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  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    jobo wrote: »
    Is it wrong to develop this kind of weapon systems, or is it wrong for them ?
    It is definitely wrong for them. Wrong today, in this context, and based on their country's history.
    It's also wrong for other countries to allow it to happen.


    No one should have nuclrar weapons, period

    It's a tad late for that.
  • Posts: 19,339
    jobo wrote: »
    Is it wrong to develop this kind of weapon systems, or is it wrong for them ?
    It is definitely wrong for them. Wrong today, in this context, and based on their country's history.
    It's also wrong for other countries to allow it to happen.


    No one should have nuclrar weapons, period

    Universal disarmament is a pipe dream, @jobo.
    There are too many 'underhand countries' which would always keep something back,therefore making the other countries keep theirs as a deterent.

    Stalemate.

  • edited November 2017 Posts: 7,507
    I know it's too late as of right now. But we shouldn't have let it come to this. Dissarmerment of nuclear weaponry in the future is not utopia though. It is not realistic short term, but is possible further down the line with the right campaign. If it's likely is another thing...

    The whole notion that some "good countries" deserve nuclear weaponry, and some select "bad countries" don't is ridiculous! It is after all only natural that countries like Iran or even North Korea would want them when they know their political adversories and enemies have them in abundance. And it's not like those nuclear powerheads haven't shown any violent tendencies through out history...
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,255
    At least during the cold war we had two powers steered by relatively sane men. And even then a few times it was due to the intelligence and concience of lower military commanders WWIII didn't start. Again we call upon the sanity of those around those two idiots to save the planet from destruction.

    On the other hand, it's one perfect way of stopping global warming...
  • Posts: 7,507
    At least during the cold war we had two powers steered by relatively sane men. And even then a few times it was due to the intelligence and concience of lower military commanders WWIII didn't start. Again we call upon the sanity of those around those two idiots to save the planet from destruction.

    On the other hand, it's one perfect way of stopping global warming...


    I am not sure how good nuclear war would be for the environment... ;)
  • Posts: 4,615
    Nuclear deterent principles are based on all sides acting rationally. This has worked so far but people can come to their own conclusions whether S Korea is governed by rational people. Since we as a species invented the bomb, it was just a matter of time before the tech know how fell into the hands of the wrong people. The only thing you can really do is "nip it in the bud" before they get to the point of becoming a threat. Air strikes on the appropriate points would seem the only option at the moment with the will to repell conventional strikes into South Korea that would be the obvious revenge ploy.

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited December 2017 Posts: 24,179
    It's so reassuring that America elected a senile man who probably has to wake up three times at night to pee to manage this conflict. ;-)
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    It's so reassuring that America elected a senile man who probably has to wake up three times at night to pee to manage this conflict. ;-)

    hqdefault.jpg

    History really does repeat itself.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,179
    It does indeed.
  • Posts: 4,615
    Not in this case, I would rather have Reagan than Trump any day. Reagan was a God compared to Trump:

    http://www.lettersofnote.com/2012/05/love-dad.html
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,255
    Well Reagan was an actor, Trump a reality star...........
  • Posts: 19,339
    This just in,from Sky News :

    Nine terror attacks prevented in past year,in UK,announces MI5.

    BBGfuuL.img?h=410&w=728&m=6&q=60&o=f&l=f&x=1027&y=248

    A total of nine terrorist attacks have been prevented in the UK in the past year, MI5 has said.

    MI5 has previously said that 13 terror attacks were prevented in the past four years.


    The director general of the UK's domestic security service, Andrew Parker, told the Cabinet of the number of prevented attacks this morning, according to Downing Street.
    Mr Parker told Theresa May that the defeat of Islamic State in Syria did not mean that the terrorist threat was over.

    He warned that social media was being used to incite terrorist attacks from afar.
    The numbers have been released ahead of the publication of an investigation into the internal reviews by the security services and police into a wave of terror attacks in Britain this year.

    Attacks at Westminster Bridge, Manchester, London Bridge and Finsbury Park have prompted internal reviews by police and MI5. September's attack at Parsons Green was not covered by the report.

    BBGfQU3.img?h=486&w=728&m=6&q=60&o=f&l=f

    The reviews were to establish what intelligence the security services and police held on the attackers ahead of time and identify whether improvements could be made in the way potential terrorists were managed.


    David Anderson QC, formerly the independent reviewer of terror legislation, was appointed by the government to provide "independent assurance" of these internal reviews.

    Mr Anderson submitted his classified report to the Home Secretary in October, and a version of his findings is to be published by the Government on Tuesday.

    Counter-terror investigators in the UK are estimated to be running 500 live investigations involving 3,000 individuals at any one time.

    There is considered to be a wider pool of 20,000 "subjects of interest" who are continually being kept under review
    .


  • QsAssistantQsAssistant All those moments lost in time... like tears in rain
    Posts: 1,812
    I will say the only positive thing to come from current events, in regards to North Korea, is that it could spawn some pretty interesting Bond films in the future... assuming we don't end the world with nuclear war...
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    edited December 2017 Posts: 1,003
    Doubt NK even does anything. This is a diplomatic nightmare because you also have China and Russia caught in the middle.. NK is a horrible place though. They support ISIS and they will literally have people killed for anything over there.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/12/29/asia/kim-jong-un-executions/index.html

    I think it’s hiliarious how people blame Trump for this nuclear crisis but they have been threatening to nuke us for years.. It’s one thing to say you want a nuke too for your countries protection but to continuously threaten to kill and destroy other countries? Nope.

    USA would easily wipe them out. Hopefully it doesn’t come to that.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,255
    Doubt NK even does anything. This is a diplomatic nightmare because you also have China and Russia caught in the middle.. NK is a horrible place though. They support ISIS and they will literally have people killed for anything over there.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/12/29/asia/kim-jong-un-executions/index.html

    I think it’s hiliarious how people blame Trump for this nuclear crisis but they have been threatening to nuke us for years.. It’s one thing to say you want a nuke too for your countries protection but to continuously threaten to kill and destroy other countries? Nope.

    USA would easily wipe them out. Hopefully it doesn’t come to that.

    AFAK nobody is blaming Trump for the crisis itself, but they're blaming him for making it far worse. He's like a bully shouting at an anoying kid 'come on then, pull the trigger!' instead of 'mate, perhaps you should put that machine gun away, or at least not point it at my family'.

    The question isn't if the USA would win, the question is how many lives would it cost. With the biggest artillerery battery the world has ever seen aimed straight at Seoul, only 60 KM from the border, the devestation would be immense even if the NK's didn't send an atomic bomb towards the US or Japan.

    And yes,NK has been threatening to send a nuclear warhead to the USA for decades. There's a difference though:1. they now actually have one to send 2. They've got a new leader whos'very unstable and knows little about the rest of the world. He sure as hell doesn't care for human lives though..
  • Posts: 7,507
    I have seen interviews with American Trump supporters who are not concerned with a nuclear war because "if one of them hit America, it would not be in my town. Bring it on!"

    How messed up is that??
  • Posts: 19,339
    jobo wrote: »
    I have seen interviews with American Trump supporters who are not concerned with a nuclear war because "if one of them hit America, it would not be in my town. Bring it on!"

    How messed up is that??

    The fact that there are so many people like that all over the world is staggering and depressing.

  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Any N.Korean missile can reach America, they only need a truck and driver ! ;-)
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    barryt007 wrote: »
    jobo wrote: »
    I have seen interviews with American Trump supporters who are not concerned with a nuclear war because "if one of them hit America, it would not be in my town. Bring it on!"

    How messed up is that??

    The fact that there are so many people like that all over the world is staggering and depressing.

    I have also seen liberals saying they want them to nuke us because of Trump and they would rather live in North Korea.. Smh. Idiots in both parties!
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    Doubt NK even does anything. This is a diplomatic nightmare because you also have China and Russia caught in the middle.. NK is a horrible place though. They support ISIS and they will literally have people killed for anything over there.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/12/29/asia/kim-jong-un-executions/index.html

    I think it’s hiliarious how people blame Trump for this nuclear crisis but they have been threatening to nuke us for years.. It’s one thing to say you want a nuke too for your countries protection but to continuously threaten to kill and destroy other countries? Nope.

    USA would easily wipe them out. Hopefully it doesn’t come to that.

    AFAK nobody is blaming Trump for the crisis itself, but they're blaming him for making it far worse. He's like a bully shouting at an anoying kid 'come on then, pull the trigger!' instead of 'mate, perhaps you should put that machine gun away, or at least not point it at my family'.

    The question isn't if the USA would win, the question is how many lives would it cost. With the biggest artillerery battery the world has ever seen aimed straight at Seoul, only 60 KM from the border, the devestation would be immense even if the NK's didn't send an atomic bomb towards the US or Japan.

    And yes,NK has been threatening to send a nuclear warhead to the USA for decades. There's a difference though:1. they now actually have one to send 2. They've got a new leader whos'very unstable and knows little about the rest of the world. He sure as hell doesn't care for human lives though..


    He is what 33? He’s a young world leader who gets whatever he wants. He killed his ex girlfriend and her entire family just because they broke up.. He also ordered disabled babies to be killed..

    This guy needs to be taken out. Maybe not nuke him but a covert assassination plot. Then again this sounds like Iran and Cuba all over again. I honestly don’t believe they have a nuke that can reach the states. Maybe USA territories but they can’t reach Washington. No way. We also have defense systems which would shoot it down. From my understanding,

    If we attack them first then China and Russia are against us..?

    If they attack us first then China and Russia are our allies?

    It’s a pretty complicated situation.

    We might not agree on a lot of things but Trump tweeting doesn’t help. He needs to remember he isn’t a celebrity anymore who can say what he wants , his actions have consequences. Although they did they just say Trump has been ordered to be killed if he’s ever seen in NK. LOL.
  • Posts: 4,615
    Say, in theory, Obama was allowed to run for a third time and was in office now. What would he do? Sit back and wait till the whole area was under threat of nuclear weapons.

    No president can wait for that situation to come. Even the most liberal leader would be forced into taking some action.

  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    patb wrote: »
    Say, in theory, Obama was allowed to run for a third time and was in office now. What would he do? Sit back and wait till the whole area was under threat of nuclear weapons.

    No president can wait for that situation to come. Even the most liberal leader would be forced into taking some action.

    Obama wouldn’t do anything. He didn’t do anything to attempt to fix relations between NK in his eight years..

  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,255
    Doubt NK even does anything. This is a diplomatic nightmare because you also have China and Russia caught in the middle.. NK is a horrible place though. They support ISIS and they will literally have people killed for anything over there.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/12/29/asia/kim-jong-un-executions/index.html

    I think it’s hiliarious how people blame Trump for this nuclear crisis but they have been threatening to nuke us for years.. It’s one thing to say you want a nuke too for your countries protection but to continuously threaten to kill and destroy other countries? Nope.

    USA would easily wipe them out. Hopefully it doesn’t come to that.

    AFAK nobody is blaming Trump for the crisis itself, but they're blaming him for making it far worse. He's like a bully shouting at an anoying kid 'come on then, pull the trigger!' instead of 'mate, perhaps you should put that machine gun away, or at least not point it at my family'.

    The question isn't if the USA would win, the question is how many lives would it cost. With the biggest artillerery battery the world has ever seen aimed straight at Seoul, only 60 KM from the border, the devestation would be immense even if the NK's didn't send an atomic bomb towards the US or Japan.

    And yes,NK has been threatening to send a nuclear warhead to the USA for decades. There's a difference though:1. they now actually have one to send 2. They've got a new leader whos'very unstable and knows little about the rest of the world. He sure as hell doesn't care for human lives though..


    He is what 33? He’s a young world leader who gets whatever he wants. He killed his ex girlfriend and her entire family just because they broke up.. He also ordered disabled babies to be killed..

    This guy needs to be taken out. Maybe not nuke him but a covert assassination plot. Then again this sounds like Iran and Cuba all over again. I honestly don’t believe they have a nuke that can reach the states. Maybe USA territories but they can’t reach Washington. No way. We also have defense systems which would shoot it down. From my understanding,

    If we attack them first then China and Russia are against us..?

    If they attack us first then China and Russia are our allies?

    It’s a pretty complicated situation.

    We might not agree on a lot of things but Trump tweeting doesn’t help. He needs to remember he isn’t a celebrity anymore who can say what he wants , his actions have consequences. Although they did they just say Trump has been ordered to be killed if he’s ever seen in NK. LOL.

    And that's the main problem. Experts are sure NK is capable of putting a bomb on top of a missile that could reach the US mainland. And the latest rocket indeed seems to be capable of reaching Washington. Not that it matters, in numbers those aren't even the worst places to hit.

    I wouldn't worry about the Russians, they won't attack, they at worst will use it as an excuse to meddle more in the middle east. And tbh I don't think the Chinese would act either, Un is far more of a nuesance to Bejing then his father ever could be. The problem is the amount of lives it would cost, even without a nuclear warhead it would quickly go to a million or more. But with the A-bomb on anything like Tokyo or LA? An execution strike has long been thought of, but the NK high command is dug into very, very deep bunkers, and Un is expecting the US to attempt such a strike.

    All in all, little to no solution and two leaders challanging to pull the trigger first.
  • Posts: 7,507
    Yes. An assasination strike is easy, peacy isn't it? And it runs no risk. Will it be any reaction to a failed assasination atttempt on Un? Surely not!

    But who cares anyway. What matters is who would win an eventual war at the end of the day...
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,798
    At the signpost up ahead... the Twilight Zone-?
    2021 Post Wars Interview with Paul Ryan in Rio- America, Mexico and his new car!

    FOX NEWS PUBLIC INFO: So Paul, what’s new?
    Secretary Of World Enforcement Policy PAUL RYAN: This CAR! Isn’t she a beauty? Zero to sixty in 9 seconds! And totally bulletproof!
    FNPI: Yes, very pretty. Aston outdid themselves there. Ejection roof too?
    PR: Haha, no… they said it would compromise the bullet proofyness.
    FNPI: So, Mexico… big win there, eh?
    PR: Yes, decisive, strong, total… we’re very happy. When they attacked the wall, that was when the pricetag was ultimately called in. Now they can make our clothes to do penance for their lack of vision. Heh, I love that line from Return of the Jedi…
    FNPI: That’s not the actual line…
    PR: John, do I need to disappear you?
    FNPI: No sir, I was just…
    PR: No worries man, I was just messing with you.
    FNPI: Yes sir. Sorry. So, what are these little ‘L’s I see on your car?
    PR: Every time my car gets hit with some AntiFa bullet, I have the car guy cover the chip with an ‘L’... for Liberal. Or loser- take your pick. Kind of like small scars of enemy impotence… I love them.
    FNPI: So funny! I was wondering, if you get fired on wherever you go, isn’t that a little disconcerting? Does it seem like a good trade-off for your power?
    PR: It’s completely exciting. And my tail guys always finish them off. Seen the Youtube vids?
    FNPI: Yes, we all have. How has it been working with Mike since Don was committed?
    PR: It’s fine.
    FNPI: That’s all you have to say?
    PR: Look, my new Wife and I are on holiday here; THAT’S what’s on my mind. Not Donald.
    FNPI: I know your time is short- any last comment on America for Americans?
    PR: Hey, N.Korea is pulling itself together, the levels are coming down and it didn’t even all drift as far south as they said it would, U.S. profitable mining in Africa is at an all time high, Putin finally resigned in utter disgrace after his latest Pee Tapes surfaced, and Rio is an amazing addition to the union! America rules. Ayn & I need to go now. Unlike Alexander, I have more worlds to conquer.
    FNPI: Ayn?
    PR: I named the car Ayn. After Rand. Look- don’t ask who she was or I WILL have you disappeared. Later, John.
    FNPI: Thank you sir.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    the day a nuclear missle hits US soil, is the day that North Korea ceases to exist....

    But i personally believe, that this "show of force" from North Korea is really nothing more than wanting to be "one of the big boys".. it's Kim Jon rattling the sabre, to show that he doesn't want to sit at the kiddie's table anymore, and wants to be a major player when it comes to deciding global politics.... because what else is the end game here?.. he would risk his spec of land against a global nuclear superpower because he wants land that he is not going to get?....i just hope and pray for the safety of those in South Korea, Japan and the Philippines - because that's most likely who he is really going to target first.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    Doubt NK even does anything. This is a diplomatic nightmare because you also have China and Russia caught in the middle.. NK is a horrible place though. They support ISIS and they will literally have people killed for anything over there.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/12/29/asia/kim-jong-un-executions/index.html

    I think it’s hiliarious how people blame Trump for this nuclear crisis but they have been threatening to nuke us for years.. It’s one thing to say you want a nuke too for your countries protection but to continuously threaten to kill and destroy other countries? Nope.

    USA would easily wipe them out. Hopefully it doesn’t come to that.

    AFAK nobody is blaming Trump for the crisis itself, but they're blaming him for making it far worse. He's like a bully shouting at an anoying kid 'come on then, pull the trigger!' instead of 'mate, perhaps you should put that machine gun away, or at least not point it at my family'.

    The question isn't if the USA would win, the question is how many lives would it cost. With the biggest artillerery battery the world has ever seen aimed straight at Seoul, only 60 KM from the border, the devestation would be immense even if the NK's didn't send an atomic bomb towards the US or Japan.

    And yes,NK has been threatening to send a nuclear warhead to the USA for decades. There's a difference though:1. they now actually have one to send 2. They've got a new leader whos'very unstable and knows little about the rest of the world. He sure as hell doesn't care for human lives though..


    He is what 33? He’s a young world leader who gets whatever he wants. He killed his ex girlfriend and her entire family just because they broke up.. He also ordered disabled babies to be killed..

    This guy needs to be taken out. Maybe not nuke him but a covert assassination plot. Then again this sounds like Iran and Cuba all over again. I honestly don’t believe they have a nuke that can reach the states. Maybe USA territories but they can’t reach Washington. No way. We also have defense systems which would shoot it down. From my understanding,

    If we attack them first then China and Russia are against us..?

    If they attack us first then China and Russia are our allies?

    It’s a pretty complicated situation.

    We might not agree on a lot of things but Trump tweeting doesn’t help. He needs to remember he isn’t a celebrity anymore who can say what he wants , his actions have consequences. Although they did they just say Trump has been ordered to be killed if he’s ever seen in NK. LOL.

    And that's the main problem. Experts are sure NK is capable of putting a bomb on top of a missile that could reach the US mainland. And the latest rocket indeed seems to be capable of reaching Washington. Not that it matters, in numbers those aren't even the worst places to hit.

    I wouldn't worry about the Russians, they won't attack, they at worst will use it as an excuse to meddle more in the middle east. And tbh I don't think the Chinese would act either, Un is far more of a nuesance to Bejing then his father ever could be. The problem is the amount of lives it would cost, even without a nuclear warhead it would quickly go to a million or more. But with the A-bomb on anything like Tokyo or LA? An execution strike has long been thought of, but the NK high command is dug into very, very deep bunkers, and Un is expecting the US to attempt such a strike.

    All in all, little to no solution and two leaders challanging to pull the trigger first.

    there is no way they have gone from a missile capabilities barely being able to reach Japan - to suddenly able to strike Washington DC - unless you mean Washington state.... it's all posturing at this stage.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,255
    @haserot that's hat everybody thought at the beginning of the year, but the latest missile tests would point out differently. It isn't a given however, but considering the success they've had (compared to the lack thereof in the previous years) there's great reason for concearn.
    This page gives a good summary:
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-16/north-korea-missile-range-map/8880894

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,798
    @DarthDimi, yep.
  • Posts: 19,339
    chrisisall wrote: »

    Yep,you will still defend him,you mean,Chris ?

This discussion has been closed.