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If Barry Had Scored [place Bond title here], It Would Be So Much Higher In My Personal Ranking...

chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
in Bond Movies Posts: 17,804
Of the Bond movies between 1973 & 1999 that Barry might have scored (he stopped scoring after 2001), which ones would have been noticeably higher in your personal ranking just because of music provided by the master (This will take some amount of imagination I conjure)?

My list:
Of course a Barry score is ALWAYS more desirable to me, but in these cases it would not have radically changed my opinion or rankings of the films I think.
LALD, LTK, GE, TND & TWINE.

TSWLM would be 2, maybe 3 places higher for having a Barry score... possibly breaking it into my top ten...
FYEO however would be top ten material instantly!

Thoughts?
«1

Comments

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    FYEO for sure would improve dramatically for me, and is almost begging for a Barry score, given the toned down espionage style film that it is.

    My thoughts on the others:
    -LTK works fine with the Kamen score which fits the film perfectly imho
    -TSWLM also works brilliantly with the disco score and Hamlisch brings some wonderful cues in Egypt and with the Liparus/Atlantis in particular. Very tense and suspenseful work (different from Barry but sinister sounding like FRWL in places)
    -LALD is a work of art thanks to George Martin's marvelous efforts (2nd only to Barry and perhaps better than what he could come up with in that particular instance imho)
    -GE also works perfectly with Serra's score. Fits the film like a glove.
    -TND - I think it works very well with Arnold's score. I don't like the score all that much due to the blatant overuse of drums and Bond theme, but I think it certainly fits the film
    -TWINE - imho, nothing can save this turd, and quite frankly, I would have preferred Barry not associate his name with it.

    So interestingly, I only think FYEO would have really benefited tremendously from Barry's hand and touch. It's the sort of film that deserved it, and Conti's work was lacking in some areas - didn't suit the film in parts imho.
  • fjdinardofjdinardo
    Posts: 1,970
    I really would have loved too hear Barry score TSWLM. He did such a great job with Moonraker I wonder if it would have been similar
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Skyfall and Spectre could have benefited from a Barry score that's for sure. 60's era style.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    Murdock wrote: »
    Skyfall and Spectre could have benefited from a Barry score that's for sure. 60's era style.
    Since it couldn't have been Barry I'm assuming you mean Arnold? If so I totally agree!

  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Skyfall and Spectre could have benefited from a Barry score that's for sure. 60's era style.
    Since it couldn't have been Barry I'm assuming you mean Arnold? If so I totally agree!
    Arnold would have done amazing as well. In fact I did a few rescores that sound like something he may have done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4uQl513f7k Car Chase
    https://youtube.com/watch?v=91AVii2kO8E Car Chase Blood Stone StyleThis one in particular is very Arnold inspired.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VxZiiTOHrM Train Fight
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGH8Ht1ZXHcPlane Chase
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I realize they are some who have been beating the Arnold drum for some time, & who dislike Newman's efforts, but I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
    They are not bad at all, but Newman is no Arnold.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    chrisisall wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
    They are not bad at all, but Newman is no Arnold.
    I'd say no one is Barry. These other two are workmen doing their thing. Forgotten tomorrow.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    bondjames wrote: »
    I realize they are some who have been beating the Arnold drum for some time, & who dislike Newman's efforts, but I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
    Skyfall's works a bit better but Spectre's takes too much from Skyfall's score so it's very less original. It bugged me watching the movie pointing out, Hey, I heard this cue in Skyfall, this one too. It took me out of the movie. Not enough originality or Bond theme. Too subtle for my liking.

    Dr. No and The Spy Who Loved Me would also benefit from a Barry Score, one thing I appreciate about SPY's score is that Hamilsh did a remake of "Stalking" from FRWL's score so kudo's to Marvin for not being afraid to adapt someone else's work.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    bondjames wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
    They are not bad at all, but Newman is no Arnold.
    I'd say no one is Barry. These other two are workmen doing their thing. Forgotten tomorrow.
    Arnold has a resume I will never forget. He may not be in a league with Barry, Goldsmith & Williams, but then few are.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    CR, QoB, SF & SP would all benefited by getting a better composer.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I don't know. Apart from Arnold's TWINE & DAD efforts in particular, I've just really enjoyed all of the other scores to some extent. I can't really complain.

    Even SP (on recent rewatches I have really come to like the score, because as I said I think it fits the film without competing with it. The film is to me rather low key, including performances, and the score is the same. SF is more charismatic and in your face, and the score is slightly dialed up).

    As I said, only Conti's score seems to be out of place to me, given the kind of film FYEO is - an old school thriller deserves an old school Barry score imho. I still like the score a lot, but it seems not to fit the style of the film in places, because it's dated while the film is quite classic.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I think most of Conti's stuff works, some things don't work out like the disco style cues but I'm mostly happy with it. He really uses the Bond theme well throughout.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Murdock wrote: »
    I think most of Conti's stuff works, some things don't work out like the disco style cues but I'm mostly happy with it. He really uses the Bond theme well throughout.
    Yes, it's the disco style cue I'm referring to that's out of place. It's very memorable and distinctive, but it does date the film quite a bit. Strangely, I don't feel that way about the use in TSWLM, because that scene is just silky smooth and the Bond 77 clip is essentially a reworking of the Bond theme, like what Martin did with the funk elements in LALD and Newman did in Mexico with SP.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,718
    The only non-Barry bit I would like to be re-scored is the old MI6 scene in SP. What on earth went into Newman's head to copy & paste the same 10 second cue for almost 5 minutes straight?
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    The thing I didn't like about Bond 77's disco style was that weird bass sound that plays throughout. That zoont zoont zoont zoont sound. I can't explain it any better. George Martin did a fabulous job, he's pretty much untouchable and that Newman track "Los Muertos Vivos Estan" is the shining star of the entire score. Shame the rest of it wasn't like that.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited February 2016 Posts: 23,883
    DaltonCraig007 wrote: »
    The only non-Barry bit I would like to be re-scored is the old MI6 scene in SP. What on earth went into Newman's head to copy & paste the same 10 second cue for almost 5 minutes straight?
    Agreed fully. This is my only knock on the SP score. Very irritating imho.
    Murdock wrote: »
    The thing I didn't like about Bond 77's disco style was that weird bass sound that plays throughout. That zoont zoont zoont zoont sound. I can't explain it any better. George Martin did a fabulous job, he's pretty much untouchable and that Newman track "Los Muertos Vivos Estan" is the shining star of the entire score. Shame the rest of it wasn't like that.
    I think Bond 77 is just so definitive of Bond at his coolest, like Los Muertos Vivos Estan.

    I think I know why you don't like the rest of the SP score (too dull perhaps), but I really think it works for the kind of film SP is, which to me is more of an old school thriller with a bit of a 70's low key vibe to it. There is a lot of ambient mood setting work Newman does in the film which I quite like, although I realize it's not Barry - like.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think Bond 77 is just so definitive of Bond at his coolest, like Los Muertos Vivos Estan.

    I think I know why you don't like the rest of the SP score (too dull perhaps), but I really think it works for the kind of film SP is, which to me is more of an old school thriller with a bit of a 70's low key vibe to it. There is a lot of ambient mood setting work Newman does in the film which I quite like, although I realize it's not Barry - like.

    The way the Bond theme was used in Bond 77 was great, it's just not one of my favorites. As for SP's score. Aside from 4 tracks, I just think it's too dull and subtle also way to many callbacks to Skyfall's score. Which neither score are terrible, I just think the style they are isn't suited to Bond. Plus I honestly don't think they are very memorable. It's not something I'd clamor to listen to over and over unlike John Barry, George Martin, Michael Kamen heck even Eric Serra and David Arnold's scores. Newman's score may suit the movie just fine but it doesn't stand out good enough for me.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    Guys, one thing here- Barry is the focus, and he couldn't have done Bonds post TWINE. Just sayin'. Arnold vs. Newman arguments are best served elsewhere IMHO.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Licence To Kill:
    instead of No 10 it'd be No 6

    The Spy Who Loved Me:
    instead of No 14 it'd be No 10

    For Your Eyes Only:
    instead of No 8 it'd be No 5

    Skyfall:
    instead of No 18 it'd be No 14

    Dr. No:
    instead of No 17 it'd be No 11

    Spectre:
    instead of No 1 it would be so far away from the rest that it would be unrivalled.

    TND to QOS are perfect the way they are. I wish David Arnold came back to replace that failure Newman. Luckily even Newman couldn't ruin Spectre. I guess Spectre could have had the Minions sing in the background and still be bloody great.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    Spectre:
    instead of No 1 it would be so far away from the rest that it would be unrivaled.
    Certainly possible.... at least the equal of TLD for ME...
    But- again I've gone off my own point!!!
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,187
    Well pretty much any Bond film that doesn't feature a John Barry score - except LTK and GE.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    Birdleson wrote: »
    The obvious two, FOR YOUR EYES ONLY and GOLDENEYE. They are both just outside my Top Ten. That may had been enough to kick them up a spot or two.
    I actually like the Serra score a bit. A Barry score would have certainly improved the movie, but not enough to change my rating of it much at all. Unless it was a better score than for TLD...
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    Birdleson wrote: »
    That is the only Barry score that annoys me.
    Must you BE the anti-matter ME in all things BOND????
    Ummm... I guess I should be flattered in some way.....
    /:)
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    Well, not to pick on David Arnold, but I think I'd put TWINE and TND on top of the list. Why have an imitator when you can have the genuine article?

    Next, I'd have to go with LTK. A Barry score would improve things dramatically for me.

    FYEO and GE would have been better, of course, but I don't mind them as they are.

    I wouldn't want to change LALD or TSWLM.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,585
    chrisisall wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
    They are not bad at all, but Newman is no Arnold.

    That's right. He's 100x better and has the hardware (and credits) to prove it
  • w2bondw2bond is indeed a very rare breed
    Posts: 2,252
    Honestly? All of the non-Barry scores. But in order

    1. SP
    2. SF

    Big gap

    3. GE
    4. LTK

    Gap

    Pretty interchangeable 5-9
    5. FYEO
    6. TWINE
    7. DAD
    8. CR
    9. DN

    10. TND
    11. QOS

    12. TSWLM
    13. LALD


    TripAces wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think SP & SF are fine as they are. The scores suit the respective films imho.
    They are not bad at all, but Newman is no Arnold.

    That's right. He's 100x better and has the hardware (and credits) to prove it

    Yep and Barry and 1000x better than Arnold!
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited February 2016 Posts: 4,399
    GE.... easily - this shouldn't even be a debate (at least on my part lol)... it's the sole reason why EON tried to go back to Barry for TND, but he declined - instead, he suggested they go with David Arnold.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I don't see what's so bad about GE's score. I know "Ladies First" is universally hated but there is plenty of great tracks. All pretty great tracks.

    The GoldenEye Overture
    We Share the Same Passions
    The Severnaya Suite
    Whispering Statues.
    Run, Shoot and Jump
    Tank Drive Through St. Petersburg (the John Altman version.)
    Fatal Weakness
    That's What Keeps You Alone
    Dish out of Water (1:45 minutes in)
    Forever James
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    thank god they got John Altman to rescore that tank sequence... because what Serra composed sounded like he was having a stroke while recording.

    "The Goldeneye Overture"
    "We Share The Same Passions"
    "The Severnaya Suite"
    "Run, Shoot, Jump"

    thats all i take out of that score - the rest i throw in the trash. lol.
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