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A View to A Kill - Underrated?

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  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    Prior to DAD this could even be the lowest moment of the series.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Well THIS is clearly the lowest moment in the series. By far.



    maybe, maybe....closely followed by the 10 seconds of CGI tsunami in DAD.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited June 2017 Posts: 23,883
    @BondJasonBond006, that's one of the highlights of SF for me. Up there with 006's 'strawberries' line in GE.

    If you have a problem with that, I'm not sure what you think of this (fan made and which went viral in 2012):
    http://i.imgur.com/V7DW5Sf.jpg
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 41,011
    I just wish they kept the delivery from the trailers; minor complaint, of course, I quite love that scene overall, particularly Silva's intro speech. Best villain unveiling since the shadowy exit of "Janus" in GE.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited June 2017 Posts: 9,020
    Gustav Graves introduction is way better.
    Oberhauser's is even crushing Silva's to bits.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    Gustav Graves introduction is way better.
    Oberhauser's is even crushing Silva's to bits.

    Do you watch the films dubbed?
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 41,011
    I find lots of enjoyment in DAD, but Graves' introduction is probably one of the biggest cringeworthy introductions of the series.

    "As they say in fencing, 'what's the point?'"
    No, Gustav, nobody in fencing says that. Ever.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I have to admit his dive intro was pretty impressive, as was the seguing in from London's Calling to Arnold's score.

    "You only get one shot at life. Why waste it on sleep?"
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    If you put AVTAK into perspective of the timeline it becomes clear it is not up to the job overall.

    1983 Octopussy
    1985 A View To A Kill
    1987 The Living Daylights

    Not sure what went wrong in 1985 but a lot did. Still AVTAK is certainly not the least good Bond film. For me it's better than TMWTGG, QOS, TWINE, SF.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    RC7 wrote: »
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    Gustav Graves introduction is way better.
    Oberhauser's is even crushing Silva's to bits.

    Do you watch the films dubbed?


    The only Bond film I always watch in German is OHMSS. Because it is actually better that way, I love Diana Rigg and always watch The Avengers in English but the German voice actress for her is wonderful.

    I watch the Craig Bonds in German more than I watch them in English. Just because Craig has not much of distinctive voice and his German voice actor is great.

    Silva in German is slightly less annoying I must say, they tone down the silliness quite a bit, luckily.

    Waltz of course is way better in German as it is his first language. But he is great in English as well.

    As for Connery, Moore, Dalton and Brosnan. Always English, always.

    I'm bilingual anyway.
  • stun_harvestingstun_harvesting
    edited June 2017 Posts: 337
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    If you put AVTAK into perspective of the timeline it becomes clear it is not up to the job overall.

    1983 Octopussy
    1985 A View To A Kill
    1987 The Living Daylights

    Not sure what went wrong in 1985 but a lot did. Still AVTAK is certainly not the least good Bond film. For me it's better than TMWTGG, QOS, TWINE, SF.

    Not for me. Starting from Octopussy, the 80's were a massive slippery slope. It got drearier and more melodramatic with each movie, and it felt like they were trying increasingly harder to make Bond darker and more realistic, which I just didn't feel was necessary (I'm aware that I'm not going to be backed up on that very much over here).

    And while people are right in saying that the 80's saw Bond become more grounded and grittier, I consider that a mark against the time. For one, they were losing the dramatic flair and extravaganza of Bond, but they also weren't even able to fully commit to that darker turn either. All the Bonds, even the dreadfully dark LTK, had a couple of over-the-top scenes, which I think goes to speak of the influence of Bond in the 70's. Quite literally, the 80's was in the shadow of the 70's — whether that be in the films themselves or the box office results they produced.
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited June 2017 Posts: 11,425
    The 80s were a golden age for Bond. As a decade I prefer them to the 70s films personally. Glen had it down to an art form.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited June 2017 Posts: 11,189
    I like the 80s but I can't agree they were a golden-age. A silver age? Maybe.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited June 2017 Posts: 9,020
    60s OHMSS
    80s TLD
    70s TSWLM
    90s GE
    00s CR
    10s SP

    Easy as pie to rank the decades.

    AVTAK is a weaker link in the 80s.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,890
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    60s OHMSS
    80s TLD
    70s TSWLM
    90s GE
    00s CR
    10s SP

    Easy as pie to rank the decades.

    AVTAK is a weaker link in the 80s.

    How did you rank it by decade? The net score for all films per decade, or the number of excellent Bond films?? (60s wins in either case imho)
  • GBFGBF
    Posts: 3,198
    The advantage of watching AVTAK in German is that Stacy's screams are less annoying. It also becomes less obviuous that she is not an competent geologist since her lines sound more believable when dubbed.

    I think AVTAK is still a very funny and entertaining film. I also like the locations and I am certainly biased because of that. In fact, Paris and San Francisico are two of my absolute favourite cities. I also don't think that Roger is not motivated he is just too old and that is why people do not take him seriously.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    stun_harvesting wrote: »
    And while people are right in saying that the 80's saw Bond become more grounded and grittier, I consider that a mark against the time. For one, they were losing the dramatic flair and extravaganza of Bond, but they also weren't even able to fully commit to that darker turn either. All the Bonds, even the dreadfully dark LTK, had a couple of over-the-top scenes, which I think goes to speak of the influence of Bond in the 70's. Quite literally, the 80's was in the shadow of the 70's — whether that be in the films themselves or the box office results they produced.
    I agree. While I like the 80's films very much, they aren't a patch on the 70's efforts for me, which is still my 2nd most preferred era after the legendary 60's. Bond was still 'larger than life' then and had a certain unique stylish mystique. After that it became more like any other effort.

    60's
    70's
    80's
    00's
    90's

  • GetafixGetafix
    edited June 2017 Posts: 11,425
    the 90s, sadly will always come at the bottom. hard to see that ever changing
  • stun_harvestingstun_harvesting
    edited June 2017 Posts: 337
    bondjames wrote: »
    stun_harvesting wrote: »
    And while people are right in saying that the 80's saw Bond become more grounded and grittier, I consider that a mark against the time. For one, they were losing the dramatic flair and extravaganza of Bond, but they also weren't even able to fully commit to that darker turn either. All the Bonds, even the dreadfully dark LTK, had a couple of over-the-top scenes, which I think goes to speak of the influence of Bond in the 70's. Quite literally, the 80's was in the shadow of the 70's — whether that be in the films themselves or the box office results they produced.
    I agree. While I like the 80's films very much, they aren't a patch on the 70's efforts for me, which is still my 2nd most preferred era after the legendary 60's. Bond was still 'larger than life' then and had a certain unique stylish mystique. After that it became more like any other effort.

    60's
    70's
    80's
    00's
    90's

    Not sure about the 80's and 00's (since they're interchangeable) and I can understand the 60's > 70's, but I favour the 70's most if only for nostalgic reasons. Since then it's been a mishmash, IMO. 90's sits at the bottom, yeah. They had a rough time coming out of hibernation with Broccoli dying and all.

    I may well be lynched for this, but I genuinely prefer the likes of Moonraker to Licence to Kill. But then again, I was drawn to Bond by that sort of extravagant cheesiness, so that should largely explain my seemingly erratic views.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    stun_harvesting wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    stun_harvesting wrote: »
    And while people are right in saying that the 80's saw Bond become more grounded and grittier, I consider that a mark against the time. For one, they were losing the dramatic flair and extravaganza of Bond, but they also weren't even able to fully commit to that darker turn either. All the Bonds, even the dreadfully dark LTK, had a couple of over-the-top scenes, which I think goes to speak of the influence of Bond in the 70's. Quite literally, the 80's was in the shadow of the 70's — whether that be in the films themselves or the box office results they produced.
    I agree. While I like the 80's films very much, they aren't a patch on the 70's efforts for me, which is still my 2nd most preferred era after the legendary 60's. Bond was still 'larger than life' then and had a certain unique stylish mystique. After that it became more like any other effort.

    60's
    70's
    80's
    00's
    90's



    I may well be lynched for this, but I genuinely prefer the likes of Moonraker to Licence to Kill. .

    I'm inclined to think that way too. MR is silly but has an old-school style of epic film-making that still looks impressive today.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited June 2017 Posts: 23,883
    MR is the last of the true Bond epics in my view. Once Adam left everything just became so much more mundane. The almost otherworldly visual presentation disappeared.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Tend to agree. There's a lot of great stuff in MR. A shame it goes that little bit too far at times.

    I have no particular issue with ranking it above LTK.
  • stun_harvestingstun_harvesting
    edited June 2017 Posts: 337
    Completely agreed with @bondjames and @BAIN123. At the time the 80's hardly even felt like Bond for me anymore. Especially after Moore retired.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Ha ha. It's all about timing I guess.

    First Bond I saw in the cinema - TLD.

    I do consider Glen era a very solid body of work. Understand what you're saying and those films definitely lack the scale of the earlier films but I still find them very enjoyable. OP is one of my favourites.
  • barryt007barryt007
    Posts: 19,339
    Getafix wrote: »
    Ha ha. It's all about timing I guess.

    First Bond I saw in the cinema - TLD.

    I do consider Glen era a very solid body of work. Understand what you're saying and those films definitely lack the scale of the earlier films but I still find them very enjoyable. OP is one of my favourites.

    I was very lucky that this film was my first cinematic viewing of Bond.
    I always have a soft spot for it.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I love OP too. The 80's gave us very satisfying thrillers. However, they lacked that idiosyncratic flavour of the earlier entries, which was something which characterized Bond and differentiated it from the run of the mill competitors.
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited June 2017 Posts: 11,425
    Slightly unfair I think. OP is pretty bonkers, in that 1970s way.

    Just listing the 70s films reminds me that it wasn't exactly a vintage era.

    DAF, LALD, TMWTGG, TSWLM, MR

    Apart from TSWLM, none of these would be films I'd particularly rush to rewatch.

    Whereas with the 80s

    FYEO, OP, AVTAK, TLD, LTK

    I'd happily watch 3 of them at least at any time.
  • barryt007barryt007
    Posts: 19,339
    Agreed @bondjames ,but i'm glad we got OP,AVTAK & LTK in the 80's..i enjoy all 3 of them .
  • stun_harvestingstun_harvesting
    edited June 2017 Posts: 337
    Getafix wrote: »
    Ha ha. It's all about timing I guess.

    First Bond I saw in the cinema - TLD.

    I do consider Glen era a very solid body of work. Understand what you're saying and those films definitely lack the scale of the earlier films but I still find them very enjoyable. OP is one of my favourites.

    OP is the only good one there, IMO. I found things to enjoy in AVTAK and FYEO (though you know my thoughts on that one), but TLD felt like a serious drop-off to me and LTK genuinely made me lose my interest in Bond for about five years. Thankfully GE was around when they came back and it reminded me of the old Bonds enough to get me interested in the franchise again.

    Having rewatched them a fair few times since then (bar LTK, which I've only seen once or twice), I've been able to find more to enjoy about them. I still find LTK hard to swallow, though, because it brought the worst of both worlds together for me (a poor take on the Moore-like scenes, and just excessive grit).

    But I understand many people enjoy Dalton for pulling Bond away from the camp of the Moore era. It's just that the camp was kind of what got me into Bond in the first place. :)
  • fjdinardofjdinardo
    Posts: 1,991
    The villains really make this film for me.
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