at least stand up for something. Stand up for a new kind of governance. If you detest the current democracy? Come up with ways to improve it. And if you really think Putin's way of 'democracy' is better, then you're free to bring it up.

    Anyway, the results are::
    10 votes: HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON & Tim Kaine (Democratic Party: left of centre, mildly progressive)
    04 votes: DONALD JOHN TRUMP & Mike Pence (Republican Party: right wing, conservative to populist)
    00 votes: GARY EARL JOHNSON & Bill Weld (Libertarian Party: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: JILL STEIN & Ajamu Baraka (Green Party: left wing and very progressive)
    00 votes: EVAN 'DAVID' MCMULLIN & Mindy Finn (Independent: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: Option to WRITE-IN someone else
    01 votes: Option to ABSTAIN from voting

    You see? Plenty of options to choose from :-). As long as people are willing to vote for ideas and issues instead of pictures and persons.


    Clinton:
    @Agent007391
    @jobo
    @Murdock
    @4EverBonded
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    @SharkBait
    @echo
    @FoxRox
    @TripAces

    Trump:
    @Jetsetwilly
    @Timmer
    @Germanlady
    @BondJames

    Abstaining from voting:
    @BondJasonBond006
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,327
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    Clinton


    So far:
    09 votes: Clinton
    02 votes: Trump

    I count 4 for Trump on this forum (including me, even though I don't personally like the guy very much). Not that it will make the blindest bit of difference come election day tomorrow.

    OK, understood. But to keep it simple and clear, simply post your preference...and don't 'hide' your preference in a lengthy set of arguments :-). Is easier to read hehe.

    So now the results are::
    09 votes: HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON & Tim Kaine (Democratic Party: left of centre, mildly progressive)
    04 votes: DONALD JOHN TRUMP & Mike Pence (Republican Party: right wing, conservative to populist)
    00 votes: GARY EARL JOHNSON & Bill Weld (Libertarian Party: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: JILL STEIN & Ajamu Baraka (Green Party: left wing and very progressive)
    00 votes: EVAN 'DAVID' MCMULLIN & Mindy Finn (Independent: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: Option to WRITE-INN someone else

    You see? Plenty of options to choose from :-). As long as people are willing to vote for ideas and issues instead of pictures and persons.


    Clinton:
    @Agent007391
    @jobo
    @Murdock
    @4EverBonded
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    @SharkBait
    @echo
    @FoxRox

    Trump:
    @Jetsetwilly
    @Timmer
    @Germanlady
    ehh, who is the 4th :-S

    @bondJames...

  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    See above dear @JetsetWilly ;-)
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,589
    Put me in the Clinton column.
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    Posts: 3,327
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    See above dear @JetsetWilly ;-)

    BTW, I'm not saying I would vote for Trump if I was in the US, as I can't stand either of them. It's just that I think Trump will win tomorrow, so you can keep my name in there for that reason alone.
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    See above dear @JetsetWilly ;-)

    BTW, I'm not saying I would vote for Trump if I was in the US, as I can't stand either of them. It's just that I think Trump will win tomorrow, so you can keep my name in there for that reason alone.

    Always a good reason. Voting for the candidate you think will win, instead of voting for the person with the policy issues you agree most with :-). But it's your choice....
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
    The markets appear to be back up in premarket trading after being down for the past nine days as Trump closed in.

    However, volatility was quite low during those past nine days. That could suggest that the decline over that time was due to institutional investors repositioning their portfolios (hedging basically) for a possible Trump victory (so they profit either way) rather than an outright selloff.

    Watch what happens towards the end of trading today. If it shoots up by 3:30pm or so on high volume then it's more possibly Clinton. If it's lacking direction then there is a strong possibility Trump is in with a shot.
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    Posts: 3,327
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    See above dear @JetsetWilly ;-)

    BTW, I'm not saying I would vote for Trump if I was in the US, as I can't stand either of them. It's just that I think Trump will win tomorrow, so you can keep my name in there for that reason alone.

    Always a good reason. Voting for the candidate you think will win, instead of voting for the person with the policy issues you agree most with :-). But it's your choice....
    If I was voting for the person with the policy issues I agree with, then it would be neither of them.... ;)
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,589
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    See above dear @JetsetWilly ;-)

    BTW, I'm not saying I would vote for Trump if I was in the US, as I can't stand either of them. It's just that I think Trump will win tomorrow, so you can keep my name in there for that reason alone.

    He's not going to win.
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,566
    Edit
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    the results are::
    11 votes: HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON & Tim Kaine (Democratic Party: left of centre, mildly progressive)
    04 votes: DONALD JOHN TRUMP & Mike Pence (Republican Party: right wing, conservative to populist)
    00 votes: GARY EARL JOHNSON & Bill Weld (Libertarian Party: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: JILL STEIN & Ajamu Baraka (Green Party: left wing and very progressive)
    00 votes: EVAN 'DAVID' MCMULLIN & Mindy Finn (Independent: centrist, left on social issues, right on others)
    00 votes: Option to WRITE-IN someone else
    01 votes: Option to ABSTAIN from voting

    You see? Plenty of options to choose from :-). As long as people are willing to vote for ideas and issues instead of pictures and persons.


    Clinton:
    @Agent007391
    @jobo
    @Murdock
    @4EverBonded
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7
    @SharkBait
    @echo
    @FoxRox
    @TripAces
    @BeatlesSansEarmuffs

    Trump:
    @Jetsetwilly
    @Timmer
    @Germanlady
    @BondJames

    Abstaining from voting:
    @BondJasonBond006
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,566
    BeatlesSansEarmuffs wrote: »
    If we're actually counting the votes then I should think my position has been pretty clear for quite awhile. I'm with Her > Hillary. Jason makes a good point, maybe we should be differentiating between Americans & non-Americans, although if this is just a forum-wide poll, y'know, whatever. Willy, I'm disappointed in you; so far as I can tell this isn't a question of who you THINK will win but who you WANT to win. It's not too late to change your vote, you've got the write-in option. Topolino is a better choice than Trump. 4Ever is correct, Trump has harmed the USA substantially by giving the Klan/neo-Nazis/alt-right scumbags that had been hiding among us reason to believe their abhorrent views have become mainstream enough that they can air their sickness in public.

    I'd been intending to post these vids tomorrow AM but what the heck, let's get it out of the way now. If you're for Trump, you get this song: A Hard Rain's A'Gonna Fall.


    "I heard the sound of a clown who cried in the alley." This one's got lots of verses & Edie doesn't use half of them so here we go with the whole batch. I once heard Joan Baez do the whole song at the Hardly Strictly Bluegrass Festival several years back. It was awesome. GL, please avert your eyes, you won't want to see the consequences of your non-binding choice:

    Oh, where have you been, my blue-eyed son?
    And where have you been my darling young one?
    I've stumbled on the side of twelve misty mountains
    I've walked and I've crawled on six crooked highways
    I've stepped in the middle of seven sad forests
    I've been out in front of a dozen dead oceans
    I've been ten thousand miles in the mouth of a graveyard
    And it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard, and it's a hard
    It's a hard rain's a-gonna fall.

    Oh, what did you see, my blue eyed son?
    And what did you see, my darling young one?
    I saw a newborn baby with wild wolves all around it
    I saw a highway of diamonds with nobody on it
    I saw a black branch with blood that kept drippin'
    I saw a room full of men with their hammers a-bleedin'
    I saw a white ladder all covered with water
    I saw ten thousand talkers whose tongues were all broken
    I saw guns and sharp swords in the hands of young children
    And it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard, and it's a hard
    It's a hard rain's a-gonna fall.

    And what did you hear, my blue-eyed son?
    And what did you hear, my darling young one?
    I heard the sound of a thunder that roared out a warnin'
    I heard the roar of a wave that could drown the whole world
    I heard one hundred drummers whose hands were a-blazin'
    I heard ten thousand whisperin' and nobody listenin'
    I heard one person starve, I heard many people laughin'
    Heard the song of a poet who died in the gutter
    Heard the sound of a clown who cried in the alley
    And it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard
    And it's a hard rain's a-gonna fall.

    Oh, what did you meet my blue-eyed son ?
    Who did you meet, my darling young one?
    I met a young child beside a dead pony
    I met a white man who walked a black dog
    I met a young woman whose body was burning
    I met a young girl, she gave me a rainbow
    I met one man who was wounded in love
    I met another man who was wounded in hatred
    And it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard
    And it's a hard rain's a-gonna fall.

    And what'll you do now, my blue-eyed son?
    And what'll you do now my darling young one?
    I'm a-goin' back out 'fore the rain starts a-fallin'
    I'll walk to the depths of the deepest black forest
    Where the people are a many and their hands are all empty
    Where the pellets of poison are flooding their waters
    Where the home in the valley meets the damp dirty prison
    And the executioner's face is always well hidden
    Where hunger is ugly, where souls are forgotten
    Where black is the color, where none is the number
    And I'll tell and speak it and think it and breathe it
    And reflect from the mountain so all souls can see it
    And I'll stand on the ocean until I start sinkin'
    But I'll know my song well before I start singing
    And it's a hard, it's a hard, it's a hard, and it's a hard
    It's a hard rain's a-gonna fall.

    But if Clinton wins (as seems most likely) we can go with this one: Blowing in the Wind.
    The Peter, Paul & Mary version of this song is probably the first Dylan song I ever heard & the memory is still imprinted in my mind. It was around 1962 & I was about 8 years old. I was in the grocery store, accompanying my mother on her weekly shopping trip when PP&M's version of this song came over the store's Muzak system & it just plain blew my tiny little mind. The imagery of the lyrics and the message imparted -- well, I didn't fully understand it at the time but it was clear that somebody was trying something new, different & powerful.



    I don't see any need to post the lyrics for this, PP&M use the whole text & their voices are pretty clear. This take is from their 25th Anniversary special. Rest in Peace, Mary. The rest of you, join the voices of the happy crowd.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Allow me to add my song for this election (applies to the Bernie and the Trump side):

    MUSE - UPRISING

    Paranoia is in bloom,
    The PR transmissions will resume
    They'll try to push drugs that keep us all dumbed down
    And hope that we will never see the truth around
    (so come on)

    Another promise, another seed
    Another packaged lie to keep us trapped in greed
    And all the green belts wrapped around our minds
    And endless red tape to keep the truth confined
    (so come on)

    They will not force us
    They will stop degrading us
    They will not control us
    We will be victorious
    (so come on)

    Interchanging mind control
    Come, let the revolution take its toll
    If you could flick the switch and open your third eye
    You'd see that we should never be afraid to die
    (so come on)

    Rise up and take the power back
    It's time the fat cats had a heart attack
    You know that their time's coming to an end
    We have to unify and watch our flag ascend
    (so come on)

    They will not force us
    They will stop degrading us
    They will not control us
    We will be victorious
    (so come on)

    Hey, hey, hey, hey
    Hey, hey, hey, hey
    Hey, hey, hey, hey

    They will not force us
    They will stop degrading us
    They will not control us
    We will be victorious
    (so come on)

    Hey, hey, hey, hey
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,589
    bondjames wrote: »
    Allow me to add my song for this election (applies to the Bernie and the Trump side):

    MUSE - UPRISING

    Paranoia is in bloom,
    The PR transmissions will resume
    They'll try to push drugs that keep us all dumbed down
    And hope that we will never see the truth around
    (so come on)

    Another promise, another seed
    Another packaged lie to keep us trapped in greed
    And all the green belts wrapped around our minds
    And endless red tape to keep the truth confined
    (so come on)

    They will not force us
    They will stop degrading us
    They will not control us
    We will be victorious
    (so come on)

    Interchanging mind control
    Come, let the revolution take its toll
    If you could flick the switch and open your third eye
    You'd see that we should never be afraid to die
    (so come on)

    Rise up and take the power back
    It's time the fat cats had a heart attack
    You know that their time's coming to an end
    We have to unify and watch our flag ascend
    (so come on)

    They will not force us
    They will stop degrading us
    They will not control us
    We will be victorious
    (so come on)

    Hey, hey, hey, hey
    Hey, hey, hey, hey
    Hey, hey, hey, hey

    They will not force us
    They will stop degrading us
    They will not control us
    We will be victorious
    (so come on)

    Hey, hey, hey, hey

    Bernie, yes. Trump? This song could easily be an anti-Trump anthem.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
    It's a matter of perspective. If one tries not to be partisan, we are talking about people power on both sides of the aisle here. The forgotten voices. The Rage Against The Machine.
  • FLeiterFLeiter
    Posts: 315
    Taking reservations for a HUGE steaming plate of crow for you Trumpsters tomorrow. Please hurry, because we don't know whether to hold it at a Waffle House counter or one table at Sambo's. Here's who's ready to chow down on foul fowl.

    @Jetsetwilly
    @Timmer
    @Germanlady
    @BondJames

    They'll be using plastic utensils because we can't risk metal knives and forks.

  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    It's not over until it's over, @FLeiter. Don't count Trump out until he's lost. I'm damn near expecting my vote to be thrown out tomorrow because I live not just in a red state but in Pence's state.
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    FLeiter wrote: »
    Taking reservations for a HUGE steaming plate of crow for you Trumpsters tomorrow. Please hurry, because we don't know whether to hold it at a Waffle House counter or one table at Sambo's. Here's who's ready to chow down on foul fowl.

    @Jetsetwilly
    @Timmer
    @Germanlady
    @BondJames

    They'll be using plastic utensils because we can't risk metal knives and forks.

    So what will your vote be? I mean, it's not very clear from your answer.

    Moreover, let's have some respect for people who don't vote the same as you do. @BondJames has learned me...to tone down on that aspect a bit. And like Obama said, we should have respect for EVERY voter, also for Trump-supporters. They don't come out of the blue. They are seriously worried.

    Lastly, I agree with @Agent007391 and @BondJames that Trump could still cause an upset tomorrow. Let's not forget that the number of independents and undecideds is much higher as compared to 2008 and 2012. If they swing to one direction, the person on the other direction seriously need to worry. Polling errors are therefore more likely than in 2008 and 2012.

  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,592
    I can't even fathom the notion that we have choose between the two.
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    jake24 wrote: »
    I can't even fathom the notion that we have choose between the two.

    Then choose McMullin, Stein or Johnson :-)
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
    In my last post on this thread before election day, I will just put this here.

    This, probably one of the most awe inducing scenes I've encountered in the past 5 years, reflects the Trump campaign on the way to the finish line.

    "It's not possible." "No. It's necessary"



    Good luck to all. Hoping for an upset tomorrow, but the odds are against it. I'm quoting my first post on this thread (from February 15th) in my last. My sentiment has not changed
    bondjames wrote: »
    My money is on Trump or Sanders.

    Polar opposites I know, but I hope it's one of them and not one of the others. Both populists, strangely. Either of these two will shake the system up, and that's a much needed start. The people deserve real change.
  • daltondalton
    Posts: 1,631
    Put me down as abstaining.

    Can't vote for either candidate, and the two third party candidates have proven to be shockingly poor choices as well.
  • PanchitoPistolesPanchitoPistoles 2.0
    Posts: 4,619
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    conservative to populist

    Are you seriously implying that populists are to the right of conservatives? Have you heard of the parties Syriza and Podemos? Populists come in all all shapes and sizes, my dear Dutch friend.

  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    PanchitoPistoles wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    conservative to populist

    Are you seriously implying that populists are to the right of conservatives? Have you heard of the parties Syriza and Podemos? Populists come in all all shapes and sizes, my dear Dutch friend.

    I know. I am sorry. But I was choosing that distinction because Trump himself is a populist on the right wing of the political spectrum. Thanks to him the GOP has considerably changed. Angry, unemployed, older, less educated blue collar workers from Ohio and Iowa will now swing to the GOP column, whereas originally they were Democratic. Hence the 'Trump'-effect.

    This effect of populism we also saw on the Democratic side. But the fact is: Bernie Sanders isn't the final candidate. So I know that there's also left-wing populism. But Clinton simply isn't a left-wing populist.
This discussion has been closed.