And the Klebbie goes to...Worst execution of a good idea page 147

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  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,581
    Bond shoves the boy off of the boat in TMWTGG.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,249
    Yep, for me too. The boy helped him!
  • Agent_OneAgent_One Ireland
    edited July 2020 Posts: 280
    Yeah, the poor kid. Moore's hard edged persona in TMWTGG just doesn't suit him at all.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    edited July 2020 Posts: 8,216
    I think duping Solitaire is the obvious one here, for me. He blatantly twists her beliefs and uses them against her in order to get her into bed. It was certainly an effective tactic, but it doesn't get more ungentlemanly than that.

    The boy is nothing in comparison, really. Bond was being chased and he clearly didn't have the money to pay him. Keeping him on the boat would have put him in danger.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,287
    Of these, I have to go with Camille, because it's such a bizarre moment.

    Yes, you could argue that he was saving the elephant boy.
  • Agent_OneAgent_One Ireland
    edited July 2020 Posts: 280
    I think duping Solitaire is the obvious one here, for me. He blatantly twists her beliefs and uses them against her in order to get her into bed. It was certainly an effective tactic, but it doesn't get more ungentlemanly than that.

    The boy is nothing in comparison, really. Bond was being chased and he clearly didn't have the money to pay him. Keeping him on the boat would have put him in danger.
    Eh, you make a compelling argument. I suppose the way Moore plays the scenes is a factor in how some view it; Moore plays the LALD scene with his usual effortless charisma, whereas in TMWTGG he's a lot harsher throughout. Nevertheless, I'd like to change my vote to duping Solitaire as well.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,774
    The card trick on Solitaire. That old dog.

    And I'm always surprised in the film how quickly he admits it to her.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    The card trick on Solitaire. That old dog.

    And I'm always surprised in the film how quickly he admits it to her.

    I'm always surprised that after he tells her she doesn't slug him in the jaw! I'll take duping Solitaire too.
  • Posts: 7,414
    Duping Solitaire is my pick too! Clever trick by James, but it was rather nasty. I believe Jane Seymour has stated so herself in interviews!
  • Posts: 631
    They’re all ungentlemanly, but if Bond was here to defend himself he might tell us there were mitigating circumstances for at least a few of them.

    So he has to push the boy off the boat to keep the boy out of the firing line, and similarly in LALD he needs to find out more about Kananga’s organisation somehow and tricking Solitaire is a quick and efficient way to do that. Quicker than waiting for a romance to blossom naturally, anyway.

    Also, in QOS we don’t know what happens after he’s made a quip and walked off screen, for all we know Bond phoned for an ambulance for Camille or something.

    And also, we don’t know anything about Dink. Perhaps Dink has already told JB that she likes being slapped on the bottom? Or perhaps it’s an in-joke between JB and Dink, referring to a conversation they had earlier. Who knows? Yes it’s desperate stuff I know but remember that Bond is not here to present the case for his defence :))

    I can’t think of any mitigating circumstances for his behaviour towards the MR hotel bell hop though. It seems so unnecessary on every level. It does not befit a gentleman at all. So I vote for MR bell hop.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Tricking Solitaire is a lowpoint. Not the only one, but what a jerk.
  • MooseWithFleasMooseWithFleas Philadelphia
    Posts: 3,369
    Can someone explain the MR Brazil bit further? All he says is "Really? Don't bother showing me the rest. If I get lost I'll take a cab." And we often don't see Bond tipping the bell hop on screen.

    My vote goes to Dink.
  • edited July 2020 Posts: 3,566
    I'm for the boy in TMWTGG, but partially because Bond is so un-Bondlike throughout this entire sequence. He starts it off needing to be rescued by the Karate girls... then Hip drives away, not realizing that he's left the object of their rescue behind... THEN Bond (master of all vehicles) needs a little kid to flip a simple switch for him in order to get the boat moving again. GAWD, what an abysmal collection of boneheadedness is displayed throughout this sequence! When J.W. Pepper ends the whole parade of embarrassment by getting pulled dunked by an elephant, it's actually a relief that someone else is finally the butt of the joke!
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,417
    I always find it a bit jarring the way he handles the poor chap. Bond to me comes off as a bit of a dick with the way he dismisses him. We see Bond tip lots of people in lots of situations and yet here he gives a quip and dismisses the guy. How would this scene play if it's a woman bell hop?

    Bond in FRWL has a male bell hop

    Bell Hop "anything else sir?"
    Bond "No just this" (slides money in the jacket pocket)
    Bell Hop (looking at the tip) "Thank you sir."
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    edited July 2020 Posts: 8,216
    I think there's a distinction to be made for the scene in TMWTGG considering we know Bond has nothing to give the boy and he is in the middle of a life or death situation. He didn't have much choice.
  • Posts: 5,993
    I'll go with Solitaire. Yes, I know it was in the cards, but still.... Rather creepy, if you ask me.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,483
    TMWTGG
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,249
    Gerard wrote: »
    I'll go with Solitaire. Yes, I know it was in the cards, but still.... Rather creepy, if you ask me.

    Not really, she'd already seen that card and didn't tell Mr. Big. She knew what was coming and played along anyway. The way he does it may be questionable, but she'd made up her mind way before they meet.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,774
    [Yes I took that as her commitment to the opportunity to leave Mr. Big. Prepared for the consequences of losing her gift, and explaining why she didn't express anger at being "tricked".]
  • edited July 2020 Posts: 1,009
    thedove wrote: »
    I always find it a bit jarring the way he handles the poor chap. Bond to me comes off as a bit of a dick with the way he dismisses him. We see Bond tip lots of people in lots of situations and yet here he gives a quip and dismisses the guy. How would this scene play if it's a woman bell hop?

    Bond in FRWL has a male bell hop

    Bell Hop "anything else sir?"
    Bond "No just this" (slides money in the jacket pocket)
    Bell Hop (looking at the tip) "Thank you sir."

    Indeed, and even more being Moore's Bond.
    So, yes, I'm voting MR.
  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 2,841
    I’m surprised that no one has brought up the Mary Goodnight - Andrea Anders hotel room scene from TMWTGG. After Bond and Miss Anders share a little (well you know) time together, Bond promises Goodnight that “her time will come!” Even as a teenager, that scene always struck me as being wrong. And now, I always hope for the re-edit where Goodnight claims “well, I met this great guy in Brooklyn last week, so…… 😊”

    Now, given @dove’s selected choices, I’ll pick:

    James takes away the "power" of Solitaire by duping her with a stacked deck of cards from LALD

    Oddly the Dink scene from GF has never really upset me. Maybe, because that scene comes across as playful and not egoistical.
  • Posts: 928
    James doesn't show paternal instincts and shoves boy off his boat from TMWTGG
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    Posts: 3,262
    James rescues Camille and leaves her unconscious at a yacht club from QOS
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,417
    It is interesting @Dwayne I had lots of potential scenes from TMWTGG to choose from. Besides the boat scene, there is the hotel one that you mention. I could have also put the twisting Anders arm scene (but refrained from all women abuse scenes since we've dealt with them). I have come to realize that Bond in TMWTGG does some very un-Bondian things. Maybe this plays into him wanting to hunt down Scaramanga and not caring who or what gets in his way.
  • marcmarc Universal Exports
    edited July 2020 Posts: 2,610
    marc wrote: »
    Baja? I haven't got anything in Baja!

    Ken Adam for his fantastic sets! With John Barry as an honourable second.
    Exactly what I was thinking when I read that! :P
    :--)

    vote goes to LALD
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited July 2020 Posts: 6,287
    Gerard wrote: »
    I'll go with Solitaire. Yes, I know it was in the cards, but still.... Rather creepy, if you ask me.

    Not really, she'd already seen that card and didn't tell Mr. Big. She knew what was coming and played along anyway. The way he does it may be questionable, but she'd made up her mind way before they meet.

    When Bond turns over the first "lovers" card in NY, it's genuine. Solitaire knows what her future holds.

    Not only is it creepy, but Bond didn't need to stack the deck.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,359
    I reject the idea that he's ever been a gentleman spy, but of the choices I think there's only the Solitare's stacked deck one. None of the other choices are anywhere close to this because it's date rape! Pushing a boy who has been swimming in a river back into that river isn't anywhere close to tricking a very young woman into sex by exploiting her faith. If that one doesn't win I'll be very concerned for the academy! :)
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,359
    Dwayne wrote: »
    I’m surprised that no one has brought up the Mary Goodnight - Andrea Anders hotel room scene from TMWTGG. After Bond and Miss Anders share a little (well you know) time together, Bond promises Goodnight that “her time will come!” Even as a teenager, that scene always struck me as being wrong. And now, I always hope for the re-edit where Goodnight claims “well, I met this great guy in Brooklyn last week, so…… 😊”

    The bit where he puts her in the cupboard and makes her listen to him shagging Anders is pretty twisted too! There's something really wrong with Bond in LALD and TMWTGG: in the latter he's even a bit pathological about hunting down and killing Scaramanga even though the guy hasn't done anything to Bond or Britain. I think Guy Hamilton must've been in a bad place in the early 70s...
    Thank heavens Roger Moore was playing 007 otherwise I think he might have come across as properly unlikable!
    Can someone explain the MR Brazil bit further? All he says is "Really? Don't bother showing me the rest. If I get lost I'll take a cab." And we often don't see Bond tipping the bell hop on screen.

    I think the film itself is more homophobic than Bond in that sequence: Bond comes across as weirdly rude although I think he's trying to be charming, but the film presents us with a standard UK 70s sitcom OTT camp character for no reason at all really. I think it's supposed to be funny just that he's camp? And why is he British? It's a very odd little scene and I'm not really sure what they're trying to do with it.
  • edited July 2020 Posts: 7,507
    I am struck by how many potential nominees I would have liked to add to this list. They might have featured in awards already, but I'd still like to mention some of them, as they deserve some attention in regards to this topic:

    • Bond tells Quarrel to "fetch his shoes" in DN
    • Bond smacks Tania around in FRWL
    • Bond forces himself upon Pussy in GF
    • Bond blackmails Patricia for sexual sevices in TB, "I suppose my silence could have a prize"
    • Bond Strangles a girl with bikini straps in DAF
    • Bond beats Andrea in TMWTGG
    • Bond hides Goodnight in the closet all night while having sex with Andrea, also in TMWTGG
    • Bond is shocked that Dr Goodhead could be a woman in MR
    • Bond sleeps with Colombo's wife in FYEO
    • Bond sneaks in unanounced on a previous child prostitute and sex trade victim in SF

    Some of these are worse than any of the nominees in my opinion.

    Of the nominees I'll go with Solitaire

  • Posts: 7,507
    I think there's a distinction to be made for the scene in TMWTGG considering we know Bond has nothing to give the boy and he is in the middle of a life or death situation. He didn't have much choice.

    Which begs the question; what were the writers thinking when they added the boy to the scene in the first place? For what purpose? Was it supposed to be funny? I find it quite disturbing to be honest...
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