Bond Movie A vs. Bond Movie B (Diamonds Are Forever vs. The World Is Not Enough)

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Comments

  • Posts: 1,497
    What's the source on that review BAIN?
  • edited June 2012 Posts: 11,189
    Its Dark Horizons. The writer is a big Bond fan.

    http://www.darkhorizons.com/reviews/622/Quantum-of-Solace

    Here's his review for CR:

    http://www.darkhorizons.com/reviews/143/Casino-Royale
  • Posts: 533
    People don't dislike it because it's "not a normal Bond film", they dislike it because its irratically paced, poorley edited, rushed and has a number of unanswered questions.


    What unanswered questions? My only complaints with "QoS" were the fast pacing and the Paul Greengrass style editing in the movie's first half; and the additions of Strawberry Fields and Elvis as useless characters. Other than that, I had no problems with this movie.


    If I were to choose between "QoS" and "MR", I would choose "QoS".
  • edited June 2012 Posts: 11,189
    DRush76 wrote:
    People don't dislike it because it's "not a normal Bond film", they dislike it because its irratically paced, poorley edited, rushed and has a number of unanswered questions.


    What unanswered questions? If I were to choose between "QoS" and "MR", I would choose "QoS".

    Well Mr White for one. We never heard from him after Tosca.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,173
    MR

    The score, the places Bond travels to, the Bond girls, the nostalgic factor (though that isn't a fair argument here, I know).
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Quantum of Solace! Opera Scene alone blows Moonraker out of the water.
  • Posts: 1,497
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Its Dark Horizons. The writer is a big Bond fan.

    http://www.darkhorizons.com/reviews/622/Quantum-of-Solace

    Here's his review for CR:

    http://www.darkhorizons.com/reviews/143/Casino-Royale

    Thanks! I'll check it out. Always good to get a well-written review from a bonafide Bond fan.
  • Posts: 533
    Well Mr White for one. We never heard from him after Tosca.

    What is there to know? He survived and continued working for Quantum. He was the one who got away.
  • Posts: 165
    BAIN123 wrote:
    People don't dislike it because it's "not a normal Bond film", they dislike it because its irratically paced, poorley edited, rushed and has a number of unanswered questions.


    Could not (respectfully) dissagree more. Trust me, if QoS had more zippy one liners, more babes that were shagged, more double entedres, and generally less depth of character, then people would have forgotten, or at least forgiven, the pacing, editing and run time. The same way they seem to forgive all of MR flaws because its a "fun" film.
  • Posts: 11,189
    DRush76 wrote:
    Well Mr White for one. We never heard from him after Tosca.

    What is there to know? He survived and continued working for Quantum. He was the one who got away.

    Yeah but we were promised more - we never had it.
  • Posts: 533

    Yeah but we were promised more - we never had it.


    You blamed the movie for THAT? Blame Jesper Christensen. He was the one who decided that he didn't want to make another Bond movie. It's tough shit.
  • edited June 2012 Posts: 11,189
    Grinderman wrote:
    BAIN123 wrote:
    People don't dislike it because it's "not a normal Bond film", they dislike it because its irratically paced, poorley edited, rushed and has a number of unanswered questions.


    Could not (respectfully) dissagree more. Trust me, if QoS had more zippy one liners, more babes that were shagged, more double entedres, and generally less depth of character, then people would have forgotten, or at least forgiven, the pacing, editing and run time. The same way they seem to forgive all of MR flaws because its a "fun" film.

    Well CR has less one liners than we're used to, strips away a lot of the "silly" stuff and focuses more on an "deeper" narrative but is better received because its better made, has a more complete story arc as well as more memorable, competently shot action scenes.
  • edited June 2012 Posts: 172
    Quantum of Solace.
    Strong plot and best Bond vs parody of Star Wars and terrible special effects.
    And Tosca, and Arnold's score.

    And of course, FIELDS!
  • Posts: 533
    Well CR has less one liners than we're used to and strips away a lot of the "silly" stuff but is better received because its better made, has a more complete story arc as well as more memorable, better shot action scenes.


    "CASINO ROYALE" didn't have a more complete story arc. It's story arc was completed in "QUANTUM OF SOLACE".
  • edited June 2012 Posts: 11,189
    DRush76 wrote:
    Well CR has less one liners than we're used to and strips away a lot of the "silly" stuff but is better received because its better made, has a more complete story arc as well as more memorable, better shot action scenes.


    "CASINO ROYALE" didn't have a more complete story arc. It's story arc was completed in "QUANTUM OF SOLACE".

    Really, what happened to Quantum? This organisation that we'd been teased about in CR?

    Royale felt like a fully rounded film with a story that had been carefully written and lifted from Fleming. Quantum felt very disjointed. Action scenes were thrust in to fill holes. That's what I meant.

    And another thing, Bond finding his "Quantum of Solace" by persuing a group called Quantum? Nah!!
  • JWPepperJWPepper You sit on it, but you can't take it with you.
    Posts: 512
    Quantum Of Solace, Moonraker comes very, very close. Why does Qos win? Because it's really down-to-earth and realistic, MR is not.
  • Posts: 165
    BAIN123 wrote:
    DRush76 wrote:
    Well CR has less one liners than we're used to and strips away a lot of the "silly" stuff but is better received because its better made, has a more complete story arc as well as more memorable, better shot action scenes.


    "CASINO ROYALE" didn't have a more complete story arc. It's story arc was completed in "QUANTUM OF SOLACE".

    Really, what happened to Quantum? This organisation that we'd been teased about in CR?

    And that's another thing, Bond finding his "Quantum of Solace" by persuing a group called Quantum? Nah!!


    Bond found his solace not by pursuing Quantum or by killing a lot of bad guys, but by learning the truth about Vesper. In the end, he learns she did not betray him and that his love was not misplaced, but that she had acted to save his life because she truly loved him as well.

    He spends the entire film blinded by a need for revenge and feelings of shame for having been "played" by Vesper so thouroughly (or so he thinks at the time), only to find redemption and some measure of peace in the end.

    Of course, the love of his life is still dead and the organization that effectively killed her is still around, thus his resolution is only a "quantum" of solace.

    It's a wonderful, moving story arc (that obviously began in CR), and the first time any Bond film tried to address such a subject.



  • Posts: 1,492
    i am abit surprised that QoS is anywhere near MR. DAD is a better comparison with MR.

    I love MR it was the second one I saw in the cinema but it does drive off the cliff about three times.

    QoS is for adults. I have argued its merits numerous times so I wont do so here. QoS it is.
  • BAIN123 wrote:
    DRush76 wrote:
    Well Mr White for one. We never heard from him after Tosca.

    What is there to know? He survived and continued working for Quantum. He was the one who got away.

    Yeah but we were promised more - we never had it.

    For the 1000th time (not mad at you Bain)- the blame for almost all of QOS' ills solely rest on the writer's union. Some blame can go to EON for hiring Bourne units regarding action similarities but any and all plot holes are the result of an unfinished script.

    DRush76 wrote:
    Yeah but we were promised more - we never had it.


    You blamed the movie for THAT? Blame Jesper Christensen. He was the one who decided that he didn't want to make another Bond movie. It's tough shit.


    If money and timing are right, and EON wants the character back, Christensen will be back. He's backpedaled on those comments so he can still get that payday. Money talks, BS walks.

  • edited June 2012 Posts: 11,189
    Grinderman wrote:
    BAIN123 wrote:
    DRush76 wrote:
    Well CR has less one liners than we're used to and strips away a lot of the "silly" stuff but is better received because its better made, has a more complete story arc as well as more memorable, better shot action scenes.


    "CASINO ROYALE" didn't have a more complete story arc. It's story arc was completed in "QUANTUM OF SOLACE".

    Really, what happened to Quantum? This organisation that we'd been teased about in CR?

    And that's another thing, Bond finding his "Quantum of Solace" by persuing a group called Quantum? Nah!!


    Bond found his solace not by pursuing Quantum or by killing a lot of bad guys, but by learning the truth about Vesper. In the end, he learns she did not betray him and that his love was not misplaced, but that she had acted to save his life because she truly loved him as well.

    He spends the entire film blinded by a need for revenge and feelings of shame for having been "played" by Vesper so thouroughly (or so he thinks at the time), only to find redemption and some measure of peace in the end.

    Of course, the love of his life is still dead and the organization that effectively killed her is still around, thus his resolution is only a "quantum" of solace.

    It's a wonderful, moving story arc (that obviously began in CR), and the first time any Bond film tried to address such a subject.

    But Quantum played a part in Bond's "Solace". It was them that manipulated Vesper. It was them that controlled everything and ultimately them that made Bond find peace (how he didn't exact revenge by killing Jusef).

    I just don't find the film that satisfying. Granted it has some quite emotional scenes but as a whole it falls flat. The story's muddled, the action is mediocre and the pacing is erratic.

    ...and I'm an adult.
  • MrBondMrBond Station S
    Posts: 2,044
    Easy, the second last on My list against the second best.

    Quantum Of Solace without à doubt!
  • Posts: 533
    If money and timing are right, and EON wants the character back, Christensen will be back. He's backpedaled on those comments so he can still get that payday. Money talks, BS walks.

    Who cares? I don't. You know what? I'm not going to try to change your mind about "QoS". If you didn't like it, you didn't. But I enjoyed it very much, in spite of its flaws. And that is all that matters to ME.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    Despite the many faults it has, Quantum of Solace wins this one easily.
  • edited June 2012 Posts: 3,494
    DRush76 wrote:
    If money and timing are right, and EON wants the character back, Christensen will be back. He's backpedaled on those comments so he can still get that payday. Money talks, BS walks.

    Who cares? I don't. You know what? I'm not going to try to change your mind about "QoS". If you didn't like it, you didn't. But I enjoyed it very much, in spite of its flaws. And that is all that matters to ME.

    I'm just explaining how it works in the entertainment business. And, I happen to like QOS. No need to be rude.

  • Posts: 1,497
    This is interesting (and funny). Worth a look. Watch to the very end for the funniest line...

  • edited June 2012 Posts: 11,189
    JBFan626 wrote:
    This is interesting (and funny). Worth a look. Watch to the very end for the funniest line...


    Oh I've seen that. In fact I was one of the first people to put it on Mi6 :D
  • Posts: 1,492
    JBFan626 wrote:
    This is interesting (and funny). Worth a look. Watch to the very end for the funniest line...


    So those who don't like QoS post an old review by someone who they agree with? Umm
    that's conclusive evidence. Oh, you have convinced me.

    I could find a damning review on each of the Bond films...
  • Posts: 7,653
    JBFan626 wrote:
    This is interesting (and funny). Worth a look. Watch to the very end for the funniest line...


    Now I have to go out and rent HSM 3.:D

  • Posts: 1,497
    actonsteve wrote:
    So those who don't like QoS post an old review by someone who they agree with? Umm
    that's conclusive evidence. Oh, you have convinced me.

    I could find a damning review on each of the Bond films...

    If you read my post above I stated that I prefer QOS over MR. I was merely adding that review because there are some interesting points raised and worthy of discussion. No need for sour grapes.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    MR vs QOS.

    That's a bit like asking if you'd like to have a meal with Timmy Mallet or The Krankies. Both films make me feel embarrassed to be a Bond fan, but if I had a gun to my head, and I couldn't tell them to pull the trigger, i'd pick MR. Only just.
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