The Next American President Thread (2016)

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  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    bondjames wrote: »
    More chance of war with Hillary than Trump. I can assure you. She will be tested, and she will have to show that she's tough (being a woman) for the rest of the world to respect. Same thing happened to Bill post-Bush 1 and he started dropping munitions on Iraq during the no fly zone. Wag the Dog in full effect.
    Hillary scares me a bit more than Trump to be entirely Honest. There can be only one- Sanders. Any other choice and we are royally screwed IMO.
  • edited February 2016 Posts: 1,631
    There's going to be war if any of the Republican candidates are elected, not just Trump or Cruz.

    At least Trump is touting a foreign policy platform of carpet bombing, which Cruz has been going on and on about. Just my opinion, but presidential candidates should not be campaigning on a platform of committing war crimes, which carpet bombing is under the Geneva Conventions.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    he is very popular in South Carolina and Trump may have made a political mistake to take that shot at that moment. It probably would have served him better to wait until after South Carolina to begin his verbal assault on the Bushes, but we'll have to see. It could turn out to give Jeb! even more momentum heading into SEC Primaries in March.

    I can assure you that GWB is not popular in South Carolina. There's a reason that Hillary wheels out Bill whenever she has the chance but Jeb doesn't do the same will GWB: the GWB legacy is toxic.
  • Posts: 1,631
    He may not be popular with the broad electorate in South Carolina, but W currently holds an 84% approval rating with Republicans in South Carolina.
  • Put me in the 'anybody but Hillary' camp. She's so slimy, I feel dirty just thinking about her... My favorite is John Kasich, but I'll gladly take Trump or even Bernie.
  • Posts: 1,631
    JamesStock wrote: »
    My favorite is John Kasich

    I thought he did a really good job at the CNN Town Hall tonight.

    I don't know why the rest of the party doesn't rally around him instead of some of the others. He's been away from Washington long enough to not really be a part of the obstructionist culture that everyone is railing against in this cycle but still has the experience and aptitude to do the job.
  • edited February 2016 Posts: 572
    dalton wrote: »
    JamesStock wrote: »
    My favorite is John Kasich

    I thought he did a really good job at the CNN Town Hall tonight.

    I don't know why the rest of the party doesn't rally around him instead of some of the others. He's been away from Washington long enough to not really be a part of the obstructionist culture that everyone is railing against in this cycle but still has the experience and aptitude to do the job.
    Agreed, but I think he is too moderate to win the nomination. I was really elated to see him go second in NH. Maybe when the midwest voting season rolls around, he can gain some more traction. The country needs a uniter, but Obama has angered the republican party too much.

    For what it's worth here's my rankings in order of how I would vote today:

    (1) Kasich (common sense, middle ground, plain folk persona)
    (2) Trump (yes, Trump, because he is more middle ground than ppl give him credit for)
    ...
    (3) Rubio (can we say, groomed special interest robot?)
    (4) Carson (killed his campaign when he tried to make Trump-like statements)
    (5) Sanders (though would financially kill the US, at least his heart is in the right place)
    (6) Bush (too many good 'ole boys propping up this puppet)
    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    (7) Cruz (the republican version of Obama, the hyper-partisan candidate)
    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    (Infinity) Clinton (hell...smokescreens, elitist, and partisan)
  • Posts: 12,473
    Worst case scenario for me is Clinton or Trump.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    JamesStock wrote: »
    n order of how I would vote today:


    (5) Sanders (though would financially kill the US,
    How so?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    @Birdleson, I agree with your points.

    Regarding Bernie's ability to pay for what his plans: The US is the only major Western country without a value added tax. If that was put in place (and the funds used for proper purposes rather than lining pockets of special interests), the deficit could be reduced dramatically and 'consumption' reduced. Same goes for its gas/petrol taxes (amongst the lowest of any Western country).

    Ironically however, it is Donald Trump who has been mentioning waste in the military (he did it last night on the CNN town hall). I have not heard that from any other candidate. He is also the only one talking about the crummy trade deals that have been negotiated and the fact that China in particular is taking advantage of the US for its benefit.

    Regarding Hillary - my issue with her, apart from the fact that she is beholden to too many special interests (including numerous shameless ass kissers within her own party who she will have to pay off for the support) is that she has exhibited horrendous judgement in her career, including on a personal level. That to me is a critical attribute of leadership - the ability to make decisions strategically and looking at the big picture. George Bush did the same thing (bad judgement).

    Regarding Bernie - his intentions are pure, but there is no way he is going to be able to get the changes he wants through. Sure, he has the support of the people, but as Obama found out, that's not enough. Not when you go up against the partisan Congress with Republican obstructionists.

    Sadly, it is only Trump who has the ability to push through necessary changes imho, because he will be able to (finally) get the Republicans to come along to his side if he wins the nomination, and that will allow far more sweeping legislative changes to be made.

    He is perhaps not the best candidate, but he is ultimately the candidate who can make changes happen.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I think this is the crux of it. Those that dislike Trump do so vehemently. He is quite polarizing admittedly.

    I tend to be among those who believe he will pivot nicely to the centre if he is able to win the Repub nom (keep in mind how difficult that is without going extreme) - but I realize that there is an element of the electorate that will never like him. His policies are actually reasonably centrist - the rest is just hyperbole to win the primaries. He isn't quite what he is made out to be.

    The thing about him which I find remarkable is to a degree he is like Teflon. The best politicians have been like that - Clinton (Bill), Reagan and to a lesser degree, Obama.

    I just don't know how serious he is. I wouldn't be surprised if he drops out just before the end of it for health or other reasons and throws his support behind Rubio or someone else.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    That just got me thinking.

    Trump at the top of the ticket and Rubio as the VP pick? Sure fire winner in November.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Come back, Dennis Kucinich.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    Unlike most people, I base my vote for president almost entirely on foreign policy. For those non-Americans here, the constitution greatly restricts a president's domestic policy. nearly anything significant must be passed by congress. This is difficult enough when the president's party is in power (recall how much it took to get Obama's healthcare legislation passed), but it's damn near impossible when the president's party is out of power. The exception is things with broad bipartisan support (although ironically opposed by both parties' bases. Ex: free trade agreements nearly always pass over both conservative and liberal criticism. Ditto for the PATRIOT act et al.


    However in foreign policy the president largely has a free hand. Recall that he's the direct supervisor of the department state. The only things the congress can do are refuse to support military action after 60 days, refuse to approve a treaty the president has signed, or withhold funds. There's considerable pressure on them not to do those things however.


    If Bernie Sanders is elected, very little of his domestic agenda will be passed. Even if he isn't bought by special interests, most of the congress in both parties is. So his domestic agenda isn't particularly important to me.

    What concerns me is that he doesn't appear to know much about foreign policy. He doesn't even have any full time foreign policy advisors-POLITICO found that several of the people he cited as seeking advice on foreign policy said they've only met with him once or twice. He's been right about some things that Hillary was wrong about-the war in Iraq and intervention in Libya for example-but I have to wonder if those are a matter of him just being generally anti-interventionist and getting lucky rather than gauging the merits of those particular actions correctly.

    Clinton has the benefit of hundreds of foreign policy experts advising her. She's been wrong about very big questions (although some things she had to advocate has Secretary of State). But when I think about who I'd like negotiating with Xi Jinping, Vladimir Putin, Kim Jong Un, or Hassan Rouhani I can't help thinking I'd prefer her.

    She also understands that the political world, like nature, abhors a vacuum. If the US draws down its influence on the world, as both the Rand Pauls and Bernie Sanders of the world would like, someone will replace it. The only question is who. Russia in Eastern Europe and Central Asia (and reasserting itself in the Middle East), Iran in the middle east, China in East Asia (and increasingly in Africa). The values of those countries are not particularly ones that I want gaining influence at the expense of liberal democracy.
  • As a lifelong Democrat (I had the pleasure of voting for George McGovern and against Richard Nixon in my first election) I'll be supporting Bernie in the primaries and voting for whoever has the Democratic Party nomination (probably Hillary) in the general election. Most of the Republicans running give me the willies, although Kasich impresses me as being a generally decent fellow. I understand Cruz is thoroughly disliked by members of his own party who have to work alongside him, so I can't see him getting the nod...and Trump, I really don't see as being in it for anything more than the ego gratification of having thousands of people telling you over & over again how wonderful you are. I suspect (as many others have suggested) that having him at the top of their ticket could turn into a thorough drubbing for the Republican Party nation-wide. Rubio needs a lot more seasoning before he's really ready for prime time, and Jeb! is dry toast. Crumble him up & use him to stuff the turkey...
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited February 2016 Posts: 17,801
    As a lifelong Democrat (I had the pleasure of voting for George McGovern and against Richard Nixon in my first election) I'll be supporting Bernie in the primaries and voting for whoever has the Democratic Party nomination (probably Hillary) in the general election. Most of the Republicans running give me the willies, although Kasich impresses me as being a generally decent fellow. I understand Cruz is thoroughly disliked by members of his own party who have to work alongside him, so I can't see him getting the nod...and Trump, I really don't see as being in it for anything more than the ego gratification of having thousands of people telling you over & over again how wonderful you are. I suspect (as many others have suggested) that having him at the top of their ticket could turn into a thorough drubbing for the Republican Party nation-wide. Rubio needs a lot more seasoning before he's really ready for prime time, and Jeb! is dry toast. Crumble him up & use him to stuff the turkey...
    Pretty much sums it up for ME.
    =D>
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,718
    Looks like Jeb Bush has withdrawn from the 2016 Presidential race.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    His implosion is quite amazing.
  • TokolosheTokoloshe Under your bed
    Posts: 2,667
    I found this quite useful:

    http://www.reasonstovotetrump.com/
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Sark wrote: »
    His implosion is quite amazing.
    He exhibited terribly poor judgement by taking on Trump directly at the beginning, which is what precipitated his self-destruction. He should have laid off him and coasted through a few primaries (like Rubio has done) before taking the gloves off. Certainly demonstrated a lack of decision making capability in this respect.
  • Posts: 1,314
    Trump is every negative stereotype the rest of the world thinks about 'murca
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    True, and Obama isn't. Things always go full circle.
  • Posts: 1,631
    It's a shame that he and Christie couldn't have gotten out sooner. Could have consolidated the "Governor's lane" of the race behind Kasich and maybe given him the chance to be the consensus establishment candidate to go up against Trump.

    Thankfully, though, it looks like Cruz has lost quite a bit of momentum heading into the southern primaries. If he can't do better than third in South Carolina, a state with a constituency that should cater to a Cruz victory, then he might have some trouble in the other southern states not named Texas.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I think they may have to go with Trump somewhere on the ticket in the end, because he is bringing in new voters, and that is what it will take to beat the Bill & Hillary electoral machine. Cruz is a marginal candidate at best in a general election scenario.
  • Posts: 1,631
    I can't see Trump taking the VP job. He'll simply decline and head back to his business or decide to run as an independent and hand Hillary the election on a silver platter. Trump will either be at the top of the ticket or he'll thumb his nose at the whole process.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    dalton wrote: »
    I can't see Trump taking the VP job. He'll simply decline and head back to his business or decide to run as an independent and hand Hillary the election on a silver platter. Trump will either be at the top of the ticket or he'll thumb his nose at the whole process.
    Agreed. I still think Trump on top with Rubio (foreign policy committee experience and child of Latino immigrants - as well as establishment backing) as VP pick will make a very formidable team.
  • Posts: 1,631
    It'll be interesting to see what Trump does about the VP position if he ends up as the nominee. It'll be hard for him to pick one of his fellow candidates, given the vitriol he's spewed towards them. He hasn't gone after Rubio yet, but it's coming next week undoubtedly. It'll be hard for him to pick either Cruz or Rubio for the job, since he's publicly questioned their eligibility for the presidency.

    I think he'll have to pick someone that hasn't been running for the nomination, unless he goes for Kasich, who has generally stayed out of the negative fray so far.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I think Kasich took quite a few direct shots at Trump earlier in the cycle in the debates. Trump didn't bother responding to him because he didn't see him as a threat.

    There seems to be a friendlier air between Trump and Rubio though. He didn't even take a shot at him after the infamous debate robot repetition glitch, despite the media goading him on.

    You're correct though - next couple of weeks are going to get intense because the big money has limited time to take out 'The Donald' (aka 'Mr. Trump') before he becomes inevitable.
  • Posts: 1,631
    He hasn't taken shots at Rubio, yet. But with the Romney endorsement coming in the next day or so and the theoretical dwindling of the field to the three man race of Trump/Cruz/Rubio, Trump is about to take the fight to Rubio, and it's going to be about as ugly as it's been for any of the others, maybe moreso. Trump knows that if he can put Rubio away in the way that he's put everyone else away, he wins.

    Heck, he's already started to do this, as I saw a story where he just questioned Rubio's eligibility for the presidency just like he did with Cruz.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    I can't believe this is even being discussed. Trump? That guy from The Apprentice TV show? The billionaire nut case? A President?!?!?!?
    I must have been in a car accident, and am in a drug induced coma... this can't be real....
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