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Comments
One would certainly hope not. ;)
I certainly hope there are.
Well that's how things used to be in Northern Ireland; even the dead voted!
No, but Federalists should be more honest. There is a legitimate argument to be had for a federal Europe. The 'Remainers' just don't make it because they know it would loose them the referendum.
For me it's simple. I believe that our own elected politicians are remote enough. I certainly don't want to further empower an unelected elitist autocracy that is even further away from the coal face.
I can kick out our n'er-do-wells every five years. The Eurocrats are there until they die and that was always the grand design.
People who support this way of doing things - and the Camster is one - believe that people are fundamentally too stupid to govern themselves. I fundamentally disagree and boy, I bet the Greeks wish they'd never joined ! Everybody in the € is fundamentally shafted. The game for them is over.
Well said Sir!!
We're Great Britain for Christ's sake. The clues in the title! They don't call it Great Estonia or Great Portugal do they?
Are we really so terrified to stand on our own two feet without needing crutches in the shape of Lithuania or Luxembourg to prop us up?
Not at all. I love visiting, working and living in Europe. But the EU in its current guise is not fit for purpose.
I love the World Cup but that doesn't mean I don't think FIFA needs dissolving and starting from scratch.
I'm pro-European. But then again I live in a country that is more or less a mini EU.
Governments change, the lies stay the same. ;)
"Politics makes liars of us all." - Joe Devlin in Columbo: The Conspirators (1978).
Looks like the EU's democracy works that way.
1. Are you in favour of staying in the EU?
2. What nationality are you?
Do you really think leaving the EU will give us back independence? Do you really think that big business and/or the US will allow that?
Just look at the new TTIP. Cameron would sign in a heart beat - it's only the French via the EU that is keeping it at bay
Still, if the UK votes to leave the EU, it would be fascinating to see what's going to happen after that.
"We are not now that strength, which in old days moved earth and heaven; that which we are, we are. One equal temper of heroic hearts, made weak by time and fate, but strong in will. To strive, to seek, to find and not to yield."
Actually, I don't like to be in a camp anymore. I am pro-EU. And I have got some damn good reasons for that. I am just....really afraid of what will happen if in two weeks time the UK votes "Leave". Really...afraid. Not because of that other camp. But because of the stability of all the countries on the European continent.
If people think everything will be better once the EU disintegrates, then I say to those: "Let's see how prosperity and welfare looks like in 20 years time from now".
Anyway, the nuance is mostly gone in such discussions. And really, I am also partially to blaim. One thing is for sure, the fierce discussions in here already show that the established middle class is loosing. But also the progressive centrists, like me. I am tired of being labeled a 'leftie', when I'm myelf both anti-right-wing and anti-left-wing. The only way out from this mess is right through the middle, with a centrist, long-term, progressive and positive vision for the future. I am a realist and I shall never become a populist. I also posted many arguments in which I stated that the EU needs to reform, that the EU-politicians need to become really more empathic with the people. But people don't read that anymore.
I am officially a 'traitor'. Anyway, let's see what happens.
I wouldn't say deluded. Just......unrealistic. Just look at the world population. It keeps growing and growing. Our planet becomes smaller and smaller. The immigrant crisis already shows that the poorest people on this planet are already empowering themselves. This will not stop. As long as prosperity is not equally divided, these problems will keep returning. Thinking that you can 'lock up' your country from the outside world has proven itself as a failure in the long-term.
The environment outside is hostile and stormy. A branch must move with the wind, or break. Chinese proverb say:
"The green reed which bends in the wind is stronger than the mighty oak which breaks in a storm."
It's as simple as that.
Unless the branch makes the wind.
Yes, one that was founded on the ruins of a devastating Second World War. Artificial construct or not.....the construct gave us decades....7 decades of prosperity and peace. I actually find it a blasphemy how people refer the EU to as a construct that is as artificial as Nazi Germany, then people loose every bit of nuance and context. Those are not my words by the way. People should read Boris Johnson's words. Once I start making such comparisons though, to defend the very EU, I am thrown away as a fear mongerer, a devil's prophet. Ughh.
And what are you? The next PM of the UK? The truth? A person that is more nuanced than this lovely man?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/14/boris-johnson-the-eu-wants-a-superstate-just-as-hitler-did/
You're blaiming me for loosing context and nuance, and others who actually support your case get a 'blanc cheque' into saying anithing they want. If I am hilarious, you are Roger Moore in a clowns suit.