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It is surely the best way to see Las Vegas as it was in 1971: from the comfort of your home and without the smells, the regrets, the dented bank accounts, and the nauseous mornings-after. Unless that also describes your home...
"James Bond: James Bond is a blunt instrument wielded by a Government Department. He is quiet, hard, ruthless, sardonic, fatalistic". Ian Fleming.
I think the writing of Bond in CR the film adheres to this vision. The parkour sequence IMO is one of the best chase sequences in film history.
"In his relationships with women he shows the same qualities as he does in his job, but he has a certain gentleness with them and if they get into trouble he is sometimes prepared to sacrifice his life to rescue them. But not always, and certainly not if it interferes with his job. He likes gambling and fast motor cars." Ian Fleming.
Again, a perfect fit with CR the film.
I understand fine, I just don't buy it. It was @GBF making the points, with you chipping in with a bit of back up vitriol. Most of it reads as deliberate subterfuge to mask a wider dislike, because the arguments themselves suggest you've overreached yourselves with this one. Too much incoherent scratching around for evidence to stack up the point, when in reality it just boils down to the fact some of you retrospectively hate the concept of rookie Bond. It smacks of those kids who ditch a band as soon as everyone else buys into them.
Well I mentioned a few arguments why I don't like the parkour scene as much as I used to and I even mentioned the positive elements (cinematography, stunt work). I also mentioned that I am not a big fan of the Bond becoming Bond concept since it just went on too long. I like the idea of Bond earning the 00 status in the PTS and I would have liked to see a rookie Bond afterwards. But FOR MY PERSONAL TASTE it is just a bit too edgy and ruthless in the first hour of CR. Dalton has edgy and ruthless moments as well in the first half of TLD but I find it was a bit more balanced showing a bit more variety in his characterisation of Bond. As I said I like CR from train sequnece onwards very much. However, it is you who simply does not accept any argument against CR.
I fail to see how CR 2006 doesn't reflect all this perfectly.
Bond IS edgy and ruthless.
"The simple fact is that, like all fictional heroes who find a tremendous popular acceptance, Bond must reflect his own time. We live in a violent era, perhaps the most violent man has known. In our last War, thirty million people were killed. Of these, some six million were simply slaughtered, and most brutally. I hear it said that I invent fiendish cruelties and tortures to which Bond is subjected. But no one who knows, as I know, the things that were done to captured secret agents in the last War says this. No one says it who knows what went on in Algeria". Ian Fleming.
I certainly accept arguments against CR, I just don't accept that it's artificial and moronic in concept. It's a film Bond fans should be proud of and should be defended imo. I'm not the guardian of opinion, you can deconstruct it or slam it all you want and I'll defend it if I feel like the arguments are transparent. I feel much the same way with GF. Weirdly maligned amongst certain fans.
For the record, my comment about masking a wider dislike was not aimed at you personally. Sure you have your reasons, however odd I find them.
True. But IMO they apply even more to CR. The loss of Vesper, the brutal more emotional Craig, the torture scene, etc etc. After DAD it was such a breath of fresh air. But I'm not going to criticise your opinions of a rookie Bond, thats your opinion.
Great quote. Self-indulgent is Bond down to a tee. I do think though that, while Bond may not be likeable as such, he is still portrayed as admirable. We are on his side and want him to succeed. I get the sense that although Fleming himself never intended Bond to be likeable the public liked him anyway and maybe saw him as more heroric than he actually was.
Incidentally, I know someone online who disagrees with Fleming and finds the original character very likeable.
Plain is how I'd describe Fleming's Bond, actually quite bland. I find it interesting how several of the novels feature long sections without Bond even there.
I'm a big fan but I do agree the first act isn't great. I like the chase but the stuff in the Caribbean and Miami drags.
Where CR stumbles a bit for me personally is in its third act. Don't get me wrong, Bond and Vesper's relationship is wonderfully developed and the tragic ending is effective, but the film's pacing grinds almost to a halt and loses all the momentum it's built up to that point.
"If there was one post I'd disagree with the most, it would be this one."
I know, I know, I've been like this for a long time.
I personally believe that CR is almost above reproach. It is the following films where the cracks have appeared in Craigs tenure.
I firmly believe that two or three films in a row that demonstrate the same tone is too much. If you look at the Connery or even Moore era's, they ran the gamut of every type of Bond film.
I'l give some examples
FRWL-GF
YOLT-OHMSS
TMWGG-TSWLM
MR-FYEO
And these are all featuring the same actor in each shift, I think when we can go fun and spectacular to serious in a heartbeat, that is Bond. Too much of either is a bad thing.
That has probably much to do with a shift towards another director....
Well people might have different tastes. I would never say CR is shit or a bad Bond film but I like it less than other members here. I find it quite boring if everyone has the same opinion about a certain Bond film. I would even say that there is no perfect Bond film and think it is interesting to discuss the positive and negative elements in all theses films...
I agree, some people have poor taste.
;)
Your arguments are largely platitudinous. One can find fault with CR, the way one can find fault with any film, but your exercise in relentless deconstruction is as transparent as it is silly. There are no doubt points that you've raised that I can completely understand, but most are buried under the vitriol and grandstanding.
Overall, I can't see the reason to criticize this sequence so heavily, especially since it's so tension filled. The only part that seems blatantly OTT is when Bond broke into the Embassy, and especially his move at the end which could have backfired.
Rookie.
This is sort of the point really. If we're to view every single sequence through a magnifying glass, where do we end up? If a sequence errs on the side of boredom, your mind wanders, but even KKBB admitted that it was only once he'd 'seen the light' that he'd retrospectively decided to trash it. The whole sequence is perfect action filmmaking; great pace, choreography, cinematography, sound design, score, acting... and unlike most action scenes it doesn't exist for the sake of it, it's setting up and pushing the narrative forward.
This is sort of the point really. If we're to view every single sequence through a magnifying glass, where do we end up? If a sequence errs on the side of boredom, your mind wanders, but even KKBB admitted that it was only once he'd 'seen the light' that he'd retrospectively decided to trash it. The whole sequence is perfect action filmmaking; great pace, choreography, cinematography, sound design, score, acting... and unlike most action scenes it doesn't exist for the sake of it, it's setting up and pushing the narrative forward. [/quote]
That is fine and I appreciate your view. Just respect that other members don't like it as much as you do. I mean most action sequences in the franchise are great from a purely technical point of view. But that does not mean that everyone has to like the respective concept. There are quite many people who don't like the tank chase in GE or the volcano battle in YOLT, even though these sequences are certainly made very well and loved by the majority of Bond fans.