Blofeld : Did you want him to escape from Bond,in the helicopter ? And what next ? (SP)

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  • GamesBond007GamesBond007 Golden Grotto
    Posts: 66
    I think most of us expected Blofeld to get away. But I do think if done correctly it could set up some interesting stuff going into the next film.

    I would like to see Blofeld questioned within SPECTRE for his actions. He was reckless and overconfident. His ego unravels their goals and in turn gets captured for underestimating Bond. Thus Blofeld becomes ruthless with his power and sets out not just to further his goals with SPECTRE but to also destroy Bond for humiliating him.

    This is where we could see the more psychotic version of the character. It would give Waltz more to do and give his version a bit of an arc.
  • Posts: 15,127
    patb wrote: »
    Yes, agree, at the time, I was looking forward to a pint of Fullers and a packet of nuts, (that's not what should be in your head at the climax to a new Bond movie) its only with hindsight, you try to work out what the writers were thinking,
    just to add, we live in an era of high tech and suicide killings. We know that when the police chase a terror suspect, they rarely arrest as there are too many variables. The safest thing to do is shoot to kill. If anything, a cold execution is more warranted in this era than any other.

    Not if unarmed and not threatening or aggressive.
  • Posts: 4,617
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Jean_Charles_de_Menezes

    This guy made a weaker effort to escape and was a smaller threat than Blofeld. They were ordered to shoot at the head. (even if we ignore the fac that they got the wrong guy), the threat that terrorists create is now very different from 20 years ago and the Police orders have had to change accordingly.

    Just by having a coat that could conseal a bomb or the opportunity to press a button on a moble phone represents a threat.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    Getafix wrote: »
    Shardlake wrote: »
    I know I've been a fan since 1977, even watched all the Pierce films at the cinema although I dislike all 4.

    The thing about SPECTRE is that I had invested in this era, a big Craig advocate. Some were wondering how Craig would fair in a Brosnan like adventure well now you know, not well.

    My frustration hasn't been more obvious than it has with this film, used to think if only with QOS but SP shows what a decent entry that was.

    I don't particularly see why SP is a Brosnan like adventure. It seems superior to the Brosnan films on almost every level.

    I know I'm in a minority but it was actually SF that reminded me most of the Brosnan era. I remember sitting there watching it and thinking how all the nostalgia, backward looking and nods and winks gave me this sinking feeling, like we'd gone back a decade.

    After SF, I sort of new what to expect from Mendes. I didn't go into SP with high expectations, which is probably why I enjoyed it more than most. The PTS alone lifts SP above its predecessor.

    You and I couldn't be more opposite your dislike of SF is exactly how I feel about SP.

    I'm sorry but all the sequences in SF had tension and danger and apart from the PTS SP had no danger at all, it was very tensionless and derivative.

    Just like a Brosnan film, I didn't see that in SF at all, SP is clearly and I think enough people have said it, has more in common with the Brosnan era than any entry Craig's time in the role.

  • Posts: 15,127
    patb wrote: »
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Jean_Charles_de_Menezes

    This guy made a weaker effort to escape and was a smaller threat than Blofeld. They were ordered to shoot at the head. (even if we ignore the fac that they got the wrong guy), the threat that terrorists create is now very different from 20 years ago and the Police orders have had to change accordingly.

    Just by having a coat that could conseal a bomb or the opportunity to press a button on a moble phone represents a threat.

    Different situations different people involved so different actions and consequences. It's not one size fits all.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    I think most of us expected Blofeld to get away. But I do think if done correctly it could set up some interesting stuff going into the next film.

    I would like to see Blofeld questioned within SPECTRE for his actions. He was reckless and overconfident. His ego unravels their goals and in turn gets captured for underestimating Bond. Thus Blofeld becomes ruthless with his power and sets out not just to further his goals with SPECTRE but to also destroy Bond for humiliating him.

    This is where we could see the more psychotic version of the character. It would give Waltz more to do and give his version a bit of an arc.

    A psychotic Blofeld? But why?
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,306
    Milovy wrote: »
    @patb It is really strange to see Bond not kill Blofeld, the baddest of bads (although doing it in cold blood in front of a crowd would have been a bit much). You are right that we expect Bond to make those sorts of decisions, to kill his targets, because he's one of the few who can do so and get away with it. It's his job. Since when do Bond films end with the villain arrested?

    QoS.
  • Posts: 676
    @echo I'm guessing you're referring to Yusef... Hardly the film's villain, is he? Bond leaves Greene to die in the desert.
  • GamesBond007GamesBond007 Golden Grotto
    Posts: 66
    @Thunderfinger I think Waltz's portrayal already carries a bit of sadistic restraint. Being humiliated in such a way would probably cause him to snap. It would give the character a bit more to do rather than the usual.

    I'm not talking about an outrageous Blofeld, but a more sinister approach would make sense.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,890
    Tbh, it was fairly obvious that Blofeld would get arrested at the end. Even Craig's portrayal of Bond isn't cold enough to give him a clean head-shot (point blank) when he's clearly unarmed and so very vulnerable. Before the film starts, I don't think that Bond even hated Franz that much. He still saw him as a little boy who died in a tragic accident. That changes of course, but he still subconsciously thinks it.

    And anyway, Bond would lose his 00 status if he shot him because the whole police force was watching and think about the cameras that would get him on film doing it. No, no. Bond has learnt his lesson about that... "I'll shoot the camera first next time." He's not as reckless as he once was.
  • Posts: 623
    It was right that Bond didn't shoot Blofeld. He's going to be arrested, it's not like he's gone free. The information they might get from Blofeld in interrogation could save more lives. But more importantly, it completes the whole Vesper storyline, from when she tells him "You don't have to keep doing what you're doing". And on the train, Madelaine says the same, and it's at that moment, when Bond is faced with that choice of M and the life of a spy, or Madelaine and normality, that Bond chooses to make that change.
    "Out of bullets".
    And then he leaves the service. So that's it pretty well wrapped up for the 're-boot Bond I think.'
    Now it's time for a new, dashing, actor, and a good, impersonal, spy movie.
  • edited November 2017 Posts: 19,339
    Thanks to a great You Tube post from @Murdock I really really feel that Blofeld ,yet again,was treated as a cheap everyday villain rather than Bond's nemesis.
    I still remember to this day the deep disappointment that the helicopter crashed rather than Bond running out bullets and Blofeld getting away.

    It would have shown that this was a major villain and Bond is not bloody superman,especially to the younger Bond fan out there !!
  • Posts: 4,044
    Wasn't Bond supposed to catch up to the helicopter and find Blofeld gone. Mendes choose to have him get arrested.
  • Posts: 19,339
    vzok wrote: »
    Wasn't Bond supposed to catch up to the helicopter and find Blofeld gone. Mendes choose to have him get arrested.

    Another reason I don't want Mendes...end SP with Blofeld arrested and then bugger off,leaving the shit to be cleared up by the next director.
  • Posts: 11,425
    Having Blofeld arrested by PC Plod was absurd. Who writes this garbage?
  • Posts: 19,339
    Getafix wrote: »
    Having Blofeld arrested by PC Plod was absurd. Who writes this garbage?
    I hate to think who is writing this,if it's P&W then they have seriously lost their mojo.
  • Posts: 11,425
    barryt007 wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    Having Blofeld arrested by PC Plod was absurd. Who writes this garbage?
    I hate to think who is writing this,if it's P&W then they have seriously lost their mojo.

    Did P+W ever have a mojo?

    The guys look like the rejects from a washed up and defunct 1980s soft rock outfit.

    How did they ever get the Bond gig? It's beyond explanation.
  • edited November 2017 Posts: 19,339
    Getafix wrote: »
    barryt007 wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    Having Blofeld arrested by PC Plod was absurd. Who writes this garbage?
    I hate to think who is writing this,if it's P&W then they have seriously lost their mojo.

    Did P+W ever have a mojo?

    The guys look like the rejects from a washed up and defunct 1980s soft rock outfit.

    How did they ever get the Bond gig? It's beyond explanation.

    I was actually going to post that originally ;)) ,and I agree,how the hell do they constantly get the Bond films ?
  • vzok wrote: »
    Wasn't Bond supposed to catch up to the helicopter and find Blofeld gone. Mendes choose to have him get arrested.

    I think it was sort of the opposite actually. Bond was supposed to kill Blofeld on the bridge. I think they probably decided against it because they didn't know if Craig would be back or not so wanted enough wriggle room for a sequel, which seems pretty pointless in hindsight now that Waltz isn't back after all.
  • Posts: 4,044
    vzok wrote: »
    Wasn't Bond supposed to catch up to the helicopter and find Blofeld gone. Mendes choose to have him get arrested.

    I think it was sort of the opposite actually. Bond was supposed to kill Blofeld on the bridge. I think they probably decided against it because they didn't know if Craig would be back or not so wanted enough wriggle room for a sequel, which seems pretty pointless in hindsight now that Waltz isn't back after all.

    I heard that the two options initially were killing him and him disappearing, and Mendes came up with the "safe" option of arresting him.
  • Posts: 11,425
    they were gonna kill him? bizarre
  • Posts: 4,044
    Getafix wrote: »
    they were gonna kill him? bizarre

    I'd be surprised if they thought about doing that for long.
  • Posts: 19,339
    vzok wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    they were gonna kill him? bizarre

    I'd be surprised if they thought about doing that for long.

    You don't fight for years to get the rights to SPECTRE and Blofeld back,and bump him off in the first film you put him in.
    Stupid.

  • Posts: 4,044
    barryt007 wrote: »
    vzok wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    they were gonna kill him? bizarre

    I'd be surprised if they thought about doing that for long.

    You don't fight for years to get the rights to SPECTRE and Blofeld back,and bump him off in the first film you put him in.
    Stupid.

    Their final choice wasn't much better
  • Posts: 19,339
    vzok wrote: »
    barryt007 wrote: »
    vzok wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    they were gonna kill him? bizarre

    I'd be surprised if they thought about doing that for long.

    You don't fight for years to get the rights to SPECTRE and Blofeld back,and bump him off in the first film you put him in.
    Stupid.

    Their final choice wasn't much better

    At least he lived,a small mercy I know but that's something.

  • edited November 2017 Posts: 12,837
    barryt007 wrote: »
    vzok wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    they were gonna kill him? bizarre

    I'd be surprised if they thought about doing that for long.

    You don't fight for years to get the rights to SPECTRE and Blofeld back,and bump him off in the first film you put him in.
    Stupid.

    It was in drafts right up to the last minute. I think they were going to kill him because they thought it might be Craig's last and they seem to be treating the Craig era as its own self contained thing ala Nolan's Batman. In the leaked emails the "hook" of the film they talked about was the idea that it's Bond's last mission and what all the other three films had been building up to.
  • edited November 2017 Posts: 2,918
    To answer the original question: I certainly wanted Blofeld to escape from the helicopter, because there is something ridiculous about the idea of a Bond villain in jail. Bond villains don't go to prison--either Bond utterly destroys them or they escape to cause more havoc and give Bond extra impetus to utterly destroy them. And Blofeld is the archetypal elusive supervillain, not an Arkham Asylum inmate.

    As for what next...well, I'm relieved that Waltz and his Kampy Kraut mannerisms are gone from the series. If the next film is Craig's last, I suggest they forget about Blofeld.
    And for the films after that, when the series will have a new actor? Well, Spectre is a great opponent and Blofeld works well as a behind-the-scenes puppetmaster. Both could be gradually rebuilt into a recurring, convincing threat, especially since the films can't use Chinese, Russian or Middle Eastern villains without losing foreign box office.
    Perhaps somewhere down the line a future Bond will hear a disembodied metallic voice tell him "You had the misfortune to encounter one of our most unbalanced operatives, a lunatic named Oberhauser. This buffoon had the temerity to impersonate me and cloak himself with my illustrious name. But just as medieval Kings paraded their doubles on the battlefield, I decided to give you this mock-Blofeld, and sent sufficient clues for his disposal. I thank you for amputating a gangrenous tentacle of SPECTRE, but the rest of the beast will remain beyond your grasp Mr. Bond. Until we meet again..."
  • Posts: 19,339
    Revelator wrote: »
    To answer the original question: I certainly wanted Blofeld to escape from the helicopter, because there is something ridiculous about the idea of a Bond villain in jail. Bond villains don't go to prison--either Bond utterly destroys them or they escape to cause more havoc and give Bond extra impetus to utterly destroy them. And Blofeld is the archetypal elusive supervillain, not an Arkham Asylum inmate.

    As for what next...well, I'm relieved that Waltz and his Kampy Kraut mannerisms are gone from the series. If the next film is Craig's last, I suggest they forget about Blofeld.
    And for the films after that, when the series will have a new actor? Well, Spectre is a great opponent and Blofeld works well as a behind-the-scenes puppetmaster. Both could be gradually rebuilt into a recurring, convincing threat, especially since the films can't use Chinese, Russian or Middle Eastern villains without losing foreign box office.
    Perhaps somewhere down the line a future Bond will hear a disembodied metallic voice tell him "You had the misfortune to encounter one of our most unbalanced operatives, a lunatic named Oberhauser. This buffoon had the temerity to impersonate me and cloak himself with my illustrious name. But just as medieval Kings paraded their doubles on the battlefield, I decided to give you this mock-Blofeld, and sent sufficient clues for his disposal. I thank you for amputating a gangrenous tentacle of SPECTRE, but the rest of the beast will remain beyond your grasp Mr. Bond. Until we meet again..."

    Post of the day right here.

    A perfect post that I wish would come true @Revelator !!

    Bravo Sir ! :-bd
  • Waltz or not, I'd rather they just didn't mention the Oberhauser/brother stuff than go for a contrived "it wasn't the real Blofeld" do-over. They don't need to mention it anyway. Blofeld will hate Bond for putting him inside, Bond will hate Blofeld for the deaths of Vesper and M. More than enough fair to fuel them being enemies, the foster brother angle doesn't even need to be addressed.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    Waltz or not, I'd rather they just didn't mention the Oberhauser/brother stuff than go for a contrived "it wasn't the real Blofeld" do-over. They don't need to mention it anyway. Blofeld will hate Bond for putting him inside, Bond will hate Blofeld for the deaths of Vesper and M. More than enough fair to fuel them being enemies, the foster brother angle doesn't even need to be addressed.

    I've already forgotten it. Or repressed it, more to the point...

    On to the OP - yes, I would have liked to see Blofeld escape. He's done it before in YOLT/OHMSS. Plus after Bond's unerring accuracy in Blofeld's HQ, it would be nice to see Bond fail.
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