The What if NTTD is the last EON produced Bond film? page 62

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  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited January 2023 Posts: 5,970
    Denbigh wrote: »
    I was thinking about Marcello Mastroianni for Emilio Largo?
    With him playing a bigger part than in the Warhead screenplay I guess? It would be a shame to have Mastroianni for such a limited role. What about having him as Blofeld, since the way the character was written in Warhead was much different from how he was written under Fleming's pen.
    I thought about that but wasn't sure if he would fit with Blofeld. I do need to revisit the script as I'm probably most in the dark about the interpretation of Blofeld.

    EDIT: I actually just took a look at the script, and it looks like we've been thinking wrong about Fatima Blush and Domino's casting. In the script, at least in the one I have, Fatima is described as "[...]tall for an oriental, but there's no doubting the Eastern flavour[...]" and that she "[...]has a Korean mother and Spanish-Moroccan father[...]".
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Warhead (1979)
    Dir: J Lee Thompson
    James Bond ..... David Warbeck
    Domino ..... Isabelle Adjani
    Emilio Largo ..... Bruno Ganz
    Blofeld ..... Klaus Kinski
    Felix Leiter ..... Stacey Keach
    M ... Eric Porter
    Q ... Desmond Llewelyn
    Miss Moneypenny ... Jenny Agutter
  • Warhead (1979)
    Blofeld ..... Klaus Kinski
    Wow, this is brilliant. I never thought of him in the role but it could have been perfect for the craziness of Warhead. It's funny you also have Porter in mind (albeit for M's part), since I always thought he could have been a great Blofeld (maybe in an alternate OHMSS starring Connery?).
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Warhead (1979)
    Blofeld ..... Klaus Kinski
    Wow, this is brilliant. I never thought of him in the role but it could have been perfect for the craziness of Warhead. It's funny you also have Porter in mind (albeit for M's part), since I always thought he could have been a great Blofeld (maybe in an alternate OHMSS starring Connery?).

    Kinski is my dream casting for Blofeld, but I keep asking myself if he could have kept himself calm through filming. I have never watched Fitzcaraldo, but I have seen his legendary on set metldown.

    I could also see Porter as Blofeld (something close to his Prof. Moriarty in the Granada Sherlock Holmes), but having already cast Blofeld, I thought why not as M?
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited February 2023 Posts: 3,789
    Bumping this thread.......

    Relating to my comment in the Moonraker appreciation thread, which I did really appreciated!

    One thing that quickly came to my mind, what if Casino Royale was made in the Moore Era?

    What do you guys think would have happened?

    How do you imagine Moore in Casino Royale?

    Let's say the Producers acquired the rights to the novel in the 70's (or 80's) and made it to film in the same decade (the 70's/80's), how would that fare out?

    1. Whom would you cast as Vesper Lynd? Le Chiffre? Mathis? Opposite Moore's Bond?
    2. Would they adapt the novel faithfully? Or change some scenes? Or would it deviate far from the novel?
    3. Would it be successful?
    4. How would it change the Moore Era?

    Proven that Moore could play a serious Bond as seen in For Your Eyes Only, how do you guys see Moore in Casino Royale?

    What if Casino Royale was made in the Moore Era? (And starred Moore?)
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    I think Moore would excel in the torture scene: "Ohhhhh!"
  • TheSkyfallen06TheSkyfallen06 Buenos Aires, Argentina.
    Posts: 1,102
    - There probably would be a reference to Tracy at some point.
    - The torture scene would probably have been PG-softed.
    - Le Chiffre probably would have been a KGB agent.
  • Agent_Zero_OneAgent_Zero_One Ireland
    edited February 2023 Posts: 554
    Michael Lonsdale as Le Chiffre? Weirdly I could also imagine Louis Jordan doing it. Vesper is harder - Jane Seymour would be my best shot from the Bond Girls of Moore's actual films, but I don't think any quite fit. Maybe Cürt Jürgens for Mathis.

    I think Moore could do it, but it'd require a strong director. It'd collapse if he played it like TMWTGG.
  • Posts: 1,632
    I enjoyed RM's Bond films, though they induced cringes rather routinely, unfortunately. I think he was too old for CR even as of the time he made LALD.
  • Posts: 16,169
    I could picture Moore's CR coming after MR pushing FYEO back yet again.
    With Maibaum and Mickey G writing it would follow the novel fairly close with the addition of some action scenes. Cassandra Harris plays Vesper, Topol plays Mathis and maybe Steven Berkov would be Le Chiffre. David Hedison returns as Leiter.
    Moore is playing own his age and he falls for Vesper more than a decade after losing Tracy. The PTS begins at Tracy's grave.
    This version would premiere only 14 years after the 67 CR so there'd be a very conscious attempt to make it more serious, yet still providing Sir Roger with some witty dialogue.
    The casino sequences are lit like the casino scene in FYEO and the entire film has that sort of look.
    The torture scene would follow a very exciting Remi Jullienne car chase.
    Sir Roger certainly performs his iconic OOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHH as he's struck in the groin with a carpet beater. Another difference, he's wearing a dishevelled dinner suit in while tied to the chair as opposed to being nude as per the novel.
    He's still getting it in the groin though.
    Michael Gotthard plays Gettler whom Bond pursues after Vesper dies via cianide and we still get to see Roger kick his car off a cliff.
    The film bookends with a revisit to Tracy's grave and Vesper is buried in the same cemetary.
    On an upbeat note, Bond is summoned back to the office as the film ends.
    For the third film in a row............
    JAMES BOND WILL RETURN IN
    FOR YOUR EYES ONLY
  • edited February 2023 Posts: 910
    echo wrote: »
    I think Moore would excel in the torture scene: "Ohhhhh!"
    This is the only reason why I would have liked to see the movie made.

    I could imagine a Casino Royale adaptation in the early 80s, around the time of Octopussy, using the structure of the novel broadly while changing much of the details.
    mtm wrote: »
    The backgammon scene could have essentially been replaced with just the baccarat scene, and that would have probably been the only element from the CR novel adapted for Moore's sixth film.

    I guess it would have been longer and more pivotal to the plot, but yes otherwise you could do it. You'd still have Bond foiling Le Chiffre's initial plan, whatever that may be, to put him in trouble with the Russians and owing money, driving him to the Casino Royale, because that's just a natural extension of the plot. I guess after Bond has won you'd have Le Chiffre kidnapping Bond to his lair in order to get the money from him (as happened in many Roger films- as you say, Octopussy is a good example when he's taken to Khan's palace) and although the chair torture probably wouldn't have been it he may well have used some grander, more blockbustery method. Like the tiger hunt! Bizarrely one can almost imagine Octopussy being tweaked into a Roger version of CR.

    I love CR '06, and I don't think this would have been better, but I think you could make a perfectly decent Roger Moore Bond film out of the CR storyline.

  • Roger Moore in CR? Shudder.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,586
    Roger getting an RFID chip implant from the MI6 Techie: "OOOOORRURGH!"
    or "It's all in the wrist."
  • TheSkyfallen06TheSkyfallen06 Buenos Aires, Argentina.
    Posts: 1,102
    I've got one.
    ¿What If... The first Bond movie wasn't "Dr.No", but rather a totally original story?
  • TheSkyfallen06TheSkyfallen06 Buenos Aires, Argentina.
    edited February 2023 Posts: 1,102
    [DELETED]
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    edited February 2023 Posts: 14,586
    Wasn't the first one going to be TB, but they didn't have that kind of budget?

    I reckon it would've bombed if the first film wasn't adapted from Fleming. It wouldn't have happened because he was trying to get his novels filmed for a while.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited February 2023 Posts: 3,789
    @TheSkyfallen06 you've created a double post.

    Regarding your post:

    And no, I think it's Impossible to do it, especially that at the time, Fleming was still alive, so no they couldn't do an original story for Bond, Dr. No was chosen because it's the easiest Bond novel to adapt and more appropriate for the budget.

    Fleming wouldn't allowed the producers to make their own story for Bond, it needs to be adapted from one of his novels.

    If not Dr. No, possibly From Russia With Love could be the first film, because it's not that much on action, heck Fleming even wanted to have Hitchcock film this one or either Thunderball.

    Possibly Thunderball could have been the first film given McClory's demands.


    But it's not going to be an original story.

    Back at the time when Fleming was alive, the Producers have no power to do what they want to do with Bond, the power was still on Fleming, I think they've even asked him about the changes made in each films, and without of Fleming's approval, it couldn't happened, the Producers got the full control and power after Fleming died, they could change what they want to change, they could stray away from the source material, add or change some scenes, and they could create original stories without adhering to the source materials.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,434
    It was posed as a what if earlier in the thread.

    Yes, Broccoli and Saltzman had selected TB to be the first adventure. It was the newest release and made sense to be the first, however the court case and legalities put a brake on that plan and DN was selected instead.

    I think it is intriguing to think of TB being the first Bond adventure. Many production challenges would have awaited them and I doubt the $1,000,000 budget would have been enough to bring it to the screen. As it is DN tapped them out and required some creativity of Adams. I think it worked out best. At the very least we would have got a scaled down TB and I am not sure it would have launched the series the way DN did.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    MI6HQ wrote: »
    @TheSkyfallen06 you've created a double post.

    Regarding your post:

    And no, I think it's Impossible to do it, especially that at the time, Fleming was still alive, so no they couldn't do an original story for Bond, Dr. No was chosen because it's the easiest Bond novel to adapt and more appropriate for the budget.

    Fleming wouldn't allowed the producers to make their own story for Bond, it needs to be adapted from one of his novels.

    If not Dr. No, possibly From Russia With Love could be the first film, because it's not that much on action, heck Fleming even wanted to have Hitchcock film this one or either Thunderball.

    Possibly Thunderball could have been the first film given McClory's demands.


    But it's not going to be an original story.

    Back at the time when Fleming was alive, the Producers have no power to do what they want to do with Bond, the power was still on Fleming, I think they've even asked him about the changes made in each films, and without of Fleming's approval, it couldn't happened, the Producers got the full control and power after Fleming died, they could change what they want to change, they could stray away from the source material, add or change some scenes, and they could create original stories without adhering to the source materials.

    I don't think Fleming had that much power with Eon when he was alive. That's not how Hollywood works.

    Now if it were France, maybe.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,434
    In memory of Raquel Welch passing today, I thought it would be interesting to chat about her missed Bond role. In 1965 Raquel was pretty hot and an upcoming actress. She was considered, and I have read in some places, offered the part of Domino in TB.

    According to reports Ms. Welch was offered the role by the producers and politely turned it down so that she could star in 1,000,000 Years B.C. While I am a huge fan of Claudine Auger and what she brought to the role, I can envision Raquel doing the role justice.

    But lets hear from the community. What if Raquel Welch had starred as Domino in TB in 1965?
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited February 2023 Posts: 3,789
    She would've been fantastic, she's a better actress and could speak English fluently.

    That's not to knock against Claudine Auger (RIP to her too), but she's dubbed and not that much in the acting department.

    Raquel Welch could've played the character convincingly.

    Edit: I don't know if this was meant to be a premonition, but I've had a thought of Raquel Welch yesterday, her image just suddenly popped up in my mind yesterday.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    Posts: 25,154
    I like Claudine too much to ever replace her as Domino, though Raquel would be great nonetheless.

    Raquel was considered for the role of Tiffany Case also which I think would have suited her better.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,041
    I could also imagine her as Tiffany Case, rather than Domino. And the fact that she had English as native language doesn't mean she wouldn't have been dubbed. After all, they dubbed the likes of Eunice Gayson and Shirley Eaton along with most non-British actresses until at least the Seventies.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    Posts: 3,789
    They didn't dubbed Honor Blackman, the same also for Diana Rigg.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,041
    MI6HQ wrote: »
    They didn't dubbed Honor Blackman, the same also for Diana Rigg.
    No, that's why I only mentioned those two English actresses that actually were dubbed in spite of being English (Shirley Eaton is supposed to have had a strong Yorkshire accent, IIRC). But fun fact: Nikki van der Zyl actually dubbed (part of? - haven't seen the film) Raquel Welch's lines in One Million Years BC as well, says IMDb.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    Posts: 3,789
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    MI6HQ wrote: »
    They didn't dubbed Honor Blackman, the same also for Diana Rigg.
    No, that's why I only mentioned those two English actresses that actually were dubbed in spite of being English (Shirley Eaton is supposed to have had a strong Yorkshire accent, IIRC). But fun fact: Nikki van der Zyl actually dubbed (part of? - haven't seen the film) Raquel Welch's lines in One Million Years BC as well, says IMDb.

    Yes, it might depends, even you're an English or American, if your voice or accent are undesirable or they did find ugly or not fitting for the role, they might dubbed you.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited February 2023 Posts: 3,152
    Raquel Welch would clearly have been great in TB, but to be honest I'd rather have the world in which Claudine played Domino and Raquel made 1,000,000 Years BC. Win-win.
    Love the thought of Shirley Eaton's Yorkshire accent!
    'Ey up, giz them binoculars, will tha? Arr, thar oreyt, thee, Mester Bond.' :))
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,041
    Venutius wrote: »
    Raquel Welch would clearly have been great in TB, but to be honest I'd rather have the world in which Claudine played Domino and Raquel made 1,000,000 Years BC. Win-win.
    Love the thought of Shirley Eaton's Yorkshire accent!
    'Ey up, giz them binoculars, will tha? Arr, thar oreyt, thee, Mester Bond.' :))

    Yes, it must 'uv bin sometin' like that...or so. Not saying I can truly copy it, but heavy Yorkshire accent is one of the occasions when I prefer to have English subtitles activated. Even more than Southern U.S. drawl.
  • edited February 2023 Posts: 628
    Shirley Eaton's real voice can be heard in the first episode of The Saint ("The Talented Husband"). Eaton gives a good performance and is easy to understand in that episode. I never understood why she was dubbed in GF.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,041
    Escalus5 wrote: »
    Shirley Eaton's real voice can be heard in the first episode of The Saint ("The Talented Husband"). Eaton gives a good performance and is easy to understand in that episode. I never understood why she was dubbed in GF.
    Well, I don't really know, since I don't think I've ever seen a single episode of "The Saint". It was aired on German TV when I was five or six under the title of "Simon Templar", but I could have only seen it dubbed in German if my parents had allowed it in the first place. Just like my later experiences with The Avengers were in German, which I have corrected by buying DVD/BD sets with the original sound

    The decision to dub a character is not always easy to understand. Nikki van der Zyl, who (apart from her numerous re-voicing jobs) was hired as a voice coach for Gert Fröbe with his English lines in GF, said it would have been perfectly ok to keep his own voice for the movie (once she was done ;-)). Though I must say that Michael Collins did such a perfect job in dubbing Fröbe that it took my wife and myself years to realize that it wasn't Fröbe's voice in the English version. While it was totally obvious that he dubbed himself in the German version, and quite terrifically so...provided one accepts movies in another language than the original.
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