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Comments
It's quite funny that they both make the same mistake of moving away from a perfectly good location for a finale to a much weaker one. I don't think it helps Spectre that everything is so dark, everyone is wearing black. Whereas the crater was a quite interesting looking design.
SP is much more my thing, with many of its scenes taking place in remote, somewhat desolate areas, with an atmospheric score full of underrated, charming moments and with characters who prefer an introverted lifestyle to socially overstuffed events. I can see why the film is perceived as cold and even dull. Objectively speaking, I won't even disagree. But I myself am always touched by the film. It's still my second favourite Craig Bond film, second only to CR.
Title Track: SP
Title Credits: dont' care
Main Villain: SP
Main Bond Girl: SP
Henchman: SP hands down
Overall Plot: SP
Dialogue: SP
Score: SP
Settings: SP
Action: SP, just compare the 2 car chases
Humor: SP
Cinematography: SP
Benign Bizarre: SP
Suspense: SP
Minor Characters: SP hands down
Glamour: SP
BOND PERFORMANCE: SP
SP 17
Don't care 1
DAD 0
Both films have greatness in them, but Tamahori was never right and ruined alot of areas with his changes and Mendes shot his load with SF and never should have come back.
SP is anaemic and also a chore and long and makes basic errors, but like QoS its thematic ideas sustain a heartbeat of interest that can string you along. It is also a largely professional presentation that isn't quite an embarrassment to be in the same room as. I can't say that for DAD.
As do I. The first hour plus is some of the best in the Brosnan era. 16 years later, im still wrapping my head around how and why it had to go so sci-fi bonkers in the second half. The 14 year old me at the time couldn't get enough of it back in 2002
The real controversial opinion is that I'd rather watch OP than either of them.
In comparison, I hate the foster-brother back story of SP and basically the destruction of the Blofeld character and SPECTRE organisation as a nemesis for decades to come. But other than that, I like the overall mood and feeling of SP far more than the puerile attempt at humour that marked the Brosnan films, especially the last two. Brosnan was best when he made no jokes, because the type of stuff that Rog could pull off came out flat and merely cringe-inducing with Broz. Granted he also had worse material than Rog as well.
Apart from the Bloberhauser issue, SP disappointed me mainly in one regard: It wasn't nearly as good as its predecessor, which I still consider the best (which to me equals most enjoyable) Bond film since FRWL. My only four "9/10" Bond films are FRWL, GF, CR and SF. And overall Craig's films revitalised my love for Bond movies which had severely suffered during the second half of the Brosnan "era". I'm fine with Craig as Bond and his overall record, though it took a bit of a dive in the last installment.
I share this opinion in bold! I don't hate any Bond film and definitely do not think any are outright terrible. Some I like to re-watch more than others.
I can watch Spectre pre-titles again and again, the best part of the film.
DAD is great fun...up until ICE PALACE. Then it's very OTT. But really, not much different than Moonraker or YOLT in terms of realistic 3rd acts :)
Great post. Although, I believe SF to be brilliant yet overrated. I am surprised OHMSS and TB aren't topping your list too.
Thanks for the applause. However, to reply to your final remark: OHMSS would be up there if they hadn't had Lazenby as the main character. I think he couldn't really act his way out of a restroom stall and is easily the worst thing about that movie. TB is brilliant in many ways but the only classic Bond film I consider borderline boring...and even NSNA more entertaining, if that's an indication.
How about Dr No???
SPECTRE is a half-baked film with some quite passable Bondian moments. Mendes had basically used all his creative juices on Skyfall.
So, to end, I think Die Another Day is far worse than SPECTRE
Everybody is entitled to his/her opinion, but I think that QoS has truly the worst titlesong of them all. Not sure who greenlit that piece of cr&p
I fully agree with your general principle and have no particular love for Another Way To Die. Still I think that it works quite nicely in context, and one might wish to say that about Madonna's theme too because it accompanies the torture imagery quite appropriately and also seems to warn the audience about what they may have to endure for the rest of the movie (SCNR).
Well I feel that with SF & SP after the title-song the best of the movies have been shown. With QoS I find the editing of the movie terrible but I always wondered with the title-song if they edited that too as it is totally mod edit.
The difference with DAD I find it a stupid movie after the race with the Aston Martin & Jaguar on the ice, then the movie gradually buckles on its own weight. They could have done a lot more with the patricide bit which I found more original than anything in SP.
u speak my thoughts (& i luv u 4 it)
xxx
If I were to compare which one did worse, DAD or the Mendes twosome, the latter wins the prize with ease.
I second that....Mendes did his damage but at least SP had redeeming qualities to allow the franchise to continue, unlike DAD which was the culmination of destructive elements that have plagued the franchise by being probably the worst film.
I wouldn't go that far, but if I saw Skyfall as an impressionable 5 year old in 2012, it would not have resonated with me like Goldeneye had in the mid 1990's (I forget when I saw it but it was on TV)
DAD, on the other hand, may have went overboard with the sci-fi, ridiculous CGI and the cheesy dialogues, but it was a damn great fun romper that still knew it was selling a James Bond film. The kind of James Bond film that you’ve been loving since GF. DAD did Bond damage as much as MR did back in the day. Look at FYEO if you’re wondering how easily it could’ve fixed it without making radical changes.
"Ipso fatso!" As Bart Simpson would say!
Interestingly, I think that SP is much more critisized by fans than by “normal“ movie consumers, because they dont care about the brothergate stuff, they don't realise that Blofeld is treated complitely wrong in SP. It was much harder for me to defense my love for Bond in 2002 than 2015. My mates laughed at me back then...
Yes, this.
I have said it many times that it's only Bond fans who react in any way to the foster brother angle. I asked my brother in law what he thought of the foster brother story and he looked bemused that I even asked the question.
When DAD was on TV a while back my son kept looking across at me with a half smile of disbelief on his face.
Repeat viewings do not do it justice, because it's too long and doesn't really deserve the 2.5 hour length. CR was a monumental moment, a telling of Fleming's first story, a new actor. SF was the anniversary Bond, another big moment in Bond history.
SP had no reason to be so long. 20 minutes should've been shaved off. As such it does come across as boring.
It is too long and at the SPECTRE meeting in Rome I had the first uncomfortable feeling at the first viewing in cinema...when Blofeld arrives and noone talks and then a guy has to move his microphone...I wanted to shout: Talk, com'on, talk! It is really the first bond movie wheremovie I can understand when people say it is a bit boring. I hope this never happens again in future.
But anyway, this scene is a bad example of SP, but we can at least enjoy the scenery with its light and shadow. There is nothing to like in the CGI scenes of DAD