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Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • w2bondw2bond is indeed a very rare breed
    Posts: 2,252
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    Also in OP, when Octopussy tries to get Bond to join her, "I'm not for hire" and the scene that follows! And when Bond is trying to convince the General about the bomb, i think Moore is really great here! Still say OP is Moores finest hour as Bond!

    Couldn't agree Moore (do you see what I did there?)

    In the PTS he is absolutely classic Rog throughout right up to 'Fill her up please'.

    He carries that through the early Sotheby's and India scenes and you think you're just getting a standard Rog film. But then it turns on the death of Vijay who is one of one the most amiable Bond allies and Rog seems to take it pretty hard. Once things gets to Germany and the stakes escalate he plays it deadly seriously (gorilla suit apart), the scene with Orlov where he appears horrified at the plan, coldly killing Grishka (no trademark quip just 'And thats for 009'), his exasperation at the various members of the German public he encounters and the idiot on the gate at the base.

    And then we have the piece de resistance, Hitchcockian in its black humour and absurdity, of a desperate Bond dressed as a clown trying to convince the disbelieving general.

    The reason I consider OP's bomb sequences to be possibly the most suspenseful of the series is down to Rog selling it superbly. This is Roger Moore FFS, the most relaxed, most unflappable man that ever lived. If he's looking visibly worried then you'd better believe things are getting pretty serious. Brilliant stuff.

    Thank you. Most people don't even acknowledge this when ranking OP down the bottom
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    w2bond wrote: »
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    Also in OP, when Octopussy tries to get Bond to join her, "I'm not for hire" and the scene that follows! And when Bond is trying to convince the General about the bomb, i think Moore is really great here! Still say OP is Moores finest hour as Bond!

    Couldn't agree Moore (do you see what I did there?)

    In the PTS he is absolutely classic Rog throughout right up to 'Fill her up please'.

    He carries that through the early Sotheby's and India scenes and you think you're just getting a standard Rog film. But then it turns on the death of Vijay who is one of one the most amiable Bond allies and Rog seems to take it pretty hard. Once things gets to Germany and the stakes escalate he plays it deadly seriously (gorilla suit apart), the scene with Orlov where he appears horrified at the plan, coldly killing Grishka (no trademark quip just 'And thats for 009'), his exasperation at the various members of the German public he encounters and the idiot on the gate at the base.

    And then we have the piece de resistance, Hitchcockian in its black humour and absurdity, of a desperate Bond dressed as a clown trying to convince the disbelieving general.

    The reason I consider OP's bomb sequences to be possibly the most suspenseful of the series is down to Rog selling it superbly. This is Roger Moore FFS, the most relaxed, most unflappable man that ever lived. If he's looking visibly worried then you'd better believe things are getting pretty serious. Brilliant stuff.

    Thank you. Most people don't even acknowledge this when ranking OP down the bottom

    All you ever hear is 'It's shit because Bond is in a clown suit. Fleming would never do this.'

    Maybe Fleming wouldn't, but it is what elevates that final scene to brilliant black farce where you think Bond might not actually get there in time. If he'd just run in in his red shirt it wouldn't have had the same level of suspense.

    That said had the bomb gone off Bond would have had serious questions to answer at the inquiry (conducted at the pearly gates of course) about how much time he spent on getting his clown make up spot on even down to the little tears on his cheeks. Then again he could justify it by saying security was on full alert so his disguise had to be spot on or he never would've managed to get inside the tent.
  • GBFGBF
    Posts: 3,197
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    w2bond wrote: »
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    Also in OP, when Octopussy tries to get Bond to join her, "I'm not for hire" and the scene that follows! And when Bond is trying to convince the General about the bomb, i think Moore is really great here! Still say OP is Moores finest hour as Bond!

    Couldn't agree Moore (do you see what I did there?)

    In the PTS he is absolutely classic Rog throughout right up to 'Fill her up please'.

    He carries that through the early Sotheby's and India scenes and you think you're just getting a standard Rog film. But then it turns on the death of Vijay who is one of one the most amiable Bond allies and Rog seems to take it pretty hard. Once things gets to Germany and the stakes escalate he plays it deadly seriously (gorilla suit apart), the scene with Orlov where he appears horrified at the plan, coldly killing Grishka (no trademark quip just 'And thats for 009'), his exasperation at the various members of the German public he encounters and the idiot on the gate at the base.

    And then we have the piece de resistance, Hitchcockian in its black humour and absurdity, of a desperate Bond dressed as a clown trying to convince the disbelieving general.

    The reason I consider OP's bomb sequences to be possibly the most suspenseful of the series is down to Rog selling it superbly. This is Roger Moore FFS, the most relaxed, most unflappable man that ever lived. If he's looking visibly worried then you'd better believe things are getting pretty serious. Brilliant stuff.

    Thank you. Most people don't even acknowledge this when ranking OP down the bottom

    All you ever hear is 'It's shit because Bond is in a clown suit. Fleming would never do this.'

    Maybe Fleming wouldn't, but it is what elevates that final scene to brilliant black farce where you think Bond might not actually get there in time. If he'd just run in in his red shirt it wouldn't have had the same level of suspense.

    That said had the bomb gone off Bond would have had serious questions to answer at the inquiry (conducted at the pearly gates of course) about how much time he spent on getting his clown make up spot on even down to the little tears on his cheeks. Then again he could justify it by saying security was on full alert so his disguise had to be spot on or he never would've managed to get inside the tent.

    I also never bothered the clown disguise itself so very much, however, I found that it took away the tension a little bit since - as you said - Bond seems to have enough time to put on a perfect clown make up. So well he seems to have enough time and that is exactly what you should not indicate id you want to keep a scene tense and suspensefull. They could have made it better. First show that Bond has to hide somewhere. Second show how he rushs into the circus caravan and just put on something, let's say a mask. Show that he is in a hurry all the time. That would be fine.
  • IGUANNAIGUANNA
    Posts: 1,296
    Maybe this is a controversial opinion so I will put it here, I don't really mind the title track to Die Another Day, yes it has some iffy lyrics but aside that it had a good modern production, interesting interupted strings, and a nice ominous opening. As a one off diversion I think it works. In my opinoni it's far from the worst Bond theme.
  • GBFGBF
    Posts: 3,197
    IGUANNA wrote: »
    Maybe this is a controversial opinion so I will put it here, I don't really mind the title track to Die Another Day, yes it has some iffy lyrics but aside that it had a good modern production, interesting interupted strings, and a nice ominous opening. As a one off diversion I think it works. In my opinoni it's far from the worst Bond theme.

    I am OK with most of the Bond songs. Die Another day is not really bad, it just does not fell very Bondian. However, I must admit that it fits the overall film quiet well. In all other films I would have said that the song is completely out of place but since DAD is such a bizarre film it quiet works. And well of course it also somehow fits to a torture scene :-)

    I have a similar feeling about Another way to die. This song is more or less universially hated and I can see why. But I guess as a standalone rock song it is quiet OK. Again it has hardly any Bondian style but for the gritty and revenge focused film it is in it quiet works for me.
  • w2bondw2bond is indeed a very rare breed
    Posts: 2,252
    IGUANNA wrote: »
    Maybe this is a controversial opinion so I will put it here, I don't really mind the title track to Die Another Day, yes it has some iffy lyrics but aside that it had a good modern production, interesting interupted strings, and a nice ominous opening. As a one off diversion I think it works. In my opinoni it's far from the worst Bond theme.

    I confess - I listen to DAD more than a few other title songs. Not because I like it, but because it is catchy and you can bop your head to it. It's still one of the worst, alongside OP and WOTW.

    My controversial choice is AWTD. It sits just above the above in my ranking because of the lyrics. The melody/instrumental itself is very Bondian and even opens and closes on the Bond theme motifs
  • Mathis1Mathis1
    Posts: 7,419
    I have to defend OP theme. I love it, always have, written by Tim Rice and sang by Rita Coolidge, I think its a really catchy theme! Its played quite a bit on the radio too!
    DAD is atrocious. An utter tuneless din! I was never a fan of Madonna but I did think she would come up with something better than this!
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    That's really my problem with All Time High, it's a nice song but sounds like a standard ballad you'd hear on an easily listening radio station. I don't think it has a lot of power to it.

  • barryt007barryt007
    Posts: 19,339
    OP is a classy Bond film with a lovely score and scenery,and Sir Rog is a classy Bond...thus endeth the lesson for today ;)
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    I prefer the score to the title song.

    Apparently Rita Coolidge described it as unfinished.
  • GBFGBF
    Posts: 3,197
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I prefer the score to the title song.

    Apparently Rita Coolidge described it as unfinished.

    I also like it. I guess it fits very well to the overall romantic tone of the film. Octopussy is a very romantic and elegant ballad. I guess it fits very well to an elderly Roger Moore and his romance with Octopussy. Its melody is also used very well throughout the film.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,120
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.

    I saw her in Tattoo. She was awful. But she did get her norks out so every cloud...
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I agree on Maud. Classy looking lady and she's aged nicely.

    Regarding title songs, the only ones I absolutely can't stand are WotW (my #1 stinker), FYEO & TWINE.

    I can tolerate AWTD, DAD & OP.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    edited September 2016 Posts: 3,996
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.

    She's certainly a fine looking woman in Octopussy but I don't think her acting was that great in it.

    The way she delivers that line (can't remember exactly what she says) when she storms away from Bond when he refuses to stay at the palace, caused my wife who was reading to look up from her book and exclaim "God, what a sh*t actress!"
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited September 2016 Posts: 11,189
    To be honest I don't think she's a particularly special actress but, as others have said, she has an elegance that's appropriate for Bond.
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.

    She's certainly a fine looking woman in Octopussy but I don't think her acting was that great in it.

    The way she delivers that line (can't remember exactly what she says) when she storms away from Bond when he refuses to stay at the palace, caused my wife who was reading to look up from her book and exclaim "God, what a sh*t actress!"


    "I have no country...no price on my head"

    Is that the line you are thinking of?
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited September 2016 Posts: 9,117
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.

    She's certainly a fine looking woman in Octopussy but I don't think her acting was that great in it.

    The way she delivers that line (can't remember exactly what she says) when she storms away from Bond when he refuses to stay at the palace, caused my wife who was reading to look up from her book and exclaim "God, what a sh*t actress!"

    Yep. She's really not a good actress.

    How about 'Give me that' in TMWTGG? Terrible.

    To be honest there's only Honor Blackman, Diana Rigg, Carole Bouqet, Sophie Marceau, Eva Green and Lea Seydoux who are good actresses to have played Bond girls.

    There's quite a few competent ones and a whole lot of terrible ones.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,996
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    To be honest I don't think she's a particularly special actress but, as others have said, she has an elegance that's appropriate for Bond.
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.

    She's certainly a fine looking woman in Octopussy but I don't think her acting was that great in it.

    The way she delivers that line (can't remember exactly what she says) when she storms away from Bond when he refuses to stay at the palace, caused my wife who was reading to look up from her book and exclaim "God, what a sh*t actress!"


    "I have no country...no price on my head"

    Is that the line you are thinking of?

    Yeah, that's it! :-S
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited September 2016 Posts: 23,883
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    How about 'Give me that' in TMWTGG? Terrible.
    This always brings a smile to my face when I watch that scene. So exaggerated, but she's such a looker in that robe that I always find a way to forgive her.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    To be honest I don't think she's a particularly special actress but, as others have said, she has an elegance that's appropriate for Bond.
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    One thing that always elevates a Moore Bond film for me is Maud Adams. Such a graceful actress, I wonder if she ever got a prominent role in a non-Bond film. I must say I haven't seen her in anything else.

    She's certainly a fine looking woman in Octopussy but I don't think her acting was that great in it.

    The way she delivers that line (can't remember exactly what she says) when she storms away from Bond when he refuses to stay at the palace, caused my wife who was reading to look up from her book and exclaim "God, what a sh*t actress!"


    "I have no country...no price on my head"

    Is that the line you are thinking of?

    Yeah, that's it! :-S

    Yes I remember thinking that line seemed too mannered.
  • Mathis1Mathis1
    Posts: 7,419
    I think Adams and Moore became good friends, so therefore there was some chemistry between them iby the time OP was made! She certainly not the best actress,or Bond girl, but she's not the worst either!
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited September 2016 Posts: 28,694
    Man, I love "All Time High." I think the Moore era was the best for catchy music that stuck with you.

    I know some hate "If You Asked Me To" being used as LTK's credits song as well, but I've never minded that one either. It's corny, but it's a perfect song if you view it from the perspective of the many Bond girls who've fallen for James over the years.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    I like If You Ask me To. Yes it does sound very 80s but Patti Labelle's voice is powerful and emotional.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,120
    I don't think there is anything wrong with sounding very 80's. The whole Manhunter soundtrack is definitely very 80's and it's still one of my favourite scores.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    How anyone can not like two of the greatest ballads ever, sung by the possibly two best female black singers ever, Patti and Gladys, IS BEYOND ME, really!!!
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    How anyone can not like two of the greatest ballads ever, sung by the possibly two best female black singers ever, Patti and Gladys, IS BEYOND ME, really!!!

    Aretha Franklin, Nina Simone, Etta James, Billie Holiday, and Whitney Houston would like a word with you!
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    How anyone can not like two of the greatest ballads ever, sung by the possibly two best female black singers ever, Patti and Gladys, IS BEYOND ME, really!!!

    Aretha Franklin, Nina Simone, Etta James, Billie Holiday, and Whitney Houston would like a word with you!

    I said possibly.
  • jobojobo
    Posts: 7,507
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    How anyone can not like two of the greatest ballads ever, sung by the possibly two best female black singers ever, Patti and Gladys, IS BEYOND ME, really!!!

    Aretha Franklin, Nina Simone, Etta James, Billie Holiday, and Whitney Houston would like a word with you!


    Not to mention Ella Fitzgerald!!
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    How anyone can not like two of the greatest ballads ever, sung by the possibly two best female black singers ever, Patti and Gladys, IS BEYOND ME, really!!!

    Aretha Franklin, Nina Simone, Etta James, Billie Holiday, and Whitney Houston would like a word with you!

    I said possibly.

    I was just making a joke point.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    How anyone can not like two of the greatest ballads ever, sung by the possibly two best female black singers ever, Patti and Gladys, IS BEYOND ME, really!!!

    Aretha Franklin, Nina Simone, Etta James, Billie Holiday, and Whitney Houston would like a word with you!

    I said possibly.

    I was just making a joke point.

    Me too. But I promised Mr B not to use emoticons again.
    I miss them though.
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