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NTTD Gun Barrel Sequence OOO O O O

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  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    I think Cary will have the iris opening on Norway.
  • AKillToAViewAKillToAView
    Posts: 440
    Wow, lot of people projecting onto Mendes here. I don't even really like SF or SP that much, but it's a bit much to suggest that he "hated" the Gunbarrel or the fans or anything.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    I hope the iris doesn’t open, rather the dots get smaller and it hard cuts to the scene like FRWL and GF. ;)
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited February 2020 Posts: 8,179
    Thing about gun barrels for me is that it doesn’t have to be one or the other. I think Mendes just wanted to give it a different spin in SP, as opposed to the fan theory of him doing it to spite fans, which just sounds more like a hang up fans have. I’m all for toying with the gun barrel and giving it new variations. It doesn’t have to strictly follow the exact same pattern to the very frame of previous film. Sometimes it’s done interestingly like in CR, sometimes it’s eye rolling like in DAD. Binder used to be experimental with it until he stuck with a specific template with Moore and never did anything interesting or different (besides FYEO hard cutting to a whole open shot)
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,337
    It’ll be funny to read all of the theories about how Fukunaga hates Bond films because he filmed M’s office from the wrong side or whatever in a few years’ time :)
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    mtm wrote: »
    It’ll be funny to read all of the theories about how Fukunaga hates Bond films because he filmed M’s office from the wrong side or whatever in a few years’ time :)

    *Bond director does something different from predecessors*

    Fans: “He obviously hates Bond. He needs to understand that Bond has traditions!”
  • PropertyOfALadyPropertyOfALady Colders Federation CEO
    Posts: 3,675
    mtm wrote: »
    It’ll be funny to read all of the theories about how Fukunaga hates Bond films because he filmed M’s office from the wrong side or whatever in a few years’ time :)

    Given what I've done with M's office, I will notice. :D
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 2020 Posts: 16,337
    PropertyOfALady wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    It’ll be funny to read all of the theories about how Fukunaga hates Bond films because he filmed M’s office from the wrong side or whatever in a few years’ time :)

    Given what I've done with M's office, I will notice. :D

    Some sort of dirty protest while M’s out..?
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,997
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    Guys I think with Fukunaga's recent video blog showing his clear love for the gunbarrel, I think it's all but confirmed to be at the beginning of the film. :-bd

    Yeah, when i heard that my anticipation for the film just went up a notch.

    The guy understands how important it is! You listening Mendes???!!!

    Haha! He did put it back for SP, but there was no excuse for leaving it off SF, really hate that opening with the loud music cue!

    No, with Spectre Mendes said, "Fine, *spit* have your precious gunbarrel back where it belongs, but it will have a pretentious little saying after it."

    I think it was pretty obvious he wasn't fond of the gunbarrel. He certainly didn't 'hate' Bond, but certainly wanted his own stamp on things, which is fair enough given the clout he must have.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 2020 Posts: 16,337
    He put it in both of his films, which is more than Campbell did! And he’s the only Craig director to put it in the right place, so it seems odd to extrapolate that he was the one who wasn’t fond of it...
  • FourDotFourDot
    Posts: 250
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    Guys I think with Fukunaga's recent video blog showing his clear love for the gunbarrel, I think it's all but confirmed to be at the beginning of the film. :-bd

    Yeah, when i heard that my anticipation for the film just went up a notch.

    The guy understands how important it is! You listening Mendes???!!!

    Haha! He did put it back for SP, but there was no excuse for leaving it off SF, really hate that opening with the loud music cue!

    No, with Spectre Mendes said, "Fine, *spit* have your precious gunbarrel back where it belongs, but it will have a pretentious little saying after it."

    I think it was pretty obvious he wasn't fond of the gunbarrel. He certainly didn't 'hate' Bond, but certainly wanted his own stamp on things, which is fair enough given the clout he must have.

    Actually he talked quite a lot about how originally it was at the start but didn't flow either straight from the gunbarrel to the opening shot or with a bumper establisting shot of Istanbul (which would have killed the reveal when Bond leaves the building).

    He ultimately opted for keeping the opening shot which thematically resonates with the last shot. It's a better film for it just with that choice.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,997
    mtm wrote: »
    He put it in both of his films, which is more than Campbell did! And he’s the only Craig director to put it in the right place, so it seems odd to extrapolate that he was the one who wasn’t fond of it...

    Campbell directed two Bond films and both had gunbarrel's. CR's albeit was changed within the context of the film. (Which i thought worked brilliantly)

    I can only 'extrapolate' my feeling that Mendes wasn't fond of them in that SF didn't have one at the start and SP seemed like an afterthought, especially with the meaningless quote straight after.

    Just the way it looks to me.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    May be some overthinking on the fan theory that he didn’t like putting in the gun barrel. I think he always intended to put it back in front, he just wanted to put in his own stamp with the title card.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 2020 Posts: 16,337
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    He put it in both of his films, which is more than Campbell did! And he’s the only Craig director to put it in the right place, so it seems odd to extrapolate that he was the one who wasn’t fond of it...

    Campbell directed two Bond films and both had gunbarrel's. CR's albeit was changed within the context of the film. (Which i thought worked brilliantly)

    But not in the right place and not a conventional one by any means. So if we're saying that Mendes has something against it for including two much more conventional gunbarrels (and shooting them afresh both times!) then by the same logic Campbell certainly did. It's double standards, really.
    Personally I don't think either of them had anything against it, indeed Mendes actually said:

    "I remember when I was a kid thinking that it was almost the best bit. Everything is possible in that moment, it's like Christmas Eve!"

    But, y'know: we believe everything dear Cary says, but clearly Mendes was constantly lying through his teeth, for some reason.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    I don't think it's too much of a big deal playing with the Gunbarrel, as long as it's done with a stylish & meaningful approach like CR's. At least if tradition must be broken, let the innovation excite fans. That's why I still think Campbell's CR did it properly. Arnold also knew he wouldn't be using the Bond theme a lot & look at the song he created to stand in for the Bond theme. I think that's how it's done, if you want to break tradition, simply create a better idea. Fans will only notice tradition is broken when the innovation isn't good enough.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,337
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I don't think it's too much of a big deal playing with the Gunbarrel, as long as it's done with a stylish & meaningful approach like CR's. At least if tradition must be broken, let the innovation excite fans. That's why I still think Campbell's CR did it properly. Arnold also knew he wouldn't be using the Bond theme a lot & look at the song he created to stand in for the Bond theme. I think that's how it's done, if you want to break tradition, simply create a better idea. Fans will only notice tradition is broken when the innovation isn't good enough.

    Yeah I think that's fair. They shouldn't really feel anything is sacred if we want things to stay fresh, but equally that doesn't mean that every new innovation is going to land perfectly.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    I’ll take how SF opens without a gun barrel over DAD’s CGI bullet nonsense any day.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I don't think it's too much of a big deal playing with the Gunbarrel, as long as it's done with a stylish & meaningful approach like CR's. At least if tradition must be broken, let the innovation excite fans. That's why I still think Campbell's CR did it properly. Arnold also knew he wouldn't be using the Bond theme a lot & look at the song he created to stand in for the Bond theme. I think that's how it's done, if you want to break tradition, simply create a better idea. Fans will only notice tradition is broken when the innovation isn't good enough.

    Yeah I think that's fair. They shouldn't really feel anything is sacred if we want things to stay fresh, but equally that doesn't mean that every new innovation is going to land perfectly.

    Yeah, true....but the thing is, as Bond fans....perfection seems to be our burden. Although, I won't be surprised if there's another innovation in NTTD's Gunbarrel...no matter where it's placed in the film.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,337
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I don't think it's too much of a big deal playing with the Gunbarrel, as long as it's done with a stylish & meaningful approach like CR's. At least if tradition must be broken, let the innovation excite fans. That's why I still think Campbell's CR did it properly. Arnold also knew he wouldn't be using the Bond theme a lot & look at the song he created to stand in for the Bond theme. I think that's how it's done, if you want to break tradition, simply create a better idea. Fans will only notice tradition is broken when the innovation isn't good enough.

    Yeah I think that's fair. They shouldn't really feel anything is sacred if we want things to stay fresh, but equally that doesn't mean that every new innovation is going to land perfectly.

    Yeah, true....but the thing is, as Bond fans....perfection seems to be our burden. Although, I won't be surprised if there's another innovation in NTTD's Gunbarrel...no matter where it's placed in the film.

    Yeah I'll be surprised if the image of the gunbarrel itself doesn't get a revamp in some form.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    We can at least be certain that we’ll see new footage of Craig in the gun barrel, as it was confirmed.

    If there’s one innovation I like from Craig’s gun barrels it’s that he always shot a brand new walk and stance, rather than just reusing the same old footage like previous actors did.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I don't think it's too much of a big deal playing with the Gunbarrel, as long as it's done with a stylish & meaningful approach like CR's. At least if tradition must be broken, let the innovation excite fans. That's why I still think Campbell's CR did it properly. Arnold also knew he wouldn't be using the Bond theme a lot & look at the song he created to stand in for the Bond theme. I think that's how it's done, if you want to break tradition, simply create a better idea. Fans will only notice tradition is broken when the innovation isn't good enough.

    Yeah I think that's fair. They shouldn't really feel anything is sacred if we want things to stay fresh, but equally that doesn't mean that every new innovation is going to land perfectly.

    Yeah, true....but the thing is, as Bond fans....perfection seems to be our burden. Although, I won't be surprised if there's another innovation in NTTD's Gunbarrel...no matter where it's placed in the film.

    Yeah I'll be surprised if the image of the gunbarrel itself doesn't get a revamp in some form.

    Yeah, me too
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    We can at least be certain that we’ll see new footage of Craig in the gun barrel, as it was confirmed.

    If there’s one innovation I like from Craig’s gun barrels it’s that he always shot a brand new walk and stance, rather than just reusing the same old footage like previous actors did.

    Yeah, I really like that about Craig's Era...although, in the Gunbarrel of the previous Bonds, even if it was the same posturing. The lighting & Colouring did differ a bit...but I like this New Tradition of shooting a new Gunbarrel for each film....previously one could tell a Bond film by it's Gunbarrel Music alone, but now with the design of new Gunbarrels, one immediately knows what film it is....at least even if the old Gunbarrels were somewhat repetitive, the music changed as well.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    I do wish the classic Binder design had remained in the first three Craig films. I was open to updating the look, but once SP came along it really hammered how iconic that Binder design was.

    I’m typically all for not adhering to tradition for the sake of tradition, but as far as gun barrel design goes the original Binder design is hard to beat.
  • TopGearJB007TopGearJB007
    edited February 2020 Posts: 624
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I do wish the classic Binder design had remained in the first three Craig films. I was open to updating the look, but once SP came along it really hammered how iconic that Binder design was.

    I’m typically all for not adhering to tradition for the sake of tradition, but as far as gun barrel design goes the original Binder design is hard to beat.

    I love the Casino Royale design. It would be so cool to use it in an otherwise 100% traditional gunbarrel. To me you can mess with the design all you want (like CR, QoS, or SF) but if it's not at the beginning it's no bueno. I don't even mind it fading to black like SF or SP.

    I also don't think at all that Mendes hates the gunbarrel. I just don't think he understands that fans don't want it anywhere else but the beginning (OK, maybe by SP he did) and without some saying following it. SP should have faded into the skull thing. I would have happily forgone the opening shot of Skyfall to have it back at the beginning. As long as we're at it, I'll throw Forster into the mix too. There was ZERO excuse for it to not be at the beginning of QoS considering thematically "Bond was Bond" when CR ended.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    Yeah, I think Forster wanted to end CR's story, by putting the Gunbarrel at the end of QoS.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited February 2020 Posts: 8,179
    I get the intent of the gb in QOS, but given how starkly different the film is in so many ways from CR I was never convinced of the film working as a direct continuation. Comments like “QOS works if you watched it as an epilogue to CR” never convinced me.
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,641
    For how poor the gunbarrel was in Quantum, I wish they would have used it at the end of the rope fight, when Bond turns and fires like Casino. Although that would have made no sense within the story
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,337
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I do wish the classic Binder design had remained in the first three Craig films. I was open to updating the look, but once SP came along it really hammered how iconic that Binder design was.

    I’m typically all for not adhering to tradition for the sake of tradition, but as far as gun barrel design goes the original Binder design is hard to beat.
    As long as we're at it, I'll throw Forster into the mix too. There was ZERO excuse for it to not be at the beginning of QoS considering thematically "Bond was Bond" when CR ended.

    They just basically didn't have any ideas for QoS and had to repeat the beats of CR: he couldn't say 'Bond James Bond' at the end again so they used the gunbarrel instead as the 'he's really James Bond now!' moment.
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,641
    mtm wrote: »
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I do wish the classic Binder design had remained in the first three Craig films. I was open to updating the look, but once SP came along it really hammered how iconic that Binder design was.

    I’m typically all for not adhering to tradition for the sake of tradition, but as far as gun barrel design goes the original Binder design is hard to beat.
    As long as we're at it, I'll throw Forster into the mix too. There was ZERO excuse for it to not be at the beginning of QoS considering thematically "Bond was Bond" when CR ended.

    They just basically didn't have any ideas for QoS and had to repeat the beats of CR: he couldn't say 'Bond James Bond' at the end again so they used the gunbarrel instead as the 'he's really James Bond now!' moment.

    That's the feeling I got when I first saw the film
  • TopGearJB007TopGearJB007
    Posts: 624
    mtm wrote: »
    TopGearJB007 wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I do wish the classic Binder design had remained in the first three Craig films. I was open to updating the look, but once SP came along it really hammered how iconic that Binder design was.

    I’m typically all for not adhering to tradition for the sake of tradition, but as far as gun barrel design goes the original Binder design is hard to beat.
    As long as we're at it, I'll throw Forster into the mix too. There was ZERO excuse for it to not be at the beginning of QoS considering thematically "Bond was Bond" when CR ended.

    They just basically didn't have any ideas for QoS and had to repeat the beats of CR: he couldn't say 'Bond James Bond' at the end again so they used the gunbarrel instead as the 'he's really James Bond now!' moment.

    Like OHMSS before it, the Bond theme kinda ruined the somber mood at the end of QoS.
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