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As for Chapter 4, while I might rank it as my least favorite, that's not to take away from how emotionally powerful it is or how stunning the action looks, especially the action-packed Paris sequences. You can tell a new screenwriter took over the duties here and sometimes there's too heavy of a focus on the other characters, not Wick's journey, which I didn't care for, but all in all, still a very, very good time, loud, bombastic and exciting. Paris as a whole easily makes for the best part of the film but my jaw dropped when:
Happy to hear it! I hope you enjoy the fourth one as well.
https://hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/ballerina-release-date-john-wick-spinoff-1235366879/
In over a year we will know further adventures (chronologically earlier - between Chapter 3 and 4) of John Wick, Winston and Charon.
I wonder if the movie will have the atmosphere of the previous films in the series.
That's certainly the only reason I need!
I'm a bit worried too. I'd prefer Chad Stahelski to direct (after all thanks to him John Wick series became famous as good action movies), although he's still a producer, but well ... it's not the same.
But I'm hoping for a good movie. Ana de Armas was badass as Paloma in No Time to Die. If she is as good in Ballerina I’m in.
You're right, definitely not the same, though I'm sure they'll market the hell out of him being a producer.
I'm also hopeful it's good. I dig the cast and, as you say, Ana was fantastic in NTTD, one of the best parts of the film. I think she's really going to shine in this.
I'm sure we'll get into spoilers more once everyone has seen it and the film has been out a while, so I'll detail my issues in full later, but I think the biggest thing that bothered me (and @Creasy47 alluded to this) is that John Wick isn't as much a character in 4 as he is in the other films, and you can feel the absence of Derek Kolstad, the writer for all the past films and the real brain child behind Wick and his twisted world. The ratio of time John is in the story and not is far wider a gap than I wanted, and it's honestly disappointing the amount of times it feels like the movie was straying away from focus on him and his story to focus on other characters and locations for what seem to be weak attempts to set up spin-offs down the line. Which I never understand, because I follow these films because of John and his story, and wouldn't be as interested in stories that don't have some connection to him.
I love the underworld and the world building of the criminal underbelly we've seen develop over these films, and love seeing it all fleshed out with more characters and locations that expand the lore, but in the filmmaker's ambition to show so much more we get far less of John and his journey, which should've been priority. He doesn't say a whole lot for massive parts of the film, and we don't get as much of a look inside his head to know what he's thinking or feeling at prime circumstances where those sorts of character moments matter. I think losing Kolstad could be the reason why Wick feels so distant and cold in this film, because he was great at telling us what John was thinking and feeling even when he wasn't saying much. The new writer just wasn't as adept, and the film suffers for it. In what should have been the most emotional and heart-wrenching film of the series, there are moments where I'm left cold.
The action is incredible, surprise, surprise, but it all comes at a heavy cost. The film is very long, and there were times where I felt every second of it. I will admire these performers till the end of time for the amazing work they have pulled off across the series, and for how well choreographed and performed these many sequences are, but once again we have to speak of ratios. No lie, there were times where I was watching this film and thinking to myself, "Jesus, is this over yet?" The action in some sequences just goes on, and on, and on, sometimes ridiculously so, to the point that it stretches the credibility of even the now cartoonish world that Wick inhabits to absolute ruin. It all becomes so repetitive after a while, and the longer the action sequences are the less time we get for anything related to the characters and their story, which is the biggest failure of this film.
The other films had crazy action, but it was balanced with the story and a look into the characters and the world they inhabited. Here, that ratio is much more imbalanced and you feel it. There are entire sections where an interesting story turn or plot point is put on hold to make room for a ten or fifteen minute action barrage that goes on so long you start to forget what you are supposed to be anticipating next as far as the story goes. For action lovers this film will be a treat, but for those like me that love John Wick and his story more than flashy visuals, his journey felt severely undercut by just how much action was pumped into this behemoth. They went too far with the action this time, so much so that during the seventh of the eight climaxes this film seems to have, I genuinely rolled my eyes and just shook my head at the ridiculousness of what was on display. John Wick started the series as a man turned powerful myth that was terrifying and exceptional at what he did, but he still had moments where he took severe hits and you saw him dealing with the built up damage from those injuries, to the point that he'd hobble around or get out of breath while nursing a fresh wound as he tries to recover. In this movie he basically might as well just be confirmed to be a superhero, and that is part of what undercuts this film so badly. From the poorer storytelling to the lack of focus and the overblown action, it all robs John Wick of his humanity, during a story which should have seen him at his rawest and most human of all.
I don't know how much of the issues I have with the film, its pacing and bloat are to do with the fact that there was originally supposed to be a John Wick 5 that was going to be filmed alongside #4, before COVID hit and plans changed, but it certainly seems to be a prime suspect. The movie ultimately feels like two violently crammed together films that should've been allowed to exist on their own, giving the story and characters more time to breathe in each. Instead, it appears that the intended stories for 4 & 5 were compromised, watered down and Frankensteined together to make a movie that is weighed down by its own ambitions and imbalanced ratio of action and story, failing to come together with anywhere near the cohesiveness, polish and economical pacing that is on display in the other three films. It's still a fun ride and has a lot to offer, don't get me wrong, but it is far lesser than I was hoping it would be and easily ranks as the lowest in the series for me, no question.
I'm interested to hear what others think as times goes on, especially when we can get into the nitty gritty of the film itself in more spoilery discussions.
That is to say once again that it isn't a bad or horrible film by any estimation. There is so much in it that is wonderful, gorgeous, intense, and just insane to take in because you can't begin to imagine how they managed to even execute some of these set pieces. Two of the sequences in particular were impressive to me not just because of how incredible their execution was, but because we've never actually seen anything like them done in a Wick film before. So even in a film that feels repetitive as far as action goes, there are moments that are as fresh as ever, and I wish there were more of that experimental edge to the action on display. Ultimately, it's just that because the last three were so good and well paced and balanced, this one in particular sticks out to me as much weaker.
I think the film would've benefitted from having most major sequences edited down, which would've made them feel more intense and memorable, and given more time to the evolving story that took a big back seat. There are times where you are literally waiting for the next story event to happen in real time, and the action drags and drags in a way it shouldn't. I can only watch John flip and gun kata guys so much before I wonder what the point is of what we're doing, which is why the moments where some freshness was on display were engaging. It was stuff we hadn't already seen for three movies in a row, and that was nice. I just think far too much of the film was born out of the creative idea of saying, "what happens if we cast Donnie Yen, Scott Adkins and Hiroyuki Sanada in this movie and just let them all go to town?" It's fun to watch, obviously, but sometimes it feels as if the action is there just for these performers to show off, and not as much to serve the story that's supposed to be unfolding. What Donnie Yen does in particular is impressive, because he has to make it look like he's fighting blind and look capable, but even that stuff just gets tedious after a while.
I just think this is another case of something good going on for too long. It's a less severe reality of what the Fast and Furious franchise is going through, where the movies have been around for so long that they now no longer resemble what fans loved about them at the start. I don't think 4 leads Wick into that same ridiculous boat as the last few Fast and Furious films have that franchise, but there is a feeling of what has been lost over time and 4 really cemented that for me. When I first heard about the Wick films I was skeptical about watching them because I got the sense it was just a bunch of flashy action set pieces with little story worth caring about. Then I watched the first movie and burst into tears within the first ten minutes, and very quickly respected and felt attached to a character I had only just met on the screen. I was shocked at just how much heart and soul was in that first film, and that was carried through to the next two. I think 4 represents more of what I thought the Wick series was going to be when I first watched them all those years ago, wall to wall, non-stop action for its own sake, and not what it can be at its best, action fare that carries a strong emotional core along with it.
I look forward to seeing what you think, and discussing things I can't even get into right now due to spoilers, but please don't let anyone's opinion influence your own. Go into it as fresh and clear as can be, and see what you think yourself. Before I saw it I disconnected from everything, so I had no clear expectations or assumptions going in other than what I wanted to see from the continuing story that left off in 3.
I'm still very eager to watch it again so I can properly understand why I ranked it as my least favorite when I first saw it; it's not a big knock against the film itself, as I thoroughly enjoyed it, but the series was at its strongest for me in Chapter 2.
I don't know how I rank them on the whole, but if I had to put one together it would either be 1 or 2 at the top, them 3 and 4 after that. They all have things I love in them, and I enjoy all of them, much as I did the Craig Bond films, but at the end of the day there is more for me to chew on in 1 and 2 specifically.
I think 1 is special because it gives us the biggest window into John's mind and soul, which has been neglected over time. It was fascinating to watch his daily life examined, to see him grapple with Helen's death and try to move on while hell came to his doorstep. It was executed perfectly, no pun intended, and it made him a character you understood and wanted to fight/root for. I also think it gave a good introduction to the underworld and made it intriguing to think about without showing or telling too much. It also had great action, but still felt more grounded and raw than what 4 offers, which feels like a superhero film at times (nothing wrong with that, just not my preference).
1 also had probably the best cast of all these films. This doesn't get talked about nearly enough, but Michael Nyqvist as Viggo was just insanely good, and I love that character the more I watch that film over the years. The way he played him brought him to such vibrant life, and he was one of the few characters in the series that never underestimated John. He knew from the moment his son crossed John that he was a dead man, and he never disrespected John by counting him out. While all the other villains in the series coast on arrogance and think they can't be beaten, Viggo knew what he was up against and that makes him stand out, even aside from Nyqvist acting his ass off in spectacular fashion.
Willem Dafoe as Marcus was also a highlight, because we got to see a very quiet but strong respect that those in the underworld have with one another any time he and John interacted. The underworld grew to be so much more cartoonish and bizarre over time, to the point that 3 hits and we have John wandering the desert for...reasons...but in 1 it felt much more in touch with reality far more than what we got served later, which I think aided it in feeling special. It was just cool to see two dangerous assassins working together while hiding their partnership, and it gave us the idea of the kind of bonds that can be formed even in a business as dark and dire as theirs.
2 definitely ramped up the action, but I think it still kept the same kind of great pacing in terms of action and story that 1 had without suffering for it. The action was increased in intensity, but never felt silly, as parts of 3 and 4 do, which is another edge it has. I also just like that John once again is someone you can't help but root for. Through no fault of his own, he is pulled back into the underworld while trying his best to avoid such a fate, and you feel for him because he has no control over anything that is happening to him. He is at his most sympathetic in 1 and 2, and has the least amount of control that makes him endearing and worth fighting for. I also just love the ending, with him not caring about how safe Santino thinks he is and blasting him away, regardless of the rules, and that last few minutes in particular as he runs for his life as all of the underworld finds out the price on his head.
So, I guess, if I had to rank them it would literally be a 1, 2, 3, 4 situation....
1.) John Wick
2.) John Wick: Chapter 2
3.) John Wick: Chapter 3
4.) John Wick: Chapter 4
And this makes sense, because I definitely think the films have weakened progressively as they've gone on, just not to the degree that so many other franchises do. None of the later films are bad by any means, but there is a lot of that special sauce that gets lost over time that I can't help but miss.
1. Chapter 2
2. Chapter 1
3. Chapter 3
4. Chapter 4
However, at this rate, I think I could put Chapter 3 below Chapter 4. Its storytelling and world details are just a bit too hazy and convoluted in some instances, showcasing a journey that clearly wasn't planned in advance.
1's definitely the most unique installment of them all - darker, more brooding, way more personality to the characters, yet grounded and straightforward all at the same time. It had the best supporting cast, some of the best villains (Chidi from Chapter 4 is still my favorite henchman), and it's sadly the only installment where people actually feared the prospect of John Wick, the Baba Yaga, whereas that's all thrown out the window from Chapter 2 onward, despite him now being properly back in the game and having slaughtered almost 100 guys in the first film. It's one of the aspects of the films that I really wish they hadn't abandoned.
And you've hit the nail on the head with Chapter 2: it never feels silly. I feel like Chapter 3 and beyond moved away from traditional fisticuffs and beautiful gunfights in favor for more variety - horse chases, armored samurai, etc. A lot of it is still pretty killer but almost has a "trying too hard" feel in some instances when I want things to be as straightforward yet exciting as possible.
4 doubled down on this idea of "let's come up with crazy sequences and throw together a story after" and it fails to come together as well because of it. There are great story elements there, but they don't get fleshed out like they need to and because of it we actually have even less of a clear idea of how the High Table and the world under the Table truly works. When 3 rolled around and John got told he had to wander the desert till he passed out to bring forth the Elder, I was so disappointingly checked out by a lore that I was very intrigued by in the previous entries. They didn't seem to know exactly what the concrete rules of the criminal underworld were or what the Table was made up of, and just threw together rules based on what seemed visually cool to imagine. It's cool to imagine Wick walking in a desert all suited up, as it's a bizarre thing to take in, but it is just too far flung from the more grounded version of the underworld we got in 1 and 2. Come to think of it, does the High Table even get mentioned in 1, or is it only through Santino's plan to get his sister's seat that we find out that it's even a thing? I can't even remember at this point.
I also agree about Wick's reputation. In 1 people were scared to death of even saying his name, but by the time 3 rolls around he's got a fan club of people that don't even seem to like beating him up because they love him so much. Zero's interactions with him were amusing, sure, but if you knew what John was truly capable of, you wouldn't be acting like he was a celebrity you're asking for an autograph. The assassins should be interested in fighting John to prove their worth, as beating the Baba Yaga would make them legends above and beyond the High Table, but instead Zero and his cadre were almost obnoxiously fawning in a way that didn't make sense. It's just a stark contrast between how Viggo and his brother spoke of John, with both fear and respect because they knew what he could do, to how Zero, his team or even the damn Adjudicator interact with him. You almost want to say, "You guys realize he could murder you in seconds no problem, right? He's John Fricking Wick." And Viggo and Abram spoke of John's reputation BEFORE he spent two films killing every skilled assassin that tried to take the bounty on his head, which should've made everyone around John even more terrified.
I had no idea what the length of 4 was going in, as I instinctually watched no coverage, no trailers and avoided any knowledge of the film as much as possible, but sitting in the theater I was starting to crunch how long I thought I'd been sitting there, which isn't a good indicator that you're watching something that was well paced. By the end I was really feeling it, and without spoiling anything there was a moment where the movie actually felt like it was symbolically mocking me for wondering why it handed concluded yet, which made me about roll my eyes. I experienced the same kind of sensation I have had with just about every Tarantino movie for the last ten years, where I eventually reach a point during the runtime where I'm wondering why this thing is taking so long to get to a meaningful point, why we're seeing such irrelevant and meandering story beats thrown together, and why the filmmakers thought it was worth including some scenes in the first place when other things like character exploration were a bigger priority.
I really don't mean to sound so critical, as I enjoyed a lot of the movie, it's just that when you hear things like "an epic finale to the John Wick story" you kind of expect more. Maybe I'm crazy, I don't know, but I came away underwhelmed, especially when there was every opportunity to truly get epic. I think the movie will actually strike up a lot of discussion around how the kind of story it is trying to tell could be told far more powerfully and with more gravitas, and expose areas that 4 was simply lacking in to take it to that same level that other, more well crafted films have reached recently. I'm not joking with you when I say that I honestly thought the mere skirmish 3 ended with as John, Charon and the Continental forces faced the High Table felt far more stirring and epic than how 4 left me feeling, even though it had me wondering at times if John was literally going to break a kitchen sink off a wall and throw it at an enemy to bludgeon them. And I don't really know what to do about that...
I think 4 puts the fans of the series into two very different categories, because the choices it makes are far more "love it or hate it" than other entries. If you love the Wick series for insane action, this movie is a godsend and you will have nearly three hours of non-stop action glory to partake in. This is why the audience response doesn't surprise me, because a lot of people love going to the theater to see this kind of entertainment and the action is undeniably well performed and staged. If you are an action fan, there is absolutely nothing to complain about and this movie will be like Christmas in spring for you.
The second group, that I and many other underwhelmed folks fall into, is made up of the people that don't just enjoy the movies for the action, but have formed a genuine connection to Wick as a character and have enjoyed seeing the story unfold. It is this group more than the former that are coming away disappointed with the film, I think in part because in 4 the story was sacrificed on the altar of the filmmakers just making as much crazy action as they could and stuffing the film with it. It seemed decided long ago that this was going to be the finale, and they set off with the intention of making it the craziest, most action packed film possible without making the story itself serve this epic conclusion they were setting up. You can have all these crazy stunt actors doing insane stuff for three hours and that's fine and dandy, but if you don't carve out enough time to really fill the story with the emotional weight and gravitas it needs to mean anything, what's the point? We don't get the time to pause and reflect with John, to understand what he's feeling and why he's doing what he's doing. Instead it just throws us into one sequence after another with no breathing room for any kind of reflection or introspection.
Alright, I have a lot of opinions to go over. I’m going to lay this out as worst to best and try to get in as much as I can think of.
4. John Wick: Chapter 3 - Parabellum (2019)
While I still enjoyed this one and consider it a very good action movie, it was an easy choice for last place. Maybe the extra subtitle was a curse? Anyway, for me this one had the series go most off the rails from what I look for. The action is obviously spectacular as always, and my favorite part of the movie is the opening. The ticking clock and intensity were an ideal way to kick things off. The library fight was a fun highlight within, especially with John gingerly putting the book back when he was “finished” with it, hehe. The stuff with the horses was awesome too.
It’s after the long, cold opening the film loses its way a bit for me. The movie has the least of an emotional core out of the lot, which is what connected me to the original so much above other qualities. The desert location was a nice idea, though I still thought it could have maybe been utilized better. It’s a bit hard for me to put into words what makes this weaker than the others, but maybe it’s mostly just a matter of just liking it less than the rest. I can point out though that the “villains” were the least interesting to me of any of the movies, so I guess that’d be a big factor too. Oh, and the ending was a bit too “WTF” for me. It also became just a tad too self-aware for me, like the “good fight” line was a bit of an eye-roller. I guess I can list my reasons x)
This is still a very fun action movie and well worth the time. Oh, and there’s finally a cat instead of just dogs, albeit very briefly haha. So, yeah. I love the opening, the action is fun, but I felt the least emotionally invested and it is one-upped by other entries in certain areas I find.
3. John Wick: Chapter 2 (2017)
Here’s a solid sequel. First of all, I don’t know how popular or unpopular an opinion this is, but Santino is my favorite main bad guy of this series. His good looks, cool demeanor, and cold heartedness show perfectly through Riccardo Scamarcio’s performance. I love how the bastard forces John back into the fold. The scene with his sister is an interesting series highlight as well.
The opening with the brother from the first movie’s main threat was fun - a nice, tidy, action-packed way to re-introduce Wick and what he’s all about. The action in this movie is often some of my favorite in the series, just second to 4 I would say for my personal taste. That one Subway bit… damn.
One character I love a lot is Ares. I’m a big advocate for more inclusion of mute characters (working on writing one myself), so it was an awesome treat. All the side characters really shine in this movie. But of course, Keanu as always is the biggest star. His scream of rage when he’s realizing the circle he’s trapped in at the bank is an amazing, raw character moment.
Yeah, this movie rocks. Honestly I can totally understand why so many rank this entry as their favorite; I know several that do, and respect the choice very much. Hell, in a way I could see this movie being the most rewatchable of the bunch as well. Oh, and perfect cliffhanger ending. The escalation from 1 to 2 and then the setup for 3 is all so impressive. Great film.
2. John Wick: Chapter 4 (2023)
Maybe it’s recency bias, but I had a hell of a good time with Chapter 4. For me, this was the most emotionally poignant one since the first, with lots of subtle moments that tugged at my heartstrings:
The filmmakers naturally have gone out of their way to make the action the very best it has been thus far. It’s a magnificent spectacle; the one bit with
Caine was a flipping amazing character. A perfect foil for John, both in their combat skills and the emotional baggage they carry. I’d love to see more main blind characters in movies; it opens many creative paths! The main bad guy is… well,
I was very satisfied with this movie, honestly. I was worried it would end up being a simple 1 > 2 > 3 > 4 regression for me, but at the very least with confidence I know I liked this one more than 3. Super duper action, super exquisite scenery, and emotional beats that got me misty-eyed. They also had a rather clever ending…
1. John Wick (2014)
Yep. The original’s still the best one for me. The story is the simplest, the action is the simplest, and that’s still overall how it worked best. The opening is perfectly emotional, and you completely understand what drives this man to do what he does. My favorite scene of the entire franchise is when Viggo has John tied to the chair, and John explains how his son “killed” from him all that he had left. So powerful and intense.
Though the action is the least amazing going by technical standards, it’s still the most impactful and cathartic to me given the emotional core is the strongest the series had. You really, REALLY want to see him get the bastards that killed his dog. It hits home especially well if you’re an animal lover; my own preference is cats, but I love dogs too!
The short run time and standalone qualities are extra advantages the first one has. The rewatchability will be excellent. The mysteriousness too of the whole underworld that has yet to be unraveled is very neat. But most important of all: the first one has the Willem Dafoe factor. That’s what makes Spider-Man 1 still my favorite from that franchise ;) everything that guy does is spectacular. But yes, 1: the king.
I have had a blast going through this franchise and intend to rewatch it a lot. Just a great set of films for pure action and intensity. I am very eager for Ballerina and other potential projects down the road :) thanks to anyone who reads all this!
EDIT: Oh yeah, and Fishburne is fantastic in every scene he’s in. Contagious laughter x) Also just has to be added how awesome of characters Winston and Charon are.
I will just say this as of now...
I think I fall victim to what I wished 4 had been, and had too many story expectations for a movie that just wasn't as consistent or invested in that level of storytelling. My dream John Wick 4 epic conclusion would have seen many supporting characters from the fold returning to aid John in his rebellious fight against the High Table. One of the things that left me cold about 4 was that we didn't really see the impact of John's actions in the past. His reputation and his actions didn't pay off, and he was essentially fighting his battles alone, save for instances where the Tracker and Caine were aiding him simply out of circumstantial convenience. I wanted to see assassins that respected John come back into the fold, and serve him with loyalty not out of fear or obligation, but because they wanted to fight alongside him and his cause.
Throughout the course of the films we've seen that the Table got increasingly more strict and daring in its own power and influence, and a lot of people were left in the crosshairs. Cassian lost his beloved ward to a stupid game played by her brother and though Santino's plan was obvious, the Table didn't seem to mind his power play and probably would have been impressed by it, as they have no love or loyalty in their hierarchy. Sofia had to isolate herself from her daughter to protect her, and lived with that pain every day, knowing that if she stepped out of line the Table would exact its revenge on her. And other characters like Winston and Charon as well as other leadership in Continentals the world over are threatened for showing any kind of familial loyalty to anyone, as it appears that the Table views any displays of love as weak and inconvenient to their rules. Assassins that dare to love and be loved face tragedy, while those that are cold and unfeeling rise to the top. In more ways than one, it is John and his ilk that fight to keep love alive, because it, more than the High Table's rules, truly keep humanity from existing with the animals. It was love that saved John and redeemed him, so he believes in its redemptive power for everyone.
It felt fitting then for his journey to end with him facing the High Table not in some overly pompous duel, but side by side with people that shared his distaste for the Table and how it ruled over those underneath it, making their lives harder and poisoned as a result. Far more than anything we got, I'd have loved to see John race into conflict with many of his old rivals by his side, who would see the good intentions he had or would be willing to look past their differences to face a greater threat. Cassian would return, having found a way to recover from the wound that John gave him, willing to look past his grudge because it was the Table and its rules that took Gianna from him, with John just stuck in the middle. He would join John to revolt against the rules and politics that have plagued their world, and made his own life more painful as a result, and also respect John for allowing him to live when he so easily (and more efficiently) could've left him for dead. Sofia would also return to fight, her war dogs in tow, knowing that the Table will only get stronger over time and her fleeting allegiance to John during the events of 3 would be more than enough for them to seek out her daughter and kill her in retaliation for aiding him. She would be motivated to fight not just for her daughter's survival, but for the ability to live safe and clear as a free woman unburdened by their rules and influence. You could even have the Shinobi assassins from the third movie return, out of respect for John and how he was merciful enough to spare their lives as they did his, and Abram Tarasov could donate legions of his own men into the fight all the same, because perhaps the table despised him for letting Wick walk out of his office alive and cause so much unrest, now viewing him as a liability and eye sore that needed taken care of.
All of this would ultimately end with John dying in some sacrificial way, paving a path for everyone that fought wjth and followed him to live a life free from the rules of the table. He would die knowing he had set out to do what he needed, to shake up the underworld and the Table, leaving a power vacuum behind where true change could be made and rules altered or undone entirely. I'd have had him either envision Helen next to him as he died, or better yet, take out a tattered photo of her, smile, and simply say, "I'll be seeing you," before succumbing to his peace with a true chance at reuniting with her in a better place. It would have been a more symbolic and far more fitting way for him to go out that tied everything up, with his last words echoing the many exchanges he had for those he had defeated and brought to death's door as they said their last words to him.
It was wonderful to see great talents in the cinematic fighting world come out to play in 4, don't get me wrong, but I feel that the finale should have been more focused on bringing back strong supporting characters from the past that we already knew instead of relying on setting up all these new characters we had neither seen or heard from before. Shimazu, Caine and John had this deep friendship and brotherhood that was treated as so profound, dramatic and vital, but we never know anything about their pasts or why we should care about their connections, which undercuts every scene in which their pasts are discussed. It would've been more beneficial to me if all the action sequences in the film were shaved off by at least 20-30% to give more room for these kinds of stories to be explored in the longer runtime, and for us to get to know these new characters far better if we were supposed to care about them.
The Tracker sees the same fate as Caine and Shimazu, literally and figuratively being a Nobody for all we are told about him. We know he wants the bounty on John's head, but not what he wants that money for. Is it to get out of the life? To get more influence and power? Who knows, but I wish we did know more, to make him feel more human and engaging. He spends the whole moving flip flopping on if he should or shouldn't just kill John already, and that's really all there is to him where there could've been so much more. There was so much more space to build his connection with John too, because one of my favorite moments of the whole series is in 4 when John has his gun trained on the Tracker in that abandoned building but sees that his dog is in danger of getting killed, and he vulnerably averts his focus on Tracker to make sure his dog doesn't meet the same end as Daisy did. That was the big turning point for the Tracker, I think, seeing John not as an enemy or someone worth killing for the money, and instead as a guy he could respect given that he was willing to risk death to save a dog. I just wish this connection of theirs was given more exploration, or that John even got thanked for his many good deeds in not just saving Tracker's dog, but for always choosing not to take a killing blow on him when he had ample opportunities.
I know many are pleased with how it all went down, but I just see so many areas where the film could've been made even greater, and just see a lot of neglect in the storytelling. I'm glad so many are enjoying it, I just think it fell short of the finale Wick deserved for it to truly feel epic and all encompassing.
I agree with this wholeheartedly. There were parts of the film I felt really got away from John as a character. The first two films in particular felt like we learned about the underworld of assassins through John. The events unfold as we grow with John and the action, while certainly over the top, still feels grounded in the essence of the characters involved. In this film the action comes first - and that's perfectly fine - but it's not necessarily why I fell in love with the franchise. It was the marriage of the action with the characters involved. That's not to say there aren't good character moments in Chapter 4, but as a whole it seemed like the main character was the underworld and John was secondary instead of the other way around. I'm probably not expressing that thought clearly, but it definitely had an effect on how I perceived what should have been the more emotional moments in the film.
Perhaps I'll grow to enjoy it more when it arrives on 4K disc. It looked stunning in the cinema so I eagerly await being able to enjoy it on my home setup.