"I don t drink...wine."- The Dracula Thread

1141517192036

Comments

  • Posts: 16,228
    I love the score for the Coppola DRACULA as well as John Williams' music for Langella.
    Appropriate music is pretty important for a Dracula film, IMO. James Bernard nailed it with his Hammer scores, especially the first one. I also love the beautiful melodic score for BLOOD FOR DRACULA.

  • Posts: 15,247
    SaintMark wrote: »


    Bram Stoker Dracula has easily the most impressive sountrack of them all. with a haunting love theme.


    Main theme copies heavily Horror of Dracula. Coppola could not be original. He had to vampirise every other version of Dracula there was.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited March 2019 Posts: 24,280
    @Ludovico
    Wojciech Kilar's score for the Coppola film carries the composer's signature style all the way through. If anything, he's borrowing from himself rather than from other composers. I furthermore hesitate to think that Coppola forced him to heavily draw from existing material. Though it's hard to ignore the similarities between Kilar's theme and James Bernard's motifs, most of the score is a unique achievement which was rightly celebrated by several organisations and academies upon its release. I certainly wouldn't dismiss it as little more than a shameless copy of other people's works, nor would I endeavour to prove that Coppola turned his film into an unwatchable amalgamate of material he deviously pried away from existing Dracula adaptations.

    I understand you loathe the film, and by all means, that's fine. But I too have read the novel, I too have actively been pursuing and watching its many adaptations, both loose and faithful, for years. I completely agree with you that very few Dracula films match the tone, descriptions and characters of the source novel. That, however, isn't the only criterium for me when I must decide if something works or doesn't. As Stoker's novel is most likely impossible to be done justice via the medium film, I'm perfectly satisfied with scripts taking their share of liberties with the original material. Coppola's Dracula, in that respect, isn't too dissimilar from several of the Bond films which have tried to adapt Fleming's stories but kept only a few bits of those intact while butchering the overall concepts to better fit their ambitions.

    Coppola's film was merely another attempt at pleasing an audience looking for a Dracula film with particular flavours, this one focusing to a large extent on a romantic subtext which most scholars refuse to acknowledge is even present in the book. Whether one agrees with their dismissal of romantic undertones or not, is much less important than the realisation that in the early 90s, this tonal direction for "costume dramas" seemed very much in vogue. Judging by the BO numbers and general ratings, the film had certainly managed to find an audience.

    Perhaps the only thing I will hold against the film, much more so than Keanu's unfortunate casting as a mature Jonathan Harker, is the pretentious move to call the film "Bram Stoker's Dracula" when it absolutely isn't Stoker's vision brought to life. (Lest we forget, Kenneth Branagh would make the same "mistake" soon after the release of this film.) Other than that, though, I'm perfectly happy with the film as it turned out to be, knowing very well how immensely different it is compared to Stoker's novel. I myself refuse to be angry with Coppola's version of the story because of its redundant "window dressing", artistic pretensions and narrative liberties. Rather, I enjoy what's there; I can strangely enjoy the aggressively cosmetic, overstylised production, like walking into a perfumery and being assaulted by an all but nauseating cocktail of stingy, flowery odours. Let's face it, this film is outrageously silly, but amidst all its overproduced chaos and wild jazz, there are many intriguing visuals, a sublime score, some really satisfying acting performances and a fairly waterproof albeit popcorn version of the story to be found. It's not really about whether Stoker should rise from his grave to either praise or criticise the film; it's about providing yet another "remix" of the elements of the original story in a long list of such remixes we've been given since the nineteen twenties. I know of more faithful Dracula adaptations and I know of less faithful Dracula adaptations, but when I'm watching this film, I do so in isolation from whatever else is available. This is merely one adaptation and I can enjoy it on its own terms. I really hope, @Ludovico, that you can appreciate the fact that some of us, who are also perfectly familiar with the novel in all its aspects, do like this movie for what it is, and not for what it isn't. :-)
  • Posts: 15,247
    @DarthDimi I understand people can appreciate the movie, to each his own and so on. But to me, it is just a pretentious mess. Coppola is not even original: he borrows heavily from pretty much every other vampire flick there is. But in the same time he claims to be faithful to the novel. That is IMO unforgivable.

    And I am not a purist: I understand different mediums call for different approaches when one tackles a certain source material. Fleming's novels were often not very cinematographic and liberties had to be taken, things had to be added as much as taken out. My favourite movie, A Clockwork Orange, is fairly faithful to the novel it is based on, but differs in many aspects. But I never felt Kubrick tried to go against the spirit of the source material: he adapted it with respect and even admiration, something Anthony Burgess grudgingly agreed upon. I don't see this in Coppola's work on Dracula. I see self-indulgence, I also see a clear misunderstanding of the source material.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    HOTEL TRANSYLVANIA (2012) directed by Genndy Tartakovsky starts in 1895, when Dracula (Adam Sandler) loses his wife to a mob. He then builds a monsters-only hotel in Transylvania where he raises his daughter, voiced by Selena Gomez.
    maxresdefault.jpg

    HOTEL TRANSYLVANIA 2 came out in 2015. Mel Brooks as Vlad, Dracula s father is funny in this one.


    HOTEL TRANSYLVANIA 3: SUMMER VACATION aka MONSTER VACATION came out last year. I haven t seen it, but it starts out with an encounter with Van Helsing in 1897.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    2013 brought the American-British tv series Dracula starring Jonathan Rhys Meyers. It takes place in London where Drac uses the pseudonym Alexander Grayson, an American entrepreneur. In this series, Dracula and Van Helsing team up to fight The Order of The Dragon. The series was shot in Hungary, and was really lame. It was cancelled after just one season.
    jonathan-rhys-meyers-dracula-review-nbc.jpg?w=1400
  • Posts: 16,228
    2013 brought the American-British tv series Dracula starring Jonathan Rhys Meyers. It takes place in London where Drac uses the pseudonym Alexander Grayson, an American entrepreneur. In this series, Dracula and Van Helsing team up to fight The Order of The Dragon. The series was shot in Hungary, and was really lame. It was cancelled after just one season.
    jonathan-rhys-meyers-dracula-review-nbc.jpg?w=1400

    I tried watching this series and couldn't get through even a full episode. I actually liked the 1990 series better.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    2013 brought the American-British tv series Dracula starring Jonathan Rhys Meyers. It takes place in London where Drac uses the pseudonym Alexander Grayson, an American entrepreneur. In this series, Dracula and Van Helsing team up to fight The Order of The Dragon. The series was shot in Hungary, and was really lame. It was cancelled after just one season.
    jonathan-rhys-meyers-dracula-review-nbc.jpg?w=1400

    I tried watching this series and couldn't get through even a full episode. I actually liked the 1990 series better.

    I gave up on it real quick as well.
  • Posts: 15,247
    And I do think
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    2013 brought the American-British tv series Dracula starring Jonathan Rhys Meyers. It takes place in London where Drac uses the pseudonym Alexander Grayson, an American entrepreneur. In this series, Dracula and Van Helsing team up to fight The Order of The Dragon. The series was shot in Hungary, and was really lame. It was cancelled after just one season.
    jonathan-rhys-meyers-dracula-review-nbc.jpg?w=1400

    I tried watching this series and couldn't get through even a full episode. I actually liked the 1990 series better.

    Ouch. It must have been truly lame.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,280
    Best I can say: the set decoration was good and the acting overall decent. But it was almost as much about Dracula as A Nightmare on Elm Street is about elms and how to grow them.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    DRACULA UNTOLD (2014) directed by Gary Shore and starring Luke Evans as Vlad Tepes, Prince of Wallachia and Transylvania was a huge disappointment. Charles Dance was good though, as the Roman vampire that turns Vlad the Impaler into Dracula, son of the Devil. The film was shot in Northern Ireland.

  • Posts: 16,228
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Best I can say: the set decoration was good and the acting overall decent. But it was almost as much about Dracula as A Nightmare on Elm Street is about elms and how to grow them.

    That's a good way to put it.
    DRACULA UNTOLD (2014) directed by Gary Shore and starring Luke Evans as Vlad Tepes, Prince of Wallachia and Transylvania was a huge disappointment. Charles Dance was good though, as the Roman vampire that turns Vlad the Impaler into Dracula, son of the Devil. The film was shot in Northern Ireland.

    I've only seen parts of this. I skipped it in the cinemas. Looked like a typical CGI extravaganza , though Luke Evans might have made a decent Dracula in a regular adaptation of the novel.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Best I can say: the set decoration was good and the acting overall decent. But it was almost as much about Dracula as A Nightmare on Elm Street is about elms and how to grow them.

    That's a good way to put it.
    DRACULA UNTOLD (2014) directed by Gary Shore and starring Luke Evans as Vlad Tepes, Prince of Wallachia and Transylvania was a huge disappointment. Charles Dance was good though, as the Roman vampire that turns Vlad the Impaler into Dracula, son of the Devil. The film was shot in Northern Ireland.

    I've only seen parts of this. I skipped it in the cinemas. Looked like a typical CGI extravaganza , though Luke Evans might have made a decent Dracula in a regular adaptation of the novel.

    I bought the movie blind, but gave it away after one watch.
  • edited March 2019 Posts: 16,228
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Best I can say: the set decoration was good and the acting overall decent. But it was almost as much about Dracula as A Nightmare on Elm Street is about elms and how to grow them.

    That's a good way to put it.
    DRACULA UNTOLD (2014) directed by Gary Shore and starring Luke Evans as Vlad Tepes, Prince of Wallachia and Transylvania was a huge disappointment. Charles Dance was good though, as the Roman vampire that turns Vlad the Impaler into Dracula, son of the Devil. The film was shot in Northern Ireland.

    I've only seen parts of this. I skipped it in the cinemas. Looked like a typical CGI extravaganza , though Luke Evans might have made a decent Dracula in a regular adaptation of the novel.

    I bought the movie blind, but gave it away after one watch.

    I think we dodged a bullet if that was really intended to be the start of Universal's new Dark Universe. Their Tom Cruise Mummy film wasn't too popular. I heard they then scratched plans for a BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN remake.
    I really don't think the current heads of Universal quite understand what made those classic films so re-watchable for generations. These newer films get the tone, look and feel all wrong, IMO.
    I'd love to see a new Dracula movie done well, but that seems to much to ask for these days.
  • Posts: 15,247
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Best I can say: the set decoration was good and the acting overall decent. But it was almost as much about Dracula as A Nightmare on Elm Street is about elms and how to grow them.

    That's a good way to put it.
    DRACULA UNTOLD (2014) directed by Gary Shore and starring Luke Evans as Vlad Tepes, Prince of Wallachia and Transylvania was a huge disappointment. Charles Dance was good though, as the Roman vampire that turns Vlad the Impaler into Dracula, son of the Devil. The film was shot in Northern Ireland.

    I've only seen parts of this. I skipped it in the cinemas. Looked like a typical CGI extravaganza , though Luke Evans might have made a decent Dracula in a regular adaptation of the novel.

    I bought the movie blind, but gave it away after one watch.

    I think we dodged a bullet if that was really intended to be the start of Universal's new Dark Universe. Their Tom Cruise Mummy film wasn't too popular. I heard they then scratched plans for a BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN remake.
    I really don't think the current heads of Universal quite understand what made those classic films so re-watchable for generations. These newer films get the tone, look and feel all wrong, IMO.
    I'd love to see a new Dracula movie done well, but that seems to much to ask for these days.

    The sad thing is they'd just need to go back to the novel. Gatiss claims that's what he's doing, but I'm skeptical.

    And it's time people just ditch Vlad Tepes from the narrative. Bram Stoker knew nothing about him, not even his real name. He just liked the sound of Dracula and ran with it.
  • Posts: 16,228
    Ludovico wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Best I can say: the set decoration was good and the acting overall decent. But it was almost as much about Dracula as A Nightmare on Elm Street is about elms and how to grow them.

    That's a good way to put it.
    DRACULA UNTOLD (2014) directed by Gary Shore and starring Luke Evans as Vlad Tepes, Prince of Wallachia and Transylvania was a huge disappointment. Charles Dance was good though, as the Roman vampire that turns Vlad the Impaler into Dracula, son of the Devil. The film was shot in Northern Ireland.

    I've only seen parts of this. I skipped it in the cinemas. Looked like a typical CGI extravaganza , though Luke Evans might have made a decent Dracula in a regular adaptation of the novel.

    I bought the movie blind, but gave it away after one watch.

    I think we dodged a bullet if that was really intended to be the start of Universal's new Dark Universe. Their Tom Cruise Mummy film wasn't too popular. I heard they then scratched plans for a BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN remake.
    I really don't think the current heads of Universal quite understand what made those classic films so re-watchable for generations. These newer films get the tone, look and feel all wrong, IMO.
    I'd love to see a new Dracula movie done well, but that seems to much to ask for these days.

    The sad thing is they'd just need to go back to the novel. Gatiss claims that's what he's doing, but I'm skeptical.

    And it's time people just ditch Vlad Tepes from the narrative. Bram Stoker knew nothing about him, not even his real name. He just liked the sound of Dracula and ran with it.

    Exactly.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    PENNY DREADFUL the John Logan/Sam Mendes produced tv show ran for three seasons 2014-2016 and starred several Bond cast: Timothy Dalton, Eva Green, Rory Kinnear and Helen McCrory. It takes place around the turn of the last century, and in the third season Dracula appears, played by Christian Camargo. In this iteration, he is the brother of Lucifer and fell to earth as the first vampire. While in London, he uses the alias of Dr Alexander Sweet, a zoologist.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    MONSTER HIGH is an animated Youtube series which I believe is made for the sole purpose of selling toys? First webisode came out in 2016. It features the children of famous monsters, including Draculaura, daughter of Dracula.

  • Posts: 15,247
    Any graphic novel that is actually a faithful adaptation?
  • Posts: 16,228
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Any graphic novel that is actually a faithful adaptation?

    I remember one or two comic adaptations when I was a kid being quite true to the novel.
    Same with FRANKENSTEIN.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    CASTLEVANIA is an animated tv series based on older video games that features Vlad Tepes Dracula as a main adversary. Here he is after revenge after his wife Lisa was burned at the stake, falsely accused of witchcraft in the 15th century. He is voiced by Graham McTavish.
    carmilla-and-hector-in-castlevania-season-2.jpeg?rect=0%2C61%2C1920%2C958&auto=format%2Ccompress&dpr=2&w=650
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    MONSTER FAMILY (2017) directed by Holger Tappe is an animated film based on the book HAPPY FAMILY. In this one Dracula is voiced by Jason Isaacs. Here Renfield is Dracula s butler and married to Baba Yaga.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    oct11_stoker1b.jpg

    BRAM (Abraham) STOKER was born in Dublin 8th November 1847 and passed away in London 20th April 1912. He married his wife Florence in 1878 and they had one son, Irving.

    The original typescript of Dracula was 541 pages, and was thought lost until found in Pennsylvania in the 80s. It showed that the original intended title was THE UN-DEAD.

    Stoker s great-grand nephew Dacre Stoker wrote a sequel to DRACULA, called DRACULA, THE UN-DEAD in 2009.
  • Posts: 15,247
    And the original name for Dracula was Count Wampyr. He changed it when he read the name Dracula in a footnote in a history book.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Stoker s twelve novels:

    THE PRIMROSE PATH (1875)
    THE SNAKE S PASS (1890)
    THE WATTER S MOU (1895)
    THE SHOULDER OF SHASTA (1895)
    DRACULA (1897)
    MISS BETTY (1898)
    THE MYSTERY OF THE SEA (1902)
    THE JEWEL OF SEVEN STARS (1903)
    THE MAN (THE GATES OF LIFE) (1905)
    LADY ATHLYNE (1908)
    THE LADY OF THE SHROUD (1909)
    THE LAIR OF THE WHITE WORM (THE GARDEN OF EVIL) (1911)

    First edition cover of Dracula:
    1446488672407
  • Posts: 2,922
    I wonder if Stoker was peeved that Dracula so completely overshadowed his 11 other novels. A bit like Joseph Heller and Catch 22.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Revelator wrote: »
    I wonder if Stoker was peeved that Dracula so completely overshadowed his 11 other novels. A bit like Joseph Heller and Catch 22.

    It is the only one I have read, so cannot comment on the quality of his other work, but any author who gets one monumental hit like that is lucky.
  • Posts: 15,247
    Revelator wrote: »
    I wonder if Stoker was peeved that Dracula so completely overshadowed his 11 other novels. A bit like Joseph Heller and Catch 22.

    In his interview of Winston Churchill he seems to consider Dracula and his whole literary career as a relatively minor aspect of his life.

    Let us not forget that Dracula was not in Stoker’s lifetime the phenomenon it became with the cinema. It was a moderately successful horror novel from a good but minor, part-time writer.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    It was still his most successful book, only The Jewel of Seven Stars and The Lair of the White Worm reached a somewhat big success of his oeuvre.
Sign In or Register to comment.