The Next American President Thread (2016)

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  • Posts: 1,631
    The bathroom thing is straight out of the Karl Rove playbook that, one would have thought, everybody had wised up to about a decade ago. I think it'll work out the opposite way this time, moving people more into Clinton's camp, as the electorate seems to have moved on from the views it held on LGBT issues 10-15 years ago, when Rove was able to use marriage as a wedge issue in the early-to-mid 2000s.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    This is not a wedge issue election, whether it be race, LGBT, bathrooms. muslims, mexicans or whatever.

    "It's the economy, stupid."
  • Posts: 1,631
    bondjames wrote: »
    This is not a wedge issue election, whether it be race, LGBT, bathrooms or whatever.

    "It's the economy, stupid."

    Agreed, but in the way that it's being used to try to distract some people, I don't think it'll have the desired impact. It's being set up by someone to be a potential wedge issue, but ultimately, I don't think it'll turn into one because the electorate has moved on from where it was a decade and a half ago. If it were to get people to change their views, though, I think it would be a net gain for Clinton, depending on how hard those who are pushing it try to push it.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    bondjames wrote: »
    This is not a wedge issue election, whether it be race, LGBT, bathrooms. muslims, mexicans or whatever.

    "It's the economy, stupid."

    Personally, my big issue in this election is hair. Donald's is threatening and scary, Hillary's is wildly inconsistent. Bernie's hair stays the same. He has hair you can trust.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Cruz is gone.
    Anything else really is unimportant at this point.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    dalton wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    This is not a wedge issue election, whether it be race, LGBT, bathrooms or whatever.

    "It's the economy, stupid."

    Agreed, but in the way that it's being used to try to distract some people, I don't think it'll have the desired impact. It's being set up by someone to be a potential wedge issue, but ultimately, I don't think it'll turn into one because the electorate has moved on from where it was a decade and a half ago. If it were to get people to change their views, though, I think it would be a net gain for Clinton, depending on how hard those who are pushing it try to push it.
    Yes, I agree. The Dems have the advantage on social wedge issues just due to electoral numbers, which is why they will push these issues in the General if Hills is the nominee, because they won't have the anti-capitalist economic platform of Bernie to fall back on as motivation.
    ----

    Trump will run to the left of her on military and trade most likely. He has said he will go all out relentlessly against ISIS & terrorism (with bombastic campaign rhetoric no doubt), but is calling for disentanglements in other areas. Again, non-status quo.

    The discussion about revamping the Nato alliance & its funding is the right one. He may have not articulated his points clearly, but his overall point is correct. The alliance needs to be revisited for the new times we live in, not perpetuated in its outdated format.

    The same goes for military procurement waste and futzing about spreading democracy in foreign lands. He has said this needs to be looked at closely.

    The same goes for insisting the Arabs (and particularly Saudi) step up and take on their responsibilities with respect to the refugee crisis and the war against ISIS.

    He is taking the common sense positions of a variety of candidates (including ilbertarian Rand Paul) and creating a composite foreign policy - not an ideological based one.

    The blanks & details need to be filled in, but the strategic thrust is one I am in sync with.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Really? He should just switch parties and run for the Democrats :))
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Really? He should just switch parties and run for the Democrats :))
    That's what many 'conservatives' including Carly and Ted feel.
  • Posts: 1,631
    I wish Trump had run as a Democrat. The Republicans actually fielded a somewhat decent field of candidates this time around (not all were great, but it was deeper in talent than the clown car that the 2012 field of Romney, Santorum, Gingrich, Paul, etc. was), with a couple that could have made pretty solid presidents.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Even Trump himself said that on MSNBC today. He acknowledged that it was a pretty good field on the right and was somewhat surprised he was able to take them out.

    He just caught the wave. Timing.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    It was only a matter of time before Kasich dropped out, as well.
  • Posts: 1,631
    He'd been basically out of it for a while anyway. Today just made it official.

    I just hope he reconsiders his stance on not being a VP choice.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    What's funny is my buddy said he heard Kasich had dropped out, so I did a quick Google search and saw all these articles about why he has yet to drop out, how he won't be dropping out for a long while, etc., and now look at him.
  • Posts: 1,631
    Apparently he had a change of heart on the way to his plane to head to DC for a fundraiser.

    My hope is that the change of heart was after a conversation with Trump regarding the VP job, but I doubt that's the case.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Kasich could bring Ohio, and that would be huge. I think Trump said today that his VP pick would be 'political' so you never know.
  • Posts: 1,631
    bondjames wrote: »
    Kasich could bring Ohio, and that would be huge. I think Trump said today that his VP pick would be 'political' so you never know.

    He's generally talked positively about Kasich and hasn't subjected him to the same kind of verbal assault he's given to guys like Rubio and Jeb Bush, both of whom Trump has said he likes after the fact.

    Kasich could help him get Ohio, but he might need to choose someone else who can help him make inroads into some of the demographics that he's pissed off over the course of the campaign. Kasich would be on my short list if I were Trump, but I'd also have a pretty long conversation with someone like Condoleeza Rice as well.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,400
    Honestly, I would rather Trump than Hilary. If that makes me a hideous monster, so be it. I just can't stand Hilary or her status quo message.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    dalton wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    Kasich could bring Ohio, and that would be huge. I think Trump said today that his VP pick would be 'political' so you never know.

    He's generally talked positively about Kasich and hasn't subjected him to the same kind of verbal assault he's given to guys like Rubio and Jeb Bush, both of whom Trump has said he likes after the fact.

    Kasich could help him get Ohio, but he might need to choose someone else who can help him make inroads into some of the demographics that he's pissed off over the course of the campaign. Kasich would be on my short list if I were Trump, but I'd also have a pretty long conversation with someone like Condoleeza Rice as well.
    @dalton, please! No Condi for pete's sake! She is just useless. A wonk but no electoral appeal whatsoever.

    Plus she's tainted with the lingering and unwashable stench of that 'nightmare' group of Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolkowicz etc. and that behind the strings puppet master 'Richard Pearle'.

    That would be a recipe for a sure Trump loss imho.
  • Posts: 1,631
    bondjames wrote: »
    dalton wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    Kasich could bring Ohio, and that would be huge. I think Trump said today that his VP pick would be 'political' so you never know.

    He's generally talked positively about Kasich and hasn't subjected him to the same kind of verbal assault he's given to guys like Rubio and Jeb Bush, both of whom Trump has said he likes after the fact.

    Kasich could help him get Ohio, but he might need to choose someone else who can help him make inroads into some of the demographics that he's pissed off over the course of the campaign. Kasich would be on my short list if I were Trump, but I'd also have a pretty long conversation with someone like Condoleeza Rice as well.
    @dalton, please! No Condi for pete's sake! She is just useless. A wonk but no electoral appeal whatsoever.

    Plus she's tainted with the lingering and unwashable stench of that 'nightmare' group of Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolkowicz etc. and that behind the strings puppet master 'Richard Pearle'.

    That would be a recipe for a sure Trump loss imho.

    Sounds like a great reason to choose her.

    I don't think she's tainted, though, at least not in Republican circles. Her ascension in the Bush White House in his second term was a direct result of Bush wanting to distance himself from Rumsfeld and Cheney, the latter of which he considered dropping from the ticket in the 2004 election.

    I do think that Trump is, however, going to need to look very closely at female candidates for his VP spot. He is viewed wildly unfavorably by women and will need to do something to win back at least some female voters if he wants to stand a chance, especially against someone running to be the first female president in the history of the nation.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    Honestly, I would rather Trump than Hilary. If that makes me a hideous monster, so be it.
    Not a monster my friend, simply not a fortune teller.
    ;)
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    dalton wrote: »
    I do think that Trump is, however, going to need to look very closely at female candidates for his VP spot. He is viewed wildly unfavorably by women and will need to do something to win back at least some female voters if he wants to stand a chance, especially against someone running to be the first female president in the history of the nation.
    I agree. He has been nothing but unpredictable so far though, and this is a new game since we're onto the General. I can't wait to see what he pulls out of his hat.

    Hills has the same problem as McCain in '08. Staid as 'f'. She's going to have to 'amp' it up, so I wonder who the Dem version of Palin is.
  • Posts: 315
    @FLeiter by now all American bases here in the Netherlands have closed.

    Not quite closed. There's still Brunssum and Benelux-Schinnen. And plenty of 'Virginia farm boys' hanging around Nijmegen shipping and yellow lift truck production. More than 150 countries have US service personnel stationed there.

  • Posts: 613
    Sources say Kasich is gonna drop out.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    @Problem_Eliminator, just a few hours late to the party. Never thought I'd see this day, sadly; could've swore this whole Trump nonsense was a bad joke that would eventually die out, but here we are.
  • Posts: 1,631
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Problem_Eliminator, just a few hours late to the party. Never thought I'd see this day, sadly; could've swore this whole Trump nonsense was a bad joke that would eventually die out, but here we are.

    Common sense would almost certainly say that we'd never see the two least-liked candidates in history facing off in the general election, but here we are. Both have such high unfavorable ratings that it just leaves you wondering who exactly voted for the both of them.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    They are both polarizing candidates, but they both have passionate supporters. The two go hand in hand to a degree.

    The same applied to Obama as well, only he had the 'love' of the rest of the world too.

    2016 is an 'America First' election, unlike 2008/2012. The rest of the world probably won't like the end result.
  • Posts: 342
    Clinton v Trump does not seem to be a choice between traditional left-wing v right-wing policies, but more of establishment entrenched-interests v independent. This is why the entrenched-interests who control mass media are doing everything they can to demonise Trump. Would that be fair?
  • Posts: 1,631
    Trump has done a decent enough job of demonizing himself. If he hadn't conducted his campaign in a manner where he was spewing racist and bigoted rhetoric everywhere he went, then I'd say that the media trying to paint him a certain way might be unfair. But, given the despicable manner in which Trump has conducted his campaign, he forfeited the right to be treated fairly, IMO.

    Still, I think they've treated him more fairly than the other candidates. He's on TV pretty much every other night for an interview and dominates their coverage, which has given him so much free publicity and allowed him to not have to spend nearly the amount of money as his rivals.
  • Posts: 1,631
    Trump has done a decent enough job of demonizing himself. If he hadn't conducted his campaign in a manner where he was spewing racist and bigoted rhetoric everywhere he went, then I'd say that the media trying to paint him a certain way might be unfair. But, given the despicable manner in which Trump has conducted his campaign, he forfeited the right to be treated fairly, IMO.

    Still, I think they've treated him more fairly than the other candidates. He's on TV pretty much every other night for an interview and dominates their coverage, which has given him so much free publicity and allowed him to not have to spend nearly the amount of money as his rivals.
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