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Yes, you only have to look at the recent Star Wars films to realise how releasing films too frequently just burns away that big event feel and causes fatigue.
I'd leave it James. I've already sussed out what kind of individual Minion is, and now so is everyone else by the attacks he is making.
$700 million during a pandemic it’s a flop only in a distort reality.
And I'm loving how pleasant you are to your fellow members. Keep up the good work mate. ;)
We don’t know that for sure. Those are estimates made by a fan site. Variety speaks about $800 million to break even. There’s talk about $100 million as the total amount of money they received for product placement.
Point is it’s fair to say Bond won’t break even just with its theatrical gross but things must be put into perspective. It’s not EoN’s fault that COVID happened. In the UK NTTD will outgross SP becoming the third highest grossing film ever. Call it a “flop” it’s just not fair.
Btw, Cary Joji Fukunaga studied in France and speaks a perfect French and yet was not part of any promotion for the movie here as far as I know. Only Laura Seydoux and Dali Bessalah were on the TV for French interviews I think.
That's a valid point @Matt007 and one I can't honestly argue against.
I think they largely achieved this is NTTD up until the decision to kill felix. That first hour is bond platinum
I think stripping things down and going back to basics next is probably the right call, but I hope they don’t go full Roger Moore. Only he could pull that off, and I like Bond having a bit of depth.
It looks like it’ll end up being the lowest grossing Bond movie in the US since LTK which I find sad because it’s definitely better than the majority of the films released since then.
I briefly mentioned to my coworkers I was at the new Bond movie and they were like "oh ok".
If this were 9 years ago and I said "I saw Skyfall"; they'd probably be like "Oh, how is it? I've heard great things."
If NTTD hits the $150 million mark it would outgross domestically (adjusting) LTK, TLD, AVTAK, DN and TMWTGG.
Just for the record OHMSS grossed $170 million in NA.
I don't think it has anything to do with the plot, ending or even Craig.; Just a relative lack of interest amongst younger people. (The 6-year gap partly to blame).
Word of mouth is super super super super important for movies.
If 1 friend tells you to see a movie, you might not. But if 4-5 of your friends are saying "dude, u REALLY gotta check this out", you'll probably see it. It seems like most people like it but not enough to go out and recommend it.
When friends/family ask me what I think of the movie, I tell them if they like Craig's other films, they'll like this one a lot.
But is NTTD a movie I would fervently recommend to the average Joe who has never seen a Bond movie before, or has maybe only seen 1-2 Bond movies like 10 years? Honestly... no.
NTTD is very good for the fans who grew up on Bond. But for average Joe, it may not flush them with the kind of emotions it flushed me with. (I'm a huge Craig fan btw).
Casino and Skyfall are the 2 watercooler films. But the other Craig films don't work as standalones.
Marvel has really turned pop culture on its head. Even Star Wars isn’t the IP behemoth it once was.
https://variety.com/2021/film/global/james-bond-venom-uk-ireland-box-office-1235092424/
No Time To Die: £8.4 million (Total: £68.5 million)
Venom: £6.1 million
Halloween: £1.5 million
Is the US too big a market to ignore? Because while I appreciate that a change in direction is needed after Craig, I really don’t want Bond taking notes from Marvel and all those other superhero films. If they stripped the budget down, would the international numbers be enough to satisfy them?
Just slightly worried myself. I think the blockbuster landscape is getting more and more homogenised in recent years. The reason I still like Bond, and the reason I think it still does so well here in the UK, other than it being ours, is that it’s different. There’s nothing else like it, and it still feels like a real event. I’d hate to lose that by pandering to superhero addicted young Americans, but will it be a choice between doing that and the series dying? (These are genuine questions, I know nowhere near as much about the industry as you lot).
Marvel creates a connected universe. EoN copy and have all the Craig films connected.
Marvel gives Wolverine and Tony Stark daughters for their respective final films. EoN copy and give Bond a daughter for Craig's final film.
They need to have Bond taking inspiration from the books. Just use the source material and adapt so it works. We have untapped Fleming works and his successors to look to. I'd never suggest making a Bond film is remotely easy but it doesn't have to be as difficult as they've made them out to be.
Maybe with a Brosnan-like Bond that can both have the humor/lightness and do the action scenes too. But hopefully with better writing.
His successors? The continuation novels have as much legitimacy as the original film scripts. There’s bits they could nick, but they’re not the source material, and I doubt they’ll ever adapt one properly.
And having the Craig films connected wasn’t copying Marvel. The Craig films started first remember. They were always connected, and a direct sequel isn’t the same thing as a universe. I don’t think those specific plot points were copied either. No Time To Die was written before the last Avengers film came out, and I’d imagine they gave him a daughter because it fit the themes they’d been exploring throughout this run.
If the Craig films were inspired by anything, I think it’s Bourne (QoS) and Nolan’s Batman films (SF). But even there it’s not 1:1, and I think Bond has done a good job of carving out its own path in recent years, and positioning itself as this classy, awards season sort of blockbuster, that comes along every few years. Nothing like Marvel’s workman like films, nor the others trying to ape them (remember when Fast and Furious was about cars?) and the various failed universes that tried to do the same thing, imo.
I don’t think they’ve made it out to be difficult either, and they still seem to be doing a good job from my perspective. As said above, NTTD is on track to be the 3rd highest grossing film ever in the UK. It’s got decent audience scores and strong reviews that praise it for its ambition and how many elements it successfully juggled. It’s a shame it’s not doing that well in the US, but I don’t know why we’re talking about it like its a failure, and I don’t know why fans think just sticking to the books would lead to higher box office receipts. The Craig films have been the most successful Bonds since the 60s, despite deviating from Fleming in significant ways.
"Yu fink we betta, hah?" might have been the beginning of it :)) :))
It's difficult to judge their work because they always either rewrote other people's scripts or had theirs rewritten. Do we even know what elements of the Bond movies were their ideas? I guess DAD is their "purest" script, as I don't believe it had any other writers, but even then you have to take into account that ultimately they can only write what BB and MGW want.
I think DAD had a fair bit of input from Tamahori too. I’d like some fresh blood writing the next one, but it probably helps to keep Purvis and Wade on speed dial, just in case anything needs touching up. They’re hit and miss but are decent enough imo, and I do think they get the character.
What about Waller Bridge having a go as the sole writer? Probably too busy, but I think her additions were easy to spot in NTTD, and they really livened things up a bit. And fhe first season of Killing Eve was by far the best. I thought the narrative did fall apart slightly towards the end of that season, but I think she could handle a tight, small scale sort of plot. And if nothing else the dialogue would be entertaining, and the characters fleshed out.
Anyway, here in Japan, my cinema was HUGE and probably 2/3rd full all 3 times I saw NTTD. The wider Japanese audience polled, when it first came out, showed it the HIGHEST rated of all of Craig's films. There is still a solid Bond audience here. Maybe not as strong as in Roger's day, but I am not concerned.
The film underperforming (?) in the U.S. is something I do not lose sleep over. Plenty of factors figure in to NTTD not being as strong at the box office in America; including the pandemic situation that is in America now.
But Bond films are not in trouble; I do not believe that for a half second. The rest of the world is enjoying the film in the cinema. It is in no way a flop, critically or with the public. It is a controversial film, and that will lose some people but also draw others in who are curious. Reading this thread sounds like the films must change drastically in order to survive. The handwringing over America is pronounced. I simply do not feel that way.
The next Bond movie will be made. Of course he will be British. And male. And there will be some fun, humor, beautiful locations, and we hope a good script. Daniel Craig raised the bar for the main actor - I mean, I want a really fine actor, and I do want some realism and serious moments in future Bond films. But It will be different from Craig's era, I think so ... especially in overall tone. Daniel's Bond was a very popular era of Bond films. Americans will be interested enough in who the next James Bond will be, so Bond 26 will be out of the gates okay. If pandemic under better control and not a 6 year wait for it. Therefore, if a good movie, it should do well at the box office.
I do like to look at how Bond does globally; that is more important to me than just in America (my home country). EON are smart and will pay attention to everything, I'm sure. But I doubt they are losing sleep, gnashing teeth, or getting ulcers over the American box office either. Sure, we wish it would do better box office, but it is not dire.