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I'd hate that. But, I'd like to see some darker areas in her personality. She's the daughter of an assassin after all, and that doesn't mean make her a "villain".
I don't think she will be a "villain", but her betraying Bond is a given as far as i'm concerned. The question is just why and to what extend.
But you have to keep in mind that we never had a situation where the Bond girl returns. (except for Trench, but she was neither a main Bond girl nor did she hang around for long)
If you're putting Swann back into the movie, you can't just have a lovey dovey relationship from start to finish, as Naomi Harris seems to be suggesting. You can't build a movie off of that, there needs to be some friction. My guess of couse. Maybe she's dead after 15 min and then everyone will complain again about how disrespectful Bond girls are treated Lol (that was a joke.) Honestly, i have no idea what they are going for with her, but i am looking forward to that balcony scene that i posted 2 pages back. :)
She's clearly capable but rejects the world of assassins and violence. Where events draw her in, the story can become very interesting.
And i say bizarre because... well, judge for yourself.
Compare what Naomi Harris is saying at 0:05 to what she is saying at 1:32
If that doesn't sound schizophrenic, i don't know what does.
Though i do have to give her some props for praising former Bond girls.
Maybe they do this more often than we think, but the tabloids always focus on the BS and drama.
It has increased a lot in the last 10 years, that's true. But that is only telling me that it will collapse on itself eventually and people will get bored of it. You're dealing with slightly angrier hippies here. It's just a phase, of horribly misguided "activism" and lazyness and it can end at any moment.
Just look at how much money Joker made. Soon every studio will be jumping on the edgy rated-r bandwagon.
Personaly i have always been more worried about spineless executives who bow to the internets demands. But i don't see EoN in that category. They march to their own drum.
If woke comments were box office poison movies like CAPTAIN MARVEL wouldn’t have made a billion dollars at the box office. There are far more realistic reasons for why movies like DARK FATE failed at the box office, but of course YouTubers like Doomcock are seizing this moment to claim it’s the woke/SJW comments.
There is an actual improvement on the slashing his pulses remark some years ago.
the enormous pressure to have 007 permanently played by a woman or anything but what Ian Fleming intented James Bond to be.
Remember we are talking about a movie here, and as Goldfinger once so brillantly put it, I expect this new 007 to die before the end of the movie.
I also expect a ton of harsh critics about this post.
There's nothing contradictory there at all.
You start to sound like my mother. Can you just... idk, stop doing that?
Or just ignore me? Or get a sense of humor.
I respect Naomi, i respect everybody involved in this film ok? Especially if it turns out to be a great film. But that doesn't mean i can't call her out on BS she's saying. There is no hate involved here and i would have no problem to say it to her face (if i knew her personally).
I write like i talk, i can't write any other way and i won't be treating on eggshells, just to appease you. If you find offensive stuff in my opinion than keep flagging me until i get banned, or ignore me. I don't see any other options.
But i came to the conclusion that the girls have no other choice than keep beating that drum, so i will back off a bit. In my opinion it is still not helpful because they still keep perpetuating this image that Bond is mysoginistic with their comments and some fans, including you, keep buying it apparently. Which in my opinion is a bigger damage to the image of this franchise than the actual content.
To be fair there have been times where the treatment of female characters was not exactly something to be proud of, like Bond just straight up choking Marie with her bikini in DAF, or unnecessarily hitting Andrea around in TMWTGG. If actually having a discussion of such problematic elements that the franchise indulged in makes us shitty fans, so be it.
But it's always the stuff of yesteryear! It's the Connery films and some of the Roger Moore films. Always.
EoN have been fighting this image for over 20 years. The deliberately went against it, especially when Barbara came on board. But guess what, the tabloids don't care.
The tabloids keep switch the narrative always back to Connery, and the 3 or 4 scenes that can be easily called sexist (bikini choking, Tatjana hitting, etc). And they will keep ignoring everything that has been achived. That's why this discussion is ridiculous and us fans should stop getting involved in it.
I am now 100% confident that NTTD will do NOTHING NEW in this department. NOTHING that has not been already done by Samantha Bond, Judi Dench, or Michelle Yeoh... and that was 20 years ago!
"Yeoh graciously said that she cannot take credit for Wai Lin’s characterisation as it was a conscious decision on the part of director Roger Spottiswoode and producers Barbara Broccoli and Michael G. Wilson to make the Bond girl an agent who could give Bond a run for his money, in a bid to counter claims that the franchise was “misogynistic”. Yeoh revealed that the very first ideas were a “beautiful Russian girl to play the femme fatale role,” perhaps as a nod to The Spy Who Loved Me. “I was very blessed,” Yeoh said. “In the writer’s room, there were a couple of them who went ‘how about this actress called Michelle Yeoh? She kicks ass!’”
“I had the privilege to audition with Pierce,” Yeoh recalled. “Thank god we had chemistry.” According to Yeoh, Brosnan had “no ego” and was perfectly fine with Bond being showed up in some scenes by Wai Lin. “They did want to highlight the fact that we have a Bond girl who’s going to be on par with James Bond. She is herself a spy from China and they are not easy to be reckoned with. She will be as physical as him and [be] able to do whatever he does – or [be] even better,”
You can't have a more powerful statement than having Bond's Boss be a woman who calls him out on his misogyny. And you can't have a more powerful agent than Wai Lin who is an actual martial artist in real life. Bringing Phoebe on board is cool and all but she will have a tough time, because people will expect a lot.
Naomi and Ana keep beating the drum, simply to counter the tabloids. That's why they are doing it. And they will keep doing it for the next 100 years.
Good on them, it doesn't really bother me. You shouldn't let it bother you.
No, no I don't.
May I have concerns or niggles after I've seen NTTD?
Who knows. Possibly, probably.
I've never gone into a Bond film feeling anything but excitement. The only time I've gone into a Bond film with slight caution was DAD. Having read a review beforehand, it stated that there was no action set piece. The likes of which Bond is famous for. Nearly all Bond films have an iconic moment. Especially after the ski jump in TSWLM. But apparently DAD didn't. I felt maybe the reviewer had overlooked it, clearly they were wrong. But alas, it was too be true. And for a long, long time DAD ranked bottom of the pile for me. But not so much nowadays.
But I digress. Even with reviews pre-viewing, I still like to go in with an open mind. Get excited for this new entry in the Bond series. View the film and walk out tall, knowing my favourite fictional character is still entertaining me.
Naomi and Ana will be really old in 100 years, too.
Apparently it won't stop anytime soon. Most of them wants bond's character to Change, what's next he is going to have kids and live out his days with family, frankly I don't want that kind of fairytale. They will keep saying that he will remain same,only the world around him change but it's getting harder to believe. Instead of saying the same thing over and over again(mine character is stronger and better written). Why can't they actually talk about their character, give us subtle hints for what's about to come (without spoiling it). But I don't get it bond hitting women is an issue but when women hit bond why no one bat's an eye. I was watching YOLT a while back and this actually got me thinking. We have come a long way from this
To this
and now this
So you would happily go up to Naomie Harris and call her schizophrenic for trying to sell what’s different about the franchise these days?
...and I’m sure you do respect them all in a lot of ways, but calling someone schizophrenic because they’ve said something you don’t agree with, bit stupid, and doesn’t make me take you seriously, and please don’t tell me what I’m “buying”. I have my own valid opinions about what’s going on thanks very much...
At the end of day say what you want about whoever you want but try to be a bit respectful because you never know, someone on here might have family that suffer with schizophrenia and find that comparison insulting.
I’m not asking you to change your opinion, just to think about what words you’re using.
But tbh I don’t know why I bother cause without fail you guys seem to just let my opinion go over your head, and then I just get accused of being an idiot feminist who wants nothing but for Bond fo be a PC symbol, which isn’t the case at all, and the debates we’ve had @00Agent should’ve proven that to you by now. So continue to throw the toys out of your prams, but if I think you’ve stepped over the line, I’m gonna tell you like I’m sure you’ll tell me :)
We have apparently two completely oppsoing worldviews and there is no way we will find common ground on this matter. I don't agree with you and i probably never will when it comes to how to treat the franchise and how to move forward.
This is a textbook definition of PCness. Are you not aware of the irony?
Do you have a book with you at all times, in which all the "bad words" are that you don't allow other people to use?
I had my fair share of mental illnesses and suicides in my family history. That's why i have a dark sense of humor that helps me cope with stuff like this. And that's why i feel comfortable talking about stuff like psychology etc. because i've been dealing with it all my life and educating myself on it. So i won't let myself be censored by someone with misguided ideas of PCness, and trying to be nice to everybody. People will trample all over you if you do that and one day you wake up and realize you have traded all your rights away and got nothing in return.
Also just for the protocol, i didn't call Naomi Harris shizophrenic, but what i said is WHAT SHE SAID SOUNDS SHIZOPHRENIC. Huge difference, and yes i would say that to her face like i would call any of my friends out if they bullshit me. But with a smile, in a joking manner. I'm not a bully.
Is it not reasonable, in a fifty (now nearly sixty) year old series to be a fan of the previous films, their characters and the performers who played them but also acknowledge that the way things were done in the 60s wouldn't necessarily cut it now?
The only irony to me is that it was in promotion of a film that had a prominent "the old ways are the best" motif running through it, but Harris' actual own words seem fine to me.
In the first paragaph she said "it used to be enough to be pretty, but not anymore" in the next she says "Former Bond girls were hugely talented".
There are certain implications there, but minor stuff.
Anyway, i complimented her on giving props to her predecessors. They should do it more often.
Moving on.
see ya :-h
In answer to the original question of this thread - I'm just gonna go see this on the night it comes out. Ya know, popcorn, hot dog, fizzy drink. Make an evening out of it. My daughter will probably opt for ice cream and nachos.
So there's your answer. Just looking forward to heading to the cinema, seeing the new Bond flick. If it's good - great! If it's bad... I'm sure there'll be another one along one day to redeem the series. It's always happened before.
As for people accusing each other in here of being this or that... why don't you just wait until you've seen the movie? Might not be any of the stuff you're worried about in it at all!
Absolutely. I'll be seeing it opening night with my Dad, as I've done for every Bond since 1997. We don't live close to each other anymore, but a new Bond is the time when we travel to meet up and we then go for a few beers afterwards. One of those special evenings.
I can't wait.