NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - Discuss Hans Zimmer's Score

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  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    I didn’t even like FALLOUT, and am disappointed that it’s become a McQuirrie thing instead of the rotating door of interesting and distinctive directors like with the first five films. And now it seems to have a storyline with that boring Lane villain as the Blofeld of the series. There’s fans that don’t like how the Craig films have become less standalone, while I feel that sentiment with M:I. I loved Rebecca Ferguson in RN and felt the platonic relationship was more interesting there than her in FALLOUT being arbitrarily turned into Tom Cruise’s love interest.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,195
    I didn’t even like FALLOUT, and am disappointed that it’s become a McQuirrie thing instead of the rotating door of interesting and distinctive directors like with the first five films. And now it seems to have a storyline with that boring Lane villain as the Blofeld of the series. There’s fans that don’t like how the Craig films have become less standalone, while I feel that sentiment with M:I. I loved Rebecca Ferguson in RN and felt the platonic relationship was more interesting there than her in FALLOUT being arbitrarily turned into Tom Cruise’s love interest.

    Well that’s good, but what about the score?

  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    I didn't like Fallout at all (the bike chase is the only scene I liked in the movie, but then again I don't like Cruise or the Mission: Impossible movies either) and I must say a Balfe score never managed to impress me. They all sound fairly generic.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,160
    I favour Giaccino's MI scores above the rest, although Kramer and Balfe produced decent enough efforts for sure.

    Out of these three, I'd pick Giaccino for at least one Bond score. But hey, Romer may surprise us yet.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,205
    100% total John Barry. This guy should be scoring the next Bond soundtrack, and proves you can still use it effectively in todays modern cinema, rather than the ambient atmos crap examples we've heard so far from Romer.

    Yes, yet another perfect example where the producers have something so obvious staring them in the face (I mean they already got the DOP from FIRST MAN, why not the composer??) but instead they choose to go with something different. Then they wonder why their franchise is such a mixed bag and why folks are more excited about the MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE franchise these days. That’s because McQuarrie and his team understands what makes that franchise work and fully embrace it, whereas Babs & Mikey are afraid or unwilling to embrace the trademark elements of their franchise and instead would rather go “avant-garde” or “different”. Trying to chase awards these days more than actually just giving us a good ol’ Bond adventure!!!! Give me the Bond sound, give me the Bond look and feel, and stop it with the experimentations.

    Part of the reason why Mission: Impossible is so popular is because no one film is like the one before it, aside from the stunts. They've had five directors and as many composers across the six films, and it wasn't exactly unpopular before McQuarrie directed Rogue Nation. The only parts of the formula that have remained consistent is the teamwork and the stunts.

    I wasn't keen on Balfe's score but it has grown on me considerably, and I really enjoy some of the action cues. They're good fun. I still prefer Kraemer and Giacchino's efforts, though.

    But anyway, I'm still very intrigued by the idea of a Romer Bond score.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    talos7 wrote: »
    I didn’t even like FALLOUT, and am disappointed that it’s become a McQuirrie thing instead of the rotating door of interesting and distinctive directors like with the first five films. And now it seems to have a storyline with that boring Lane villain as the Blofeld of the series. There’s fans that don’t like how the Craig films have become less standalone, while I feel that sentiment with M:I. I loved Rebecca Ferguson in RN and felt the platonic relationship was more interesting there than her in FALLOUT being arbitrarily turned into Tom Cruise’s love interest.

    Well that’s good, but what about the score?

    About as unremarkable as the film.
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    edited August 2019 Posts: 1,165
    They're similar enough that I feel I can make this comparison, but MI:RN seemed to have all the good bits from SP and Fallout had everything that didn't work.
  • ResurrectionResurrection Kolkata, India
    Posts: 2,541
    Minion wrote: »
    They're similar enough that I feel I can make this comparison, but MI:RN seem to have all the good bits from SP and Fallout had everything that didn't work.

    Fallout was a mess but yeah I liked RN a lot . On of the reason was Ilsa's character.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited August 2019 Posts: 8,179
    I wish the opera sequence in QOS was as good as what was delivered on RN. I remember being excited about hearing they would go for a sequence like that reminiscent of Hitchcock’s THE MAN WHO KNEW TOO MUCH and it was severely underwhelming. RN was more overtly influenced by it did sure, but it was a well done riff.
  • Posts: 11,425
    Babs and Mikey are beholden to their star and hence also to his pick of director and thus the director's choice of composer.

    That's why we got two dreary Newman scores.
  • Posts: 4,044
    I wish the opera sequence in QOS was as good as what was delivered on RN. I remember being excited about hearing they would go for a sequence like that reminiscent of Hitchcock’s THE MAN WHO KNEW TOO MUCH and it was severely underwhelming. RN was more overtly influenced by it did sure, but it was a well done riff.

    If you want to see a scene that really mimics Hitchcock’s TMWKTM, check out The Bedroom Window.
  • HildebrandRarityHildebrandRarity Centre international d'assistance aux personnes déplacées, Paris, France
    edited August 2019 Posts: 480
    Come on guys, we don't have a single clue (and cue) about what Romer's score will sound like. The fact that he was announced relatively late in the production cycle hints that he had time to write themes and even record a few demos before he was signed on.
    They wouldn't give him a blank check, even with Fukunaga's full support, as the guy hadn't worked so far on blockbusters. The situation is completely different from Skyfall, where Thomas Newman had dozens of major projects under his belt. Even if he came up with an uncharacteristic (for Bond) and bland score, it wouldn't be jarring the way the Goldeneye soundtrack was a misfire to some.

    And I take it as a positive that the guy hasn't tried to make a John Barry-esque score for films that weren't fit to a John Barry score. I won't judge him before I hear what he's come up with.
  • Come on guys, we don't have a single clue (and cue) about what Romer's score will sound like. The fact that he was announced relatively late in the production cycle hints that he had time to write themes and even record a few demos before he was signed on.
    They wouldn't give him a blank check, even with Fukunaga's full support, as the guy hadn't worked so far on blockbusters. The situation is completely different from Skyfall, where Thomas Newman had dozens of major projects under his belt. Even if he came up with an uncharacteristic (for Bond) and bland score, it wouldn't be jarring the way the Goldeneye soundtrack was a misfire to some.

    And I take it as a positive that the guy hasn't tried to make a John Barry-esque score for films that weren't fit to a John Barry score. I won't judge him before I hear what he's come up with.
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Come on guys, we don't have a single clue (and cue) about what Romer's score will sound like. The fact that he was announced relatively late in the production cycle hints that he had time to write themes and even record a few demos before he was signed on.
    They wouldn't give him a blank check, even with Fukunaga's full support, as the guy hadn't worked so far on blockbusters. The situation is completely different from Skyfall, where Thomas Newman had dozens of major projects under his belt. Even if he came up with an uncharacteristic (for Bond) and bland score, it wouldn't be jarring the way the Goldeneye soundtrack was a misfire to some.

    And I take it as a positive that the guy hasn't tried to make a John Barry-esque score for films that weren't fit to a John Barry score. I won't judge him before I hear what he's come up with.

    To be fair his past works are a small clue about what he might do. Not saying it proves or means anything, just saying that we do have a clue.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,195
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    You had me, but lost me with the GE reference; Barry’s touch for Pierce’s debut would have been epic.
  • Posts: 4,044
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    I always thought Barry was pretty hot on doing space themes.
  • Posts: 3,327
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    Barry would have turned GE into an absolute classic if he had done the soundtrack. Even I may have warmed more to that movie then.
  • Posts: 4,044
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,160
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    Barry would have turned GE into an absolute classic if he had done the soundtrack. Even I may have warmed more to that movie then.

    I cannot see a Barry score fit that well for a film that was a clear update in terms of tone and setting from the old days. Barry had written THE SPECIALIST right before GE came out. I love that score; it's hauntingly beautiful, jazzy and sensual. However, it lacked the "punch" a Bond film in '95 needed. Serra's score may be painful to many as a standalone listening experience, but the darker electronics somehow worked very well in this story of computer centres controlling forgotten Cold War weapons. I doubt any of Barry's scores would have given GE the right tone. Case in point, a few years later, Barry composed MERCURY RISING, once again a beautiful score but in its attempts to convey tension or action, "unsatisfying" for the '90s. I'm not saying Barry had lost it; I'm saying the Bonds were moving away from Barry's colourfulness to something more befitting the digital age, despite Arnold's obvious worshipping at Barry's altar. For the record, I'm a huge Barry fan, but I'm also a Debussy fan and I know that you can always score with Debussy during a lovely candlelight dinner, but not when playing Call Of Duty Modern Warfare. Serra didn't write a Bond score, but he brought the right sound for GE. Barry would have written a killer Bond score, but possibly one less serving of GE specifically.

    As for Romer, I believe we may yet be surprised. He must know that he's getting involved with something far bigger than his own resume. Unlike Newman, he hasn't yet been nominated for an Oscar multiple times. He has yet to establish himself in the more mainstream scene. I doubt this is the project for him to drop an elephant in the room and pretend like there's no such thing as "Bond music".
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    talos7 wrote: »
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    You had me, but lost me with the GE reference; Barry’s touch for Pierce’s debut would have been epic.

    I’m sure it would have been fine, but I like what Serra brought to the film and it’s part of what makes GE positively distinctive in Brosnan’s run. Serra may not have played with the “Bond sound”, but I couldn’t give a shit because I want something to work for the individual film rather than work for the franchise. It’s why I appreciate a film like CR willing to drop “Bond staples” like Q and Moneypenny. It’s why I watch DAF and view it on its own merits rather than damn it for not being a sequel to OHMSS.
    vzok wrote: »
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    I always thought Barry was pretty hot on doing space themes.

    His sci-fi attempts aren’t really my favorite. He didn’t have a knack for the genre the way John Williams and Jerry Goldsmith had when he tried scoring for THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH. Film scores aren’t a one size fits all deal. They should serve the film rather than follow conventions laid out by past films.
  • talos7 wrote: »
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    You had me, but lost me with the GE reference; Barry’s touch for Pierce’s debut would have been epic.

    I’m sure it would have been fine, but I like what Serra brought to the film and it’s part of what makes GE positively distinctive in Brosnan’s run. Serra may not have played with the “Bond sound”, but I couldn’t give a shit because I want something to work for the individual film rather than work for the franchise. It’s why I appreciate a film like CR willing to drop “Bond staples” like Q and Moneypenny. It’s why I watch DAF and view it on its own merits rather than damn it for not being a sequel to OHMSS.
    vzok wrote: »
    EVERYTHING is a fit for a John Barry score!! Reading the cereal box is a fit for a Barry score! Like classical music that never ages you can play it wherever and whenever.

    As much as I love John Barry’s works, him scoring a movie like BLADE RUNNER would be ill suiting. As much as I would have liked to hear Barry score GE, Serra’s work fits like a glove with the tone of that one.

    I always thought Barry was pretty hot on doing space themes.

    His sci-fi attempts aren’t really my favorite. He didn’t have a knack for the genre the way John Williams and Jerry Goldsmith had when he tried scoring for THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH. Film scores aren’t a one size fits all deal. They should serve the film rather than follow conventions laid out by past films.
    Are you saying THE BLACK HOLE isn’t a masterpiece of a score!????? Barry gave us 2 marvelous space themes in 1979 - THE BLACK HOLE and MOONRAKER. Some of the best pieces of space music ever composed!!! Williams and Goldsmith, eat your hearts out!!!

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,160
    @ringfire211
    I'm sure @MakeshiftPython wasn't disparaging Barry's '79 scores, which, incidentally, you correctly labelled marvellous. I too am a huge fan of THE BLACK HOLE. My friend the Python does, however, make a fair point, in my opinion, that surely we can all agree that the operatic might of Williams' STAR WARS and the atmospheric beauty of Goldsmith's ALIEN are quite different from Barry's work on THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH. I, for one, love all of these scores, but I think it's only fair to concede that THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH, while joyful and pleasant, are lightweight musical entertainment compared to, for example, STAR WARS.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    @ringfire211
    I'm sure @MakeshiftPython wasn't disparaging Barry's '79 scores, which, incidentally, you correctly labelled marvellous. I too am a huge fan of THE BLACK HOLE. My friend the Python does, however, make a fair point, in my opinion, that surely we can all agree that the operatic might of Williams' STAR WARS and the atmospheric beauty of Goldsmith's ALIEN are quite different from Barry's work on THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH. I, for one, love all of these scores, but I think it's only fair to concede that THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH, while joyful and pleasant, are lightweight musical entertainment compared to, for example, STAR WARS.

    Pretty much. Barry gave it a fair shot at the swashbuckling space adventures, but I think his real strength lied more in movies like SOMEWHERE IN TIMR, OUT OF AFRICA and DANCES WITH WOLVES that heavily benefited from scores that really delved into slow romantic strings more than the space opera films did from his work. Where John Williams is a fast exciting rollercoaster ride, John Barry is a pleasant row boat on the pond. That’s why he noticeably did less adventure films in the latter part of his career.
  • edited August 2019 Posts: 653
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    @ringfire211
    I'm sure @MakeshiftPython wasn't disparaging Barry's '79 scores, which, incidentally, you correctly labelled marvellous. I too am a huge fan of THE BLACK HOLE. My friend the Python does, however, make a fair point, in my opinion, that surely we can all agree that the operatic might of Williams' STAR WARS and the atmospheric beauty of Goldsmith's ALIEN are quite different from Barry's work on THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH. I, for one, love all of these scores, but I think it's only fair to concede that THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH, while joyful and pleasant, are lightweight musical entertainment compared to, for example, STAR WARS.
    See? I completely disagree with this!! For me the MOONRAKER score is head and shoulders above any of the STAR WARS scores! There is absolutely nothing in those scores that comes even close to the sublime masterpieces that are “Flight into Space” or “Space Laser Battle” or “Bond Lured to Pyramids” or “Bond Arrives in Rio/Boat Chase”. I never understood folks who claim STAR WARS is the greatest film score of all-time. Can’t hold a candle to BEN-HUR by Miklos Rozsa or any of the Spaghetti Westerns by Morricone!! Those I would argue are the best scores of all time, along with a lot of Barry’s works. Even in Williams’ oeuvre his INDY scores are superior to his STAR WARS works. So is his JURASSIC PARK score!

    Goldsmith’s ALIEN is indeed great but it’s more about the ambient sounds than actual orchestral music. Even though those sounds do work great for the film. But it doesn’t compare to writing actual music that takes your breath away.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,160
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    @ringfire211
    I'm sure @MakeshiftPython wasn't disparaging Barry's '79 scores, which, incidentally, you correctly labelled marvellous. I too am a huge fan of THE BLACK HOLE. My friend the Python does, however, make a fair point, in my opinion, that surely we can all agree that the operatic might of Williams' STAR WARS and the atmospheric beauty of Goldsmith's ALIEN are quite different from Barry's work on THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH. I, for one, love all of these scores, but I think it's only fair to concede that THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH, while joyful and pleasant, are lightweight musical entertainment compared to, for example, STAR WARS.
    See? I completely disagree with this!! For me the MOONRAKER score is head and shoulders above any of the STAR WARS scores! There is absolutely nothing in those scores that comes even close to the sublime masterpieces that are “Flight into Space” or “Space Laser Battle” or “Bond Lured to Pyramids” or “Bond Arrives in Rio/Boat Chase”. I never understood folks who claim STAR WARS is the greatest film score of all-time. Can’t hold a candle to BEN-HUR by Miklos Rozsa or any of the Spaghetti Westerns by Morricone!! Those I would argue are the best scores of all time, along with a lot of Barry’s works. Even in Williams’ oeuvre his INDY scores are superior to his STAR WARS works. So is his JURASSIC PARK score!

    Goldsmith’s ALIEN is indeed great but it’s more about the ambient sounds than actual orchestral music. Even though those sounds do work great for the film. But it doesn’t compare to writing actual music that takes your breath away.

    @ringfire211

    Hold on, now, sir. You're drawing a few false conclusion there, I'm afraid. ;)

    A) MR ranks in my top 3 Barry scores. @MakeshiftPython was originally talking about STARCRASH and THE BLACK HOLE, not about MR. I don't know where he stands on MR. I certainly wasn't comparing MR to STAR WARS. MR, after all, is not a Sci-Fi flick the way THE BLACK HOLE and STARCRASH are.

    B) I didn't claim that STAR WARS is the greatest movie score of all-time. In my opinion, E.T., CLOSE ENCOUNTERS, TEMPLE OF DOOM, ... are greater Williams scores. I can easily agree about BEN-HUR. Again, we were discussing STARCRASH and THE BLACK HOLE in comparison to STAR WARS. That was it.

    C) Regarding ALIEN, your comment, "But it doesn’t compare to writing actual music that takes your breath away", is another case of personal opinion. It takes my breath away, albeit in a different fashion than, say, Vangelis' score for BLADE RUNNER, Barry's score for ZULU or Morricone's score for ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE WEST.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    Ok, my thoughts on MR: It’s a great score, but it’s very much a Bond score as opposed to being a stab at space opera like STARCRASH and THE BLACK HOLE. Even though there’s “Flight into Space”, it’s not really going for the space opera vibe of STAR WARS but rather more of the grandeur of 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, and it’s great for that! I think he’s better going that angle than he was with the other two scores.
  • Posts: 3,327
    I'm not liking the Barry bashing I'm seeing on here. For anyone thinking Barry didn't have it in him to score another Bond films in the 90's, they are talking bollocks!
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,195
    Just listen to The Specialist, Barry still had it in the 90s
  • Posts: 4,044
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