Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • Posts: 11,189
    Some thoughts on the series

    Judi Dench is one of the worst things to happen to the series

    I don't mean to sound rude but ARE YOU INSANE!!!!

    :p

    She's Judi Dench for crying out loud

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Some thoughts on the series

    Judi Dench is one of the worst things to happen to the series

    I don't mean to sound rude but ARE YOU INSANE!!!!

    :p

    She's Judi Dench for crying out loud

    Dench is awesome; I love her as M. She is a great M and it was a stroke of genius to give her that role. She added a lot to the franchise.
  • Posts: 1,052
    I thought the whole M is a woman thing was a bit of a novelty in GE and it worked but from TWINE onwards the character has just been awful and ridiculous!
  • Posts: 4,813
    Agreed. Pierce should have had the opportunity to work with a male M at least once- be it Robert Brown or someone else.

    Here's one for you:
    Watched TMWTGG last night and I still don't like it!!
  • Posts: 12,837
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Some thoughts on the series

    Judi Dench is one of the worst things to happen to the series

    I don't mean to sound rude but ARE YOU INSANE!!!!

    :p

    She's Judi Dench for crying out loud

    I like Dench, but I think the way she was used in QOS was one of the worst things to happen to the series.

    TWINE: Ok cool, Dench is being used more, she's a good actress and it hasn't been done before, why not?

    DAD: She's still being used more than usual, that's fine. Makes sense because of the whole thing in North Korea.

    CR: Well, I suppose it's rookie Bond, she is going to have trouble trusting him. It'll probably be back to normal next time.

    QOS: JUDI I DON'T CARE IF YOU DON'T TRUST HIM! JUST LET HIM GET ON WITH IT AND GET BACK BEHIND YOUR DESK!

    Like I've said before, I'm looking forward to Skyfall and I can see it being great but unless they put a fresh spin on it somehow then I'm not looking forward to having M be overused again.
  • Posts: 11,189
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.
  • Posts: 6,601
    Its just that I don't remember any of the male M's, but I do remember Judi from the beginning. But maybe in your opnion, M shouldn't be an important part - just give the orders and be done with?
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    The trouble with Dench is that as they have a legendary actress in the role they think they must give her a load more lines. Just let her dish out the mission like Bernard used to. Why do we have to have her on the phone or popping up on location literally every 5 mins?
    I reckon if you add up her screen time in CR and QOS alone its probably more than Bernard had in his entire tenure as M.
  • Posts: 6,601
    The trouble with Dench is that as they have a legendary actress in the role they think they must give her a load more lines. Just let her dish out the mission like Bernard used to. Why do we have to have her on the phone or popping up on location literally every 5 mins?
    I reckon if you add up her screen time in CR and QOS alone its probably more than Bernard had in his entire tenure as M.

    But that is why he is so unmemorable. Is it really written in stone, that this character has to be more or less invisible? I thought, then Dench relaionship with both - Pierce and Daniel was so much more fun and an addition to the series.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited April 2012 Posts: 15,713
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.

    Just because she's Judi Dench doesn't mean she can never be irritating or give a bad performance..... IMO she was good in GE and in TND, and from TWINE onwards when the psycho-babble took over Dench has been appalling.
  • Posts: 11,189
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.

    Just because she's Judi Dench doesn't mean she can never be irritating or give a bad performance..... IMO she was good in GE and in TND, and from TWINE onwards when the psycho-babble took over Dench has been appalling.

    Dench can't give a bad performance.
  • Posts: 12,837
    Germanlady wrote:
    Its just that I don't remember any of the male M's, but I do remember Judi from the beginning. But maybe in your opnion, M shouldn't be an important part - just give the orders and be done with?

    That's right. I did think it was good in TWINE because it was original then but I'm tired of it now. I don't mind M having a bigger role once in a while but film after film the character has been overused now.
    BAIN123 wrote:
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.

    Just because she's Judi Dench doesn't mean she can never be irritating or give a bad performance..... IMO she was good in GE and in TND, and from TWINE onwards when the psycho-babble took over Dench has been appalling.

    Dench can't give a bad performance.

    IMO QOS and a little bit CR was a bad performance.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,713
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Dench can't give a bad performance.

    She has.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Germanlady wrote:
    But that is why he is so unmemorable.

    Hmm. The Wizard is an English gentleman so cannot insult a lady as I would 007RogerMoore or DaltonCraig.

    The point is that Bond should be on his own with the security of Blighty, and often the whole world resting on his shoulders. He shouldnt be able to just phone up M whenever things are getting a bit sticky - he should have to rely on his wits to get him out of a scrape. Similarly M should not be able to track his every movement by GPS.

    If I was writing SF I would have the villain smash Bonds phone much like Orlov does the Faberge egg in the opening act and sever this tiresome umblicial cord. Daniel doesnt need it and its only there to give Dench a bigger part.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    Posts: 3,262
    Germanlady wrote:
    But that is why he is so unmemorable.

    Hmm. The Wizard is an English gentleman so cannot insult a lady as I would 007RogerMoore or DaltonCraig.

    The point is that Bond should be on his own with the security of Blighty, and often the whole world resting on his shoulders. He shouldnt be able to just phone up M whenever things are getting a bit sticky - he should have to rely on his wits to get him out of a scrape. Similarly M should not be able to track his every movement by GPS.

    If I was writing SF I would have the villain smash Bonds phone much like Orlov does the Faberge egg in the opening act and sever this tiresome umblicial cord. Daniel doesnt need it and its only there to give Dench a bigger part.

    Well put, TWOI. No one's denying Dame Judi's acting chops but many of us are tiring of the "world's greatest secret agent and his mom" approach to the Bond adventures.

  • Posts: 11,189
    Germanlady wrote:
    But that is why he is so unmemorable.

    Hmm. The Wizard is an English gentleman so cannot insult a lady as I would 007RogerMoore or DaltonCraig.

    The point is that Bond should be on his own with the security of Blighty, and often the whole world resting on his shoulders. He shouldnt be able to just phone up M whenever things are getting a bit sticky - he should have to rely on his wits to get him out of a scrape. Similarly M should not be able to track his every movement by GPS.

    If I was writing SF I would have the villain smash Bonds phone much like Orlov does the Faberge egg in the opening act and sever this tiresome umblicial cord. Daniel doesnt need it and its only there to give Dench a bigger part.

    Well put, TWOI. No one's denying Dame Judi's acting chops but many of us are tiring of the "world's greatest secret agent and his mom" approach to the Bond adventures.

    I agree WOI. I LOVE Dench as M but, thinking about it, I'd prefer more of a GE/TND approach this time round where she gets a couple of good scenes and then leaves. Unfortunately I don't think its going to happen.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I agree WOI. I LOVE Dench as M but, thinking about it, I'd prefer more of a GE/TND approach this time round where she gets a couple of good scenes and then leaves. Unfortunately I don't think its going to happen.


    On the contrary - I think this one could see more M than Bond. If we're not careful the series will soon be Lethal Weapon with the new M played by Danny Glover.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    Posts: 3,262
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I agree WOI. I LOVE Dench as M but, thinking about it, I'd prefer more of a GE/TND approach this time round where she gets a couple of good scenes and then leaves. Unfortunately I don't think its going to happen.


    On the contrary - I think this one could see more M than Bond. If we're not careful the series will soon be Lethal Weapon with the new M played by Danny Glover.

    Does that mean Craig will grow a monster mullet? B-)
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.

    Just because she's Judi Dench doesn't mean she can never be irritating or give a bad performance.....

    The same is true of Roger Moore. In MR, FYEO and OP. Well, and sometimes in LALD.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,713
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.

    Just because she's Judi Dench doesn't mean she can never be irritating or give a bad performance.....

    The same is true of Roger Moore. In MR, FYEO and OP. Well, and sometimes in LALD.

    I never said Sir Rog can't make bad performances.... he just hasn't made any in his career yet ;)

  • Posts: 1,082
    BAIN123 wrote:
    I was getting a little irritated by her in QoS too but still, SHE'S JUDI DENCH.

    Just because she's Judi Dench doesn't mean she can never be irritating or give a bad performance.....

    The same is true of Roger Moore. In MR, FYEO and OP. Well, and sometimes in LALD.

    You must be kidding! Roger Moore's performance in MR is IMO the best perfomance of any actor in any movie, and his performance in OP is just behind. He is great in LALD and FYEO too.

  • edited April 2012 Posts: 4,813
    best perfomance of any actor in any movie

    lol Jesus! I wouldn't go that far! ;)
  • edited April 2012 Posts: 1,082
    best perfomance of any actor in any movie

    lol Jesus! I wouldn't go that far! ;)

    Both Moore and MR are out of this world. I honestly think that Moore should have won an oscar for MR.
  • Posts: 6,601
    Germanlady wrote:
    But that is why he is so unmemorable.

    Hmm. The Wizard is an English gentleman so cannot insult a lady as I would 007RogerMoore or DaltonCraig.

    The point is that Bond should be on his own with the security of Blighty, and often the whole world resting on his shoulders. He shouldnt be able to just phone up M whenever things are getting a bit sticky - he should have to rely on his wits to get him out of a scrape. Similarly M should not be able to track his every movement by GPS.

    If I was writing SF I would have the villain smash Bonds phone much like Orlov does the Faberge egg in the opening act and sever this tiresome umblicial cord. Daniel doesnt need it and its only there to give Dench a bigger part.

    Thanks, but I have opened myself up to being treated like a member not a Lady ;)

    But - in the end, you said the same as I did, just with other words. M as you guys want him IS not important, more or less just sending Bond on his mission and to never or only once appear again. This is, what makes him unmemorable for me. Nothing wrong with it neither and if you want that approach, I can understand, that Dench M is something of an annoying evil making room for itsself more and more.
    I believe in this - to enjoy it - people should forget she is M and let her be part of the plot. Otherwise I fear - with that opinion about her role - many here might have less fun and that would be sad.
  • Posts: 11,425
    Germanlady wrote:
    Its just that I don't remember any of the male M's, but I do remember Judi from the beginning. But maybe in your opnion, M shouldn't be an important part - just give the orders and be done with?

    There was basically only one significant M before Dench - Bernard Lee. He defined M and he had a relationship with Bond that was a bit headmasterly. I loved him.

    Judi's M has definitely been overwritten. I'm frankly sick of her character and the constant questioning of Bond's loyalties/abilities/priorities. It's not Dench's fault. The writers have again and again felt that they need to big up her role. I'd question whether that has added much to the films. My view is that it's undermined Bond's centrality to the stories. I am seriously worried about Skyfall mainly because it promises to have more annoying over-exposure of M.

    Craig even said in a recent interview that Dench usually gets left in the studio and Skyfall lets her get out and about more - just what I didn't want to hear!
  • Posts: 1,548
    Rosa Klebb is dead sexy!
  • edited April 2012 Posts: 6,601
    Getafix wrote:
    Germanlady wrote:
    Its just that I don't remember any of the male M's, but I do remember Judi from the beginning. But maybe in your opnion, M shouldn't be an important part - just give the orders and be done with?

    There was basically only one significant M before Dench - Bernard Lee. He defined M and he had a relationship with Bond that was a bit headmasterly. I loved him.

    Judi's M has definitely been overwritten. I'm frankly sick of her character and the constant questioning of Bond's loyalties/abilities/priorities. It's not Dench's fault. The writers have again and again felt that they need to big up her role. I'd question whether that has added much to the films. My view is that it's undermined Bond's centrality to the stories. I am seriously worried about Skyfall mainly because it promises to have more annoying over-exposure of M.

    Craig even said in a recent interview that Dench usually gets left in the studio and Skyfall lets her get out and about more - just what I didn't want to hear!

    She already said that for CR. And you really feel, it takes anything away from Bond? I can't see how? Like I said - why not just see her as just a character, that adds to the plot? Why hang on so much to the old picture of M sitting behind his/her desk, not allowing that character to change? Would it be different for you, if it was Felix for example questioning his loyalty?

    To me and I am not sure, its a female thing, the tension between a macho man like Bond and a female Boss is much more interesting then having a male boss...its fun to see her crack his pride or whatever, give him the time of the day etc...
  • edited April 2012 Posts: 4,813
    best perfomance of any actor in any movie
    lol Jesus! I wouldn't go that far! ;)
    Both Moore and MR are out of this world. I honestly think that Moore should have won an oscar for MR.

    I know, Dustin Hoffman robbed him in 1979, lol
  • edited April 2012 Posts: 11,425
    Germanlady wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    Germanlady wrote:
    Its just that I don't remember any of the male M's, but I do remember Judi from the beginning. But maybe in your opnion, M shouldn't be an important part - just give the orders and be done with?

    There was basically only one significant M before Dench - Bernard Lee. He defined M and he had a relationship with Bond that was a bit headmasterly. I loved him.

    Judi's M has definitely been overwritten. I'm frankly sick of her character and the constant questioning of Bond's loyalties/abilities/priorities. It's not Dench's fault. The writers have again and again felt that they need to big up her role. I'd question whether that has added much to the films. My view is that it's undermined Bond's centrality to the stories. I am seriously worried about Skyfall mainly because it promises to have more annoying over-exposure of M.

    Craig even said in a recent interview that Dench usually gets left in the studio and Skyfall lets her get out and about more - just what I didn't want to hear!

    She already said that for CR. And you really feel, it takes anything away from Bond? I can't see how? Like I said - why not just see her as just a character, that adds to the plot? Why hang on so much to the old picture of M sitting behind his/her desk, not allowing that character to change? Would it be different for you, if it was Felix for example questioning his loyalty?

    To me and I am not sure, its a female thing, the tension between a macho man like Bond and a female Boss is much more interesting then having a male boss...its fun to see her crack his pride or whatever, give him the time of the day etc...

    It was fine to start with but IMO has been overused. I'm now bored of this supposedly 'interesting' tension. I'd like to see a film where M's faith in Bond is unquestioning and Bond's loyalty and professionalism taken completely for granted. For me, returning to a more traditional Bond-M relationship would at this stage actually be more radical/interesting.

    In the Empire article this month apparently Mendes is saying they're taking Bond out of his comfort zone. As another poster pointed out, it's a long time since we actually saw Bond in his comfort zone.
  • Posts: 6,601
    best perfomance of any actor in any movie
    lol Jesus! I wouldn't go that far! ;)
    Both Moore and MR are out of this world. I honestly think that Moore should have won an oscar for MR.

    I know, Dustin Hoffman robbed him in 1979, lol

    ..and I was working at the hotel bar, where he was before he took off to the Oscar show. I wished him luck...
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