Weekly Bond Poll: Round 59: secondary Bond girls & helicopter flights

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  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,490
    This round didn't attract many voters... Last call.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,946
    Baron Samedi and Liparus. Beauuuuuuuuuuuuuuuutiful.
  • Posts: 631
    The Baron
    Liparus

    easy
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,490
    Results of round 30:
    Henchmen with evil laughter/grin: Baron Samedi wins 7:2 against Dario
    Derek Meddings’ model work: Liparus wins 7:2 against Severnaya crash

    Round 31:

    Which (generelly much appreciated) CR scene do you prefer: train talk: (I’m the money. Every penny of it.) vs: torture scene (Now the whole world's gonna know that you died scratching my balls!)

    Which “in-the-water-MI6-Headquarter” do you prefer: submarine (YOLT) vs. wreck of RMS Queen Elizabeth (TMWTGG)

  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    The torture scene. It was very intense, and very clever how they managed to make it less uncomfortable by adding some verbal humour.

    The second is hard. None stand out, but YOLT just because it is less silly.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,511
    The torture scene-- and as @Thunderfinger mentions the humour; I think it heightens the scene and shows Bond's inner strength, probably strength he didn't know he had. One moment he's laughing maniacally, the next second he's snarling about how Le Chiffre's people are going to hunt him down and "cut him into little pieces while (he's) still breathing"... Also, M told him to take his ego out of the equation-- what better way of kissing your ego goodbye as you're stripped naked to a chair, getting your manhood decimated. Terrific scene.

    And I'll take the sub HQ from YOLT easily. It's fun, and Connery seems playful.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,946
    Torture scene. And the wreck of the RMS Queen Elizabeth. Both are inspired.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    edited April 2020 Posts: 3,262
    Torture scene

    It puts Flemings work on screen down to the death of Le Chiffre. The train talk scene is not bad but seems like it's trying a little too hard to top the similar Cary Grant/Eva Marie Saint scene in Hitchcock's NBNW.

    and

    Submarine (YOLT)

    Both in the water MI6 HQ scenes are good but I like seeing Connery, M and Miss Moneypenny in their royal naval uniforms.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,603
    Torture scene and Queen Elizabeth (It has a bar)
  • BennyBenny Shaken not stirredAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 15,176
    I really do like the playfulness of Bond and Vespers meeting on the train. It's a great introduction to Vespers character. However I simply cannot overlook the torture scene.
    Naked, strapped to a chair. Having your genitals whacked with a length of knotted rope!
    It's the most simplistic and effective torture if you ask me. And it makes me wince every time. it's so beautifully shot. I think the humour is required, or it would become too sadistic. It also brings out Bond's defiance in being able to withstand what would be agonising pain. Easily one of the stand out moments of CR, if not the series.

    The second option I'm going to give to the wreck of the RMS Queen Elizabeth.
    Simply because it's a quirky and albeit silly idea. If we can have hollowed out volcanoes and the like, then why cant MI6 utilise the wreck of a boat for their headquarters in Hong Kong. As the naval chap says, with real estate in Hong Kong being so expensive, it's a pretty good option.

    Another good round @goldenswissroyale, look forward to next weeks entries. And hopefully a few more people will participate in this thread.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,224
    Train scene. My favourite moments in the movie.

    RMS Queen Elizabeth. Reminds me of German Expressionism and The Third Man, ergo clear winner.
  • Max_The_ParrotMax_The_Parrot ATAC to St Cyril’s
    Posts: 2,426
    Train scene for me, I like a bit of Bond banter, and Vesper gives better banter than most Bond girls.

    And definitely Queen Elizabeth, if I had the money to restyle my house so that everything sloped 45 degrees in homage to the QE then believe me I would!!
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,595
    Train Talk, Queen Elizabeth (can the scenery chew the actors? I mean to say, I couldn't take my eyes off the set, lol)
  • Posts: 698
    Somehow missed last weeks sorry.

    Torture scene one of the best acting scenes in any Bond film. Craig and Mikkelsen are perfect.

    Neither leaves a massive impression, but while TMWTGG is probably a more interesting set, I prefer the submarine as it has a more classical nature to it, where it's just M's office but in a submarine.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,700
    The train scene, by a pubic hair. Why? I like trains, and I used to be a sailor.
    RMS Queen Elizabeth. I find shipwrecks fascinating. Love how they salvage the Chinese fighter.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,490
    Both CR Scenes are definitely in my top five of all CR scenes and strong contenders for the top 10 of bond scenes in general. The train scene is probably my favourite conversation of all Bond/Bondgirl interactions. Versper/Eva Green is amazing and there is great chemistry between her and and Craig.
    The torture scene is on the same Level but it is also able to give me goose bumps. It is violent, dark and at the same time we get some of the funniest lines of the movie. I believe that I had already tears in my eyes in this scene : It is difficult to describe why but it was probably because of the relief that Bond isn't broken yet and is still able to provoke his enemy in such a way that we really have to laugh with Bond but at the same time his pain feels real. The dark/fun mixture could be a trainwreck but it works perfectly in CR. The director and the actors did a fantastic job here.
    I'm with @2Wint2Kidd once again: For me, this is one of the best acted scenes in Bond history.

    The submarine was cool. It was unexpected (the first time that we see M and Moneypenny outside the official headquarter in London) and I love the moment when they open the "mummified" body and out comes Bond in his uniform. This scene fits probably better into the movie than the sScene from TMWTGG...
    ...however, I have to vote for Queen Elizabeth: Despite being OTT, it is a very cool set and I didn't see that coming after Bond was jumping on the wreck.
  • Posts: 1,927
    The torture scene for sure. I'd be surprised if anybody who'd ever read Fleming's description of this scene didn't have it burned into their mind in a horrible way. When I heard it would be in the film version I wondered just how they could pull that off and they did in an unexpected way, especially the humor that I found just the right touch to the scene without losing its edge.

    It takes Bond where he'd never been before in this way, breaking new territory. I can't imagine any of the other actors doing this scene. It also works in that it almost makes me sympathetic toward Le Chiffre's plight. I think then to the subsequent torture scene in SP that seems even worse in comparison, making CR's that much better. I doubt we'll get a torture scene as good in a Bond film again. Not that I'm not hoping, mind you.

    The train conversation is another good part of the film, but I'm honestly surprised many fans hold it such high esteem. Sure it beats Moore or Brosnan double-entendre fests, but I don't like it quite as much as some of the conversations with Camille in QoS. One of the things I remember is when this was new, some fans tried to make the lines "I'm the money" and "Every penny" to be an Easter egg for it being a Moneypenny reference.

    For Mi6 HQ, give me the Queen Elizabeth every time. How cool it was the first time seeing TMWTGG as Bond leaps onto the wreck (not sure just how he thought it would help him escape) and hear that voice welcoming him. It's imaginative with the angles and somebody mentioned the cool touch of the salvaged fighter plane and the amusing line about being economic with real estate prices being what they are and M's presence.

    I'm again surprised by all the enthusiasm for the submarine. It's a submarine, albeit the first time one appeared in a Bond film, so why is it so surprising to see M in one given he's an admiral? The build-up atmosphere is nice as Bond's body floats to the bottom to Barry's haunting music, is picked up by frogmen in black scuba gear (could it be SPECTRE?) and hauled into the sub.

    It is cool to see Bond in naval uniform and the dialogue amusing and to-the-point. Added points for the way Bond lights the paper with Henderson's address and watching it burn down. Nice character touch, one of the few Dahl added for Bond.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    edited April 2020 Posts: 4,490
    "I can't imagine any of the other actors doing this scene." Exactly @BT3366

    "Bond leaps onto the wreck (not sure just how he thought it would help him escape)"
    Now, you mention it, I must admit that it isn't the smartest escape plan
    ;)
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    edited April 2020 Posts: 4,490
    Results of round 31:
    The torture scene in CR wins against the talk in the train 9:4
    MI6 Headquarter in the water: Queen Elizabeth (TMWTGG) wins against submarine (YOLT) 9:4

    Round 32:

    Which of Bond's deadly TB quotes do you prefer: "I think he got the point." vs. "Do you mind if my friend sits this one out? She's just dead."

    Which action scene/fight with Necros do you prefer: Necros against Green Four (kitchen fight) vs. Necros against Bond (cargo net fight)

  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,511
    @goldenswissroyale -- can I call a tie on the TB quotes? These are two of my very favourite lines. Not just in this film, but in the entire series. To me, each have the perfect set-ups: in one, the suspense is drawn out longer and the tension-wire is ready to snap; the other is more quick and like a knock-out punch that no one saw coming-- least of all the opponent.

    For the second, I'll take the cargo plane (I do like the Green Four Kitchen Fight, but it's just a little too noticeably "stylized" for my tastes (although I admire what its intent was (to show a more ruthless and violent villain in the mold of Red Grant), but; the cargo plane sees Bond ambushed, on his back foot and, it developed nicely so that the rest of the fight took place on the outside of the plane! When I first saw TLD as a 14 year old boy, this fight made my heart beat like a jack-rabbit).
  • OctopussyOctopussy Piz Gloria, Schilthorn, Switzerland.
    Posts: 1,081
    I think the "Do you mind if my friend sits this one out? She's just dead." edges in front for me because it's the ending of such an awesome sequence of events. Both of these lines are highlights in the series, IMO. However, I love the sense of Bond in danger as he scrambles away from Fiona Volpe and Largo's henchmen. It reminds me of Bond in On Her Majesty's Secret Service trying to evade Blofeld's goons and Bundt in St. Moritz. The suspense is on a knife edge, but when Bond delivers this line it's diffused in quintessential Connery style.

    I'll have to go with the cargo-plane fight. The kitchen with Necros is brutal, but you can't match the sheer stuntwork and sense of danger in the second option.
  • BennyBenny Shaken not stirredAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 15,176
    The weekend is upon us, and therefore we have a new weekly Bond poll.

    The first option I'll go with, "She's just dead." Not only is it the conclusion of a tense foot chase as Bond tries to evade Fiona and her men. But it's the deadpan delivery from Sean Connery. One of my favourite Bond lines.

    The second option is a no brainer for me. I enjoy the brutal fight between Necros and Green-four, but nothing can compete with the jaw dropping spectacle of Bond and Necros fighting for their lives on a cargo net of an airborne plane!
    I've often said, I feel this to be the best stunt of all time. And it still stands. Though some of Tom Cruise efforts in the most recent MI films may surpass this.
  • Max_The_ParrotMax_The_Parrot ATAC to St Cyril’s
    Posts: 2,426
    I never really warmed to the ‘she’s just dead’ line, it seemed a bit clunky to me. So whilst it’s rather cheesy and obvious, I’ll go with He got the point

    And there’s so many scenes in TLD I love, and both of these are in there. However I really like everything about the whole Blayden Safe House section, from Necros’ milkman to the Harrods hamper to the assault and the kitchen fight. The fact that Krone is back hasn’t swayed my vote at all, but I’m going for the kitchen scene 🦜👍
  • Posts: 1,927
    Great questions from two of my personal favorites.

    "I think he got the point" still works, although I could see some people groaning about it these days. The scene just screams cool. You have Connery in the shades in prime physical condition and the most beautiful of the Bond women at his side. The drama beforehand is also great as Bond has to come clean with Domino after seducing her. Slight complaint: Bond made it look too easy, one great shot. It made Bond look too much like the superhero figure.

    One question: Bond tells her to go back to the Disco Volante and he'll take care of Vargas's body. Later on Largo confronts Domino telling her Vargas is dead. Did Bond not do a thorough enough job of disposing of Vargas or was it just sloppy writing? They could've just had Largo say that Vargas was still missing and what did she know.

    I'm with Max the Parrot on the "She's just dead" line. As a kid, my mom liked it and I didn't get the irony and it still never comes across well for me. It just isn't delivered as well.

    Another question on that scene: After the other henchmen see what happened, why do they run off and not still come after Bond? Wasn't that their orders? Because Fiona is dead does that mean they don't know what to do? Imagine explaining that one to Largo. Not only did they not capture or kill Bond, they killed their own boss and let Bond get away to make another attempt to foil their plans. Largo's sharks were probably happy at least.

    When I first saw TLD, I couldn't believe how well the kitchen fight was staged and why the best hand-to-hand fight in years didn't contain Bond. It was much more brutal and people got hurt, unlike the overly-choreographed tussles of the Moore era.

    Now take a situation that's been leading up to the whole movie, Bond against the henchman who has killed and done so much damage to his organization, then add the situation of having to fight it out OUTSIDE the plane while hanging on for dear life to a cargo net that's slowly coming unhinged. That is the Bond series at its best. My vote the cargo net fight.

    What adds to the beauty of this whole sequence is not only do you have Bond fighting for his life against the deadly Necros, you have a ticking bomb somewhere in the cargo hold and an unreliable woman at the controls. This continues even after Necros is given the boot as he had to find the bomb, use it to stop the Russian advance on the Mujahidin and then escape the plane before it crashes. Makes the whole thing afterward with Whitaker seem so anti-climactic.

    I am amazed when I read some fans find this section of the film uninvolving. Maybe the build-up is a little slow, but from when Bond's identity is discovered to the escape from the plane is just non-stop Bond.

    Apologies for going on like this, but when it comes to Bond films I love it's hard not to show it.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    edited April 2020 Posts: 7,224
    Kitchen fight, although they're both great!

    "She's just dead", although again both excellent moments.
  • Max_The_ParrotMax_The_Parrot ATAC to St Cyril’s
    Posts: 2,426
    Really enjoyed reading your justification @BT3366 👍
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    edited April 2020 Posts: 4,490
    Really enjoyed reading your justification @BT3366 👍

    Indeed!
    @BT3366 I didn't know that these two films are part of your favourites. TLD is also in my first quarter, while TB isn't even close to my top 10.

    I never thought about your first question. It really looks like Bond didn't “remove“ Vargas properly. Or Largo was pretty sure he was killed because Vargas didn't return...but the delivery of the line sounds indeed like Largo knows of his dead.

    The other question is something bothering me, too. It doesn't make sense at all that the others leave after Fiona's dead. Maybe, the writer and director hoped that the viewers would only focus on the fact that they can't watch the stunning Fiona any longer and forget everything else.
  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 2,870
    Two sets of great choices.

    From TLD I’ll go with the kitchen fight. Even after all of these years I find myself squirming when Necros rams Blayden’s head down on the grill. Another plus for this scene is the casting. Blayden was played by Bill Weston. Weston often did uncredited stunt work on the Bond films, and he did stunt work on my favorite movie of all time….”2OO1.”

    While I enjoy both death puns from TB, the “he got the point” quip gets my vote. Per @BT3366, Connery’s shades….. 😊.
  • Posts: 698
    First one is a tough one! I might have to go with she's just dead ever so slightly.
    Cargo net fight. Really exciting, and I think it holds up really well.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    Posts: 3,262
    Round 32:

    TB: While definitely prefer Volpe's character to Vargas' character I think the latter's exit gets a slightly more effective quote from Bond so I pick "I think he got the point."

    TLD: Easier. Necros against Bond (cargo net fight) is one of the very best Bond vs. henchman final battles in the series IMHO.
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