NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - First Reactions vs. Current Reactions

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Comments

  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,551
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.

    I concur.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,551
    I look forward to it every time, knowing it’s coming makes the dinner scene so tense, you think the waiter is coming back and then it’s just an explosion of energy. It puts you right there.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    I only wish that it wasn’t the last we saw of Bautista.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,551
    I only wish that it wasn’t the last we saw of Bautista.

    Agreed!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.

    I concur.

    Actually, if you remove Bautista & the PTS, the movie is kinda, well, lame...
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,551
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    I love Spectre, but the list of missed opportunities in the film is tragically long.
    chrisisall wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.

    I concur.

    Actually, if you remove Bautista & the PTS, the movie is kinda, well, lame...

    Personally I'd still really enjoy Rome, Altaussee, L'Americain, and Blofeld's Lair.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,551
    Deleted
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited December 2021 Posts: 17,801
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    I love Spectre, but the list of missed opportunities in the film is tragically long.
    chrisisall wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.

    I concur.

    Actually, if you remove Bautista & the PTS, the movie is kinda, well, lame...

    Personally I'd still really enjoy Rome, Altaussee, L'Americain, and Blofeld's Lair.

    But Rome was mainly Bautista... L'Americain WAS good, but Blofeld's lair was not too well thought out I felt... still, it's my 2nd favourite Craig Bond after QOS.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,551
    chrisisall wrote: »
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    I love Spectre, but the list of missed opportunities in the film is tragically long.
    chrisisall wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.

    I concur.

    Actually, if you remove Bautista & the PTS, the movie is kinda, well, lame...

    Personally I'd still really enjoy Rome, Altaussee, L'Americain, and Blofeld's Lair.

    But Rome was mainly Bautista... L'Americain WAS good, but Blofeld's lair was not too well thought out I felt... still, it's my 2nd favourite Craig Bond after QOS.

    Nah, to me Rome was the funeral, Monica Belucci’s home, and the meeting… granted Hinx was a big part of the meeting but I loved everything about the meeting that wasn’t Hinx too.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    SP over CR?????

    Whaaaaaattt?
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,551
    I think CR was the better film (by quite a bit), but these days I'm more likely to throw on SP than CR... ;)
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    chrisisall wrote: »
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    I love Spectre, but the list of missed opportunities in the film is tragically long.
    chrisisall wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    It comes from the school of “ We hasn’t had an action scene in 10 mins so we should slot one in here “ thinking.

    I really don't think this is the case. I think this is partly what makes this fight so great, is that it explodes out of absolutely nowhere, the music stops, and for that reason it's really edge-of-your-seat tense for me.

    I don't think every fight scene needs to follow the same formula of tension-building to be good.

    That fight is the highlight of the movie for me.

    I concur.

    Actually, if you remove Bautista & the PTS, the movie is kinda, well, lame...

    Personally I'd still really enjoy Rome, Altaussee, L'Americain, and Blofeld's Lair.

    But Rome was mainly Bautista... L'Americain WAS good, but Blofeld's lair was not too well thought out I felt... still, it's my 2nd favourite Craig Bond after QOS.

    Nah, to me Rome was the funeral, Monica Belucci’s home, and the meeting… granted Hinx was a big part of the meeting but I loved everything about the meeting that wasn’t Hinx too.

    Okay, yeah, Monica added a LOT to the film in her brief time in it. SP had a lot going for it, indeed.
  • Posts: 1,394
    I look forward to it every time, knowing it’s coming makes the dinner scene so tense, you think the waiter is coming back and then it’s just an explosion of energy. It puts you right there.

    When did he get on the train?
    Why did he choose that time to attack?
    Why didn’t he have a gun and just shoot Bond?
    How did he know Bond was on that train?
    Why is he trying to kill Bond since later we find out that wasn’t Blofelds plan?
    Where the hell is everyone on the train?
    Where was security?

    I like to think that Bond and Madeline didn’t get off the train the next morning.They were booted off in the middle of the desert for all that carnage they caused😉

  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,585
    FoxRox wrote: »
    One thing I want to see return is more epic hand-to-hand fights, a la Bond vs. Grant, Bond vs. Trevelyan, Bond vs. Sandor / Jaws, etc. Craig got into a lot of brief combat tussles, but other than the train fight with Hinx, didn't really get a memorable, lengthy fight along these lines. And I think we're almost unanimous in agreeing we want less personal, less rogue, less drama stuff next era, though with the way action films just are now, fat chance sadly.

    Don’t forget the stairwell fight vs Obanno & goon in Casino Royale. Not lengthy but definitely one of the best fight scenes in the series

    Bond vs Slate is a 30-second epic.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    TripAces wrote: »
    FoxRox wrote: »
    One thing I want to see return is more epic hand-to-hand fights, a la Bond vs. Grant, Bond vs. Trevelyan, Bond vs. Sandor / Jaws, etc. Craig got into a lot of brief combat tussles, but other than the train fight with Hinx, didn't really get a memorable, lengthy fight along these lines. And I think we're almost unanimous in agreeing we want less personal, less rogue, less drama stuff next era, though with the way action films just are now, fat chance sadly.

    Don’t forget the stairwell fight vs Obanno & goon in Casino Royale. Not lengthy but definitely one of the best fight scenes in the series

    Bond vs Slate is a 30-second epic.

    Yes, and so brutally realistic. Shockingly so for Bond IMO. Not all that necessary. But Bourne pushed EON's copy buttons....
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,551
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    I look forward to it every time, knowing it’s coming makes the dinner scene so tense, you think the waiter is coming back and then it’s just an explosion of energy. It puts you right there.

    When did he get on the train?
    Why did he choose that time to attack?
    Why didn’t he have a gun and just shoot Bond?
    How did he know Bond was on that train?
    Why is he trying to kill Bond since later we find out that wasn’t Blofelds plan?
    Where the hell is everyone on the train?
    Where was security?

    I feel like if I was worried about this sort of thing, I wouldn't enjoy any of the Bond films at all. :))

    "Why is he trying to kill Bond since later we find out that wasn’t Blofelds plan?"

    I have put some thought into this concept, and for me, it's like Blofeld is putting Bond through these "trials" on his way to Blofeld; if he passes them, then he is worth Blofeld's time and they will meet, if not, then, I guess they won't. ;)
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    Also Bond was tracked via smartblood.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 3,152
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    This. Absolutely.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,551
    Venutius wrote: »
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    This. Absolutely.

    Would have loved for him to show up with some big weird neck brace, would have given him the physical deformity classic of Bond villainry.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    It also would have highlighted how he should have been Blofeld all along. He pretty much matches the description of Fleming’s from THUNDERBALL.
  • edited December 2021 Posts: 3,327
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    I must be in the minority but I really enjoyed the more serious tone of this era, especially before the tonal shift in Spectre.

    I know Craig didn't want to be the glum or serious Bond forever but that tone suited him more in my opinion. He did have some funny lines in CR, QOS and SF.

    I prefer Bond to have a dry wit/dark humour than the Moore/Brosnan era constant quips

    Yes I agree. The serious aspect I'm more in favour of than Brozza/Moore quips. My biggest gripe with the Craig era is not the serious tone, but that it didn't adapt any more Fleming after CR.

    Instead it went for Fleming re-imagined, bringing us awful retcon crap in the process - Brofeld, Bond having a daughter, Bond dying, Safin instead of Shatterhand/Blofeld, etc.
  • Watched NTTD in full for the first time since theaters. Did not age well for me unfortunately. The script/plot is a mess and all the big moments feel very contrived. Plus, there are way too many moments where I feel I'm watching Craig, not Bond.

    Regarding the actual writing of the film, I found this video, which I think explains the issues some of us have with NTTD very well:
  • Posts: 1,394
    TheBondFan wrote: »
    Watched NTTD in full for the first time since theaters. Did not age well for me unfortunately. The script/plot is a mess and all the big moments feel very contrived. Plus, there are way too many moments where I feel I'm watching Craig, not Bond.

    Regarding the actual writing of the film, I found this video, which I think explains the issues some of us have with NTTD very well:

    Excellent video.What it all boils down to is just poor writing.Iv said this before but the film has fantastic production values, and a talented cast but it’s the writing that lets it down.

    The editing on that video is super on point by the way!

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,183
    How it didn’t even occur to the filmmakers to write in Bond having to fight Bautista in the ruins of MI6 before rescuing Madeleine blows my mind.

    No matter how much I love SP, I absolutely agree with this. Hinx was established early on as the toughest and most brutal killer ever. We get two chase scenes with him and one fight that is over too soon. It would have made sense to have Hinx confront Bond at the MI6 building one last time. Then Bond wouldn't have had to just look for Madeleine. He could've known where she was but had to get past Hinx first, a bit like Bond facing Oddjob at Ford Knox. Hinx would have had to know the building was going to explode; his absolute loyalty to Blofeld would have been even more frightening that way.
  • Posts: 1,394
    I think Hinx should have been the Jaws of the Craig era.

    They should have established that he survived the train scene from SP in NTTD.He goes after Bond again only for Hinx to fall in love with a little blonde woman who wears glasses.After Bond sacrifices himself on Safins island,Hinx and his new girlfriend escape on a raft,pop open a bottle of champagne and Hinx says “ Well,here’s to us! “.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,183
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    I think Hinx should have been the Jaws of the Craig era.

    They should have established that he survived the train scene from SP in NTTD.He goes after Bond again only for Hinx to fall in love with a little blonde woman who wears glasses.After Bond sacrifices himself on Safins island,Hinx and his new girlfriend escape on a raft,pop open a bottle of champagne and Hinx says “ Well,here’s to us! “.

    That would have been awesome. 😄😄
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited December 2021 Posts: 3,152
    I love Spectre, but the list of missed opportunities in the film is tragically long.
    Absolutely. I love SP for what it is, but there's some glaring omissions that would've added so much. The really frustrating thing is that many of them are so self-evident that you wouldn't have to shoehorn them in, they'd stem naturally from things that are already in the script. Hinx in the ruins of MI6 being the classic one. Makes you wonder if they were all so hopelessly bogged down in the multiple re-writes after a while that they couldn't see the wood for the trees. There's a line in one of those leaked Sony emails where one exec complains that a draft of the revised script is 'way worse...the last draft was actually better…beside being not good its a sloppy mess'! I wonder what she really thought?! :-O
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