Should OHMSS have been made after Thunderball?

2

Comments

  • Posts: 71
    yeah compared to George, Pierce was on the light side...esp in Goldeneye......a new modern version though with Craig in the part would i think be very very good.
  • gaz4007 wrote:
    yeah compared to George, Pierce was on the light side...esp in Goldeneye......a new modern version though with Craig in the part would i think be very very good.

    We kind of got elements of that with CR with the romance and such. I doubt they'll go in that direction again anytime soon. Plus EON isn't for remaking films.
  • edited January 2012 Posts: 401
    Plus EON isn't for remaking films.
    You never know, they might do the YOLT story under a different name, by calling it Shatterhand or something.

  • Posts: 71
    really they have to if they are following the character....it is a huge part of the man after all
  • OHMSS appeared when it should and Lazenby and Hunt were rightly hired. I wished their chemistry worked better, Hunt pulled Lazenby across to advise to reliquish his foolishness of giving up the Bond role, and they worked together in atleast one more film. It did not happen!
  • Posts: 2,341
    This is an interesting discussion.
    OHMSS along with TB and YOLT form the Blofeld Trilogy in the books. The producers would have liked to do OHMSS after TB but too many conflicts arose.

    I think OHMSS is fine where it ended up. I don't think Connery could have pulled it off. He was overweigth, bored and his performance in 1967 YOLT totally uninspired.
    Peter Hunt was promised the directors chair for YOLT but the producers later reneged.
    I doubt that Diana Rigg (my favorite Bond girl) would have been avaliable to do a Bond in 1967. The public was begging for more of the gadgets, extravagant sets, etc in 1967 and I hate to think of how 1967 would have ruined a classic Bond adventure.
    After the "OVER THE TOP" stuff in YOLT, OHMSS (Like FYEO following MR) was like a breath of fresh air.

    Several factors contributed to make OHMSS the classic we all love to this day
    New Bond actor
    Hunt being handed the reigns and his insistence on sticking to the source novel
    Serious love subplot
    Great Girl
    Believable storyline
    Classic Downbeat ending

  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,297
    I also think that Hunt, being gay, handled the absurdity of Bond pretending to be gay but actually seducing beautiful women in a Swiss mountaintop clinic extraordinarily well. Hunt tiptoed just up to the edge without crossing over into camp, save for that one shot of the woman ecstatically eating the banana.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    edited January 2012 Posts: 3,262
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Can you give a quick rundown on Maibaum's 1966 script, i.e., how was it different from the script that was eventually used for the 1969 OHMSS?
    Maibaum went through many rewrites with OHMSS between 1964-1968, but around 1966 the script was around the idea that Blofeld should be Goldfinger's half brother, with Blofeld being played by Gert Fröbe himself, and that Bond kills Blofeld and Bunt at the end by toppling a statue on them. Also, Bond escapes a place with the help of a chimpanzee. And, on top of that, Bond marries Tracy in a truck, with M as best man (or something like that). It's very weird. There was also supposed to be an amphibious Aston Martin à la TSWLM at one point.

    Fascinating. I wonder where the amphibious Aston Martin would've fit into the OHMSS story. Perhaps in the early beach scenes?
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    echo wrote:
    Why was Maibaum working on it for so long? Did they want to turn OHMSS into a movie quickly because the book was a recent bestseller?
    That, and because after Goldfinger, EON was actually planning to film OHMSS (at the end of Goldfinger, it originally said "James Bond will return in On Her Majesty's Secret Service"). The only reason OHMSS wasn't made in '65 was because of Kevin McClory allowing EON to make a film adaptation of Thunderball.

    Despite all the legal drama associated with McClory, I'm glad he came around when he did. Otherwise we wouldn't have either the TB or the OHMSS we have in reality and they're both in my top 5 Bond films.
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Actually, the treatment Maibaum wrote in '64 for OHMSS stuck to the book for the most part, unlike his 1966 screenplay. In the '64 treatment, the reason Bond doesn't resign is because Moneypenny has money on him to be the first one to sleep with Mary Goodnight, and Bond proposes in a Zurich hotel room rather than a barn. Also Blofeld fakes his death, but it's not as bad as it sounds. Campbell's role was more important, as he is given truth serum which makes him give away Bond's identity, then later on, Bond uses the same truth serum on Blofeld to find out his plan.

    Would Tracy still have died at the end in both the 1964 and 1966 screen treatments? Also, are these scripts available online to read?

  • Posts: 401
    Would Tracy still have died at the end in both the 1964 and 1966 screen treatments?
    Yes. None of the scripts have her surviving.
    Also, are these scripts available online to read?
    Not as far as I know. I got all my information from this book: http://www.amazon.com/Making-Her-Majestys-Secret-Service/dp/0984412603/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1327872809&sr=8-1.

  • Roger Moore would have played the chimp.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,716
    craigrules wrote:
    Roger Moore would have played the chimp.

    or Brosnan

    <url>http://screenmusings.org/TheWorldIsNotEnough/pages/TWinE_0117.htm</url>;

  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    edited January 2012 Posts: 3,262
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Would Tracy still have died at the end in both the 1964 and 1966 screen treatments?
    Yes. None of the scripts have her surviving.

    How would she have died in the 1966 treatment since Bond kills Blofeld and Irma with the statue?
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Also, are these scripts available online to read?
    Not as far as I know. I got all my information from this book: http://www.amazon.com/Making-Her-Majestys-Secret-Service/dp/0984412603/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1327872809&sr=8-1.

    I definitely would like to buy that. I'm waiting for either the price to drop or a used copy to become available.

  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Would Tracy still have died at the end in both the 1964 and 1966 screen treatments?
    Yes. None of the scripts have her surviving.

    How would she have died in the 1966 treatment since Bond kills Blofeld and Irma with the statue?

    With all the goofy s**t in that one treatment, I wouldn't be surprised if time travel or the wrath of Genghis Khan were involved.
  • edited February 2012 Posts: 401
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Would Tracy still have died at the end in both the 1964 and 1966 screen treatments?
    Yes. None of the scripts have her surviving.

    How would she have died in the 1966 treatment since Bond kills Blofeld and Irma with the statue?
    From what I remember, Bond and Tracy are in a parked car, Blofeld and Bunt shoot at them while driving by, Bond somehow is able to get out and topple a statue on a moving vehicle, goes back to tell Tracy about the good news, he finds her dead.
    I definitely would like to buy that. I'm waiting for either the price to drop or a used copy to become available.
    Your best bet is the used copy. I bought that book in early 2010 for the same price that it is today, and it hasn't ever went on sale as far as I know. The man who wrote it goes on CBn actually.
  • edited January 2012 Posts: 11,189
    gaz4007 wrote:
    yeah compared to George, Pierce was on the light side...esp in Goldeneye......a new modern version though with Craig in the part would i think be very very good.

    We kind of got elements of that with CR with the romance and such. I doubt they'll go in that direction again anytime soon. Plus EON isn't for remaking films.

    Interestingly this is what Graham Rye, editor of the 007 Magazine, apparently said in an interview round about 2002:

    "If I was in control of the franchise I’d cast Pierce Brosnan in a remake of On Her Majesty’s Secret Service and You Only Live Twice (based more on the themes featured in Ian Fleming’s novel), and film them back-to-back in the correct order—if it can be done with Lord of the Rings, I’m sure it can be achieved with Bond. Both On Her Majesty’s Secret Service and You Only Live Twice mean next-to-nothing to today’s cinemagoers, so I don’t see a problem with remakes being accepted by the general public who make up the majority of the paying audience. Some Bond fans may balk at the idea of meddling with Peter Hunt’s classic OHMSS like it’s the Holy Grail, but I think that would be denying the possibility of another great Bond film, rather like saying why on earth are they remaking The Thomas Crown Affair, they can’t possibly top the original McQueen/Dunaway version – well didn’t they just!"

    I'd say he's right about Majesty's meaning "next to nothing" with the public but wrong about YOLT. I thought that film was/is fairly popular.
  • BAIN123 wrote:
    gaz4007 wrote:
    yeah compared to George, Pierce was on the light side...esp in Goldeneye......a new modern version though with Craig in the part would i think be very very good.

    We kind of got elements of that with CR with the romance and such. I doubt they'll go in that direction again anytime soon. Plus EON isn't for remaking films.

    Interestingly this is what Graham Rye, editor of the 007 Magazine, apparently said in an interview round about 2002:

    "If I was in control of the franchise I’d cast Pierce Brosnan in a remake of On Her Majesty’s Secret Service and You Only Live Twice (based more on the themes featured in Ian Fleming’s novel), and film them back-to-back in the correct order—if it can be done with Lord of the Rings, I’m sure it can be achieved with Bond. Both On Her Majesty’s Secret Service and You Only Live Twice mean next-to-nothing to today’s cinemagoers, so I don’t see a problem with remakes being accepted by the general public who make up the majority of the paying audience. Some Bond fans may balk at the idea of meddling with Peter Hunt’s classic OHMSS like it’s the Holy Grail, but I think that would be denying the possibility of another great Bond film, rather like saying why on earth are they remaking The Thomas Crown Affair, they can’t possibly top the original McQueen/Dunaway version – well didn’t they just!"

    I'd say he's right about Majesty's meaning "next to nothing" with the public but wrong about YOLT. I thought that film was/is fairly popular.

    YOLT is extreamly well known to audiences. Of all the films it's the one Austin Powers choose to parody the most. That must say something about it's status as a classic.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    edited January 2012 Posts: 3,262
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Would Tracy still have died at the end in both the 1964 and 1966 screen treatments?
    Yes. None of the scripts have her surviving.

    How would she have died in the 1966 treatment since Bond kills Blofeld and Irma with the statue?
    From what I remember, Bond and Tracy are in a parked car, Blofeld and Bunt shoot and them while driving by, Bond somehow is able to get out and topple a statue on a moving vehicle, goes back to tell Tracy about the good news, he finds her dead.

    That doesn't sound very good. I wonder if EON would've risked going for a "non-commercial" ending in the 1964-1967 Bondmania era full of UNCLE, Helm and Flint like imitators.
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    I definitely would like to buy that. I'm waiting for either the price to drop or a used copy to become available.
    Your best bet is the used copy. I bought that book in early 2010 for the same price that it is today, and it hasn't ever went on sale as far as I know. The man who wrote it goes on CBn actually.

    I don't understand why the cheapest used copy available on Amazon costs $87.04 when the new one sells for $50.00? :-S :?
  • edited January 2012 Posts: 11,189
    BAIN123 wrote:
    gaz4007 wrote:
    yeah compared to George, Pierce was on the light side...esp in Goldeneye......a new modern version though with Craig in the part would i think be very very good.

    We kind of got elements of that with CR with the romance and such. I doubt they'll go in that direction again anytime soon. Plus EON isn't for remaking films.

    Interestingly this is what Graham Rye, editor of the 007 Magazine, apparently said in an interview round about 2002:

    "If I was in control of the franchise I’d cast Pierce Brosnan in a remake of On Her Majesty’s Secret Service and You Only Live Twice (based more on the themes featured in Ian Fleming’s novel), and film them back-to-back in the correct order—if it can be done with Lord of the Rings, I’m sure it can be achieved with Bond. Both On Her Majesty’s Secret Service and You Only Live Twice mean next-to-nothing to today’s cinemagoers, so I don’t see a problem with remakes being accepted by the general public who make up the majority of the paying audience. Some Bond fans may balk at the idea of meddling with Peter Hunt’s classic OHMSS like it’s the Holy Grail, but I think that would be denying the possibility of another great Bond film, rather like saying why on earth are they remaking The Thomas Crown Affair, they can’t possibly top the original McQueen/Dunaway version – well didn’t they just!"

    I'd say he's right about Majesty's meaning "next to nothing" with the public but wrong about YOLT. I thought that film was/is fairly popular.

    YOLT is extreamly well known to audiences. Of all the films it's the one Austin Powers choose to parody the most. That must say something about it's status as a classic.

    Maybe he means the books in which case I'd agree. Most people know about the hollowed out volcano but few know about the Castle of Death.
  • Am I the only one who would welcome a modern-day adaption/remake of OHMSS and YOLT starring Daniel Craig. As has been said before, it's a big part of who 007 is, and could fully-flesh Craig's 007. Maybe do a Thunderball-esque first film (but not another Thunderball remake) , and then the two remakes.

    The original movies are just there, you can't touch them, they are cinema history, whether good or bad. But i'd love to see Craig's interpertation of the novels. The franchise is distorted as it is, and we can't really talk of a 'Bond canon' as such, because the movies contradict eachother. So why shouldn't we be open to Bond remakes in the reboot era? Especialy with a talent like Craig as 007.

    Some people are probably going to damn me for this, but so be it! This is what I believe, what's your opinion?
  • yes they remake movies after a few yrs now nothing wrong with Bond having a few.
  • Posts: 12,526
    No remakes for Bond! We get enough of that with Batman, Superman, Spiderman! We are also getting Xmen Origins stories and possibly fantastic 4 reboot!!! We are in a Bond reboot too!

    That's more than enough! Bond films do not need this to happen! 50 years of success should tell you this?
  • edited February 2012 Posts: 401
    That doesn't sound very good. I wonder if EON would've risked going for a "non-commercial" ending in the 1964-1967 Bondmania era full of UNCLE, Helm and Flint like imitators.
    They should have. It would have shown Bond was a trendsetter, not a trend follower. Having Tracy die without any repercussions for Blofeld in OHMSS would have probably surprised people, but in a good way. Considering the last 4 films before it had the main villain(s) die at the end, having Blofeld and Bunt just get away with murder (Bond's wife no less!) would have been shocking.
  • Remakes? No..just no. Once they start remaking movies they've already made, you know the series has run out of ideas and needs to end.
  • edited February 2012 Posts: 401
    Remakes? No..just no. Once they start remaking movies they've already made, you know the series has run out of ideas and needs to end.
    Because no Bond film has ever been a carbon copy of another film *coughTSWLMcough*

  • edited February 2012 Posts: 205
    Dr_Metz wrote:
    Remakes? No..just no. Once they start remaking movies they've already made, you know the series has run out of ideas and needs to end.
    Because no Bond film has ever been a carbon copy of another film *coughTSWLMcough*

    Sure, the Bond movies are known to take plot elements from previous entries. There's a difference between having a similar plot and actually remaking something with exactly the same characters and scenes though. I meant actually redoing the movies one-to-one. Like just taking thunderball and shoving Craig into it and calling in "the thunderball" or something.
  • I don't know.... a remake like that would be kind of cool and fitting I think. Although in reality the movies came out awesome, it's a plain fact that it's always irritated the piss out of anyone who's read the novels in order I think
  • edited February 2012 Posts: 205
    The problem with remakes is that they'd just keep doing them. If they have the bright idea of remaking say..FRWL they probably would just remake all of the 60s/70s movies until we'd end up in an endless cycle of remaking the same movies over and over again whenever they decide to "reboot" the franchise. It's the easiest thing to do because "Hey, did you like FRWL? HA we know you did..so here it is AGAIN and as a bonus we're throwing in a Craig free of charge. This way you can watch your favorite movie again without having to look uncool by liking something from the 60s" I'd be fine with taking the books and making Moonraker again as it was written though..except don't call it moonraker.


  • Posts: 12,526
    Why would Eon spend hundreds of millions of dollars on a remake? There are creative writers for a very good reason! The money is better spent on a new episode to the Bond series!
  • DB5DB5
    Posts: 408
    You do not remake a James Bond movie! Period! End of discussion! have absolutely no desire to see Daniel Craig (or any other actor) remake OHMSS, or FRWL, or GF. If I want to see those films I'll borrow them from the public library or watch them on television.
  • edited March 2012 Posts: 1,082
    No. The reason Blofeld and Bond don´t recognize each other must be because they both lost the brain cells responsible for the memory of each other. Or that they changed actors between YOLT and OHMSS.
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