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Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,106
    A bit like DAD when I saw it at the cinema.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    Yes, a more recent example.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,106
    I thought the franchise was done for then. really thought I had watched the Batman&Robin of James Bond.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    OnlyManWhoCan wrote: »
    Speaking of soundtracks... I genuinely love the score from Goldeneye. I think the cold metal sound effects and synths perfectly compliment the film's story and tone, given that it's dealing with Old Russia vs New Russia and the internet/modern technology.

    I will concede that the original score for the tank chase - 'A Pleasant Drive in St Petersburg' - is absolutely horrific and I am glad the scene was re-score by something more traditional.

    Oh, and Éric Serra's 'Experience of Love' is also the drippiest bit of music to feature on the credits of a Bond movie (and that's saying something).

    And yet, despite these crimes against Sound itself, I still like the overall score and think the Goldeneye overture, played during the PTS, perfectly captures the mood of this new era of 007.

    I would probably agree with you there. Take out the aforementioned Experience of Love (so dreary its like Rory Kinnear in musical form), the dismal oil drum banging that is the GB and the 70's porn music in the car chase and I don't mind it all.

    Absolutely agree with everything.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,149
    Thanks, guys.
    I now have The Experience of Love stuck in my head and I'm humming it in an obnoxious whispery tone.
    Controversial opinion: well not really an opinion, but curiosity- would If There Was A Man have worked as the main title track to TLD? Especially after the dialogue in the PTS.
    Interesting thought- but am glad it turned out as it did.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,883
    I'm perfectly fine with the entire GE soundtrack as it is. I'd change nothing. Experience of Love is a travesty, but at least it's somewhat inoffensively inserted at the end of the film where its damage is minimized. One can always turn it off at that point without having missed anything.

    As I've said before, I have not problem whatsoever with the much lambasted scratching "Ladies First". I credit Serra with being a little daring, and its playful nature fits the scene and sexual flirtatiousness of Famke's Onatopp. She uses sex as a weapon after all.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Agreed. Well said.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,108
    I'm glad to see some Serra appreciation among fans. As you know, I'm a big fan. Even of the end credits song and Ladies First. Though even I have to admit the tank chase is better of with Altman's rendition.

    Anyway, came here for something else entirely.
    Gave Moonraker a rewatch and astonishingly enough I had a better time than with my last viewing of The Spy Who Loved Me.

    Rog is great in both, but I like both villain and Bond girl better. The soundtrack is one of Barry's best and definitely an improvement over Spy's. The cinematography and set design are pretty much on par, but Moonraker does look a tad better I think.

    At the moment, my favourite Moore outings are two of his most despised: The Man with the Golden Gun and Moonraker.
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    edited July 2017 Posts: 1,165
    Probably not super controversial, but purely from a storyline perspective, TWINE had the potential to be the best Bond film since OHMSS, but it was let down by a shabby script and subpar directing.

    DAD gets a lot of flack, but TWINE is the most frustrating of Brosnan's films for me because I can picture what it could have been.
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    I love the Tom Jones Thunderball theme song but after hearing Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang by Basseg I wish that movie used it instead of Thunderball.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,730
    How many people actually like the goldeneye score?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    JamesBondKenya wrote: »
    How many people actually like the goldeneye score?
    I love it. I especially like "A Little Surprise For You" which is the track in question during the Tiger theft.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited July 2017 Posts: 11,189
    I like most of it too. Always felt it gave the film more atmosphere.
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    JamesBondKenya wrote: »
    How many people actually like the goldeneye score?

    I like the gunbarrel music, title theme, and the Goldeneye Overture, but the rest is genuinely terrible.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I love the GE Score too. I wouldn't mind having Serra do another score, Bring John Altman along too. ;)
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    edited July 2017 Posts: 7,108
    JamesBondKenya wrote: »
    How many people actually like the goldeneye score?

    I love all of it. Favourite non-Barry Bond soundtrack.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Controversial opinion: although I liked the fight on the train in SP, I never want to see another indestructible henchman ever again.

    As soon as Bautista (who was very charismatic in the role), was cast, it was a step backwards. A further step into the Moore-territory.

    I'd much rather see Bond battle "real" and desperate men, like Slate and Obanno (and his henchman).
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    peter wrote: »
    Controversial opinion: although I liked the fight on the train in SP, I never want to see another indestructible henchman ever again.

    As soon as Bautista (who was very charismatic in the role), was cast, it was a step backwards. A further step into the Moore-territory.

    I'd much rather see Bond battle "real" and desperate men, like Slate and Obanno (and his henchman).

    tenor.gif
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    @BMW_with_missiles , I'm not sure to take your gif as you agree with me, or; mocking my comment; if it's the latter, then, oh well, I guess...

    It's my opinion that Bond, whether SC vs Grant, or DC vs the above, seems in real danger against real men. When Bond is against Hans, Jaws, Bautista-types, we know he's a-ok and we watch the tropes play out like a WWE fight.

    Fighting Slate is fresh.
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    peter wrote: »
    @BMW_with_missiles , I'm not sure to take your gif as you agree with me, or; mocking my comment; if it's the latter, then, oh well, I guess...

    It's my opinion that Bond, whether SC vs Grant, or DC vs the above, seems in real danger against real men. When Bond is against Hans, Jaws, Bautista-types, we know he's a-ok and we watch the tropes play out like a WWE fight.

    Fighting Slate is fresh.
    @peter
    It wasn't quite mocking so much as it was criticism in jest. Realism bores me. I want escapism. Though I do immensely enjoy SC vs Grant.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    fair enough, @BMW_with_missiles ; don't you also enjoy the CR stairwell fight scene (to me, akin to the novel GF, where Bond ruminates the ugliness of his business)?; or the wild fight vs Slate? I don't find these fight scenes boring, do you?
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    peter wrote: »
    fair enough, @BMW_with_missiles ; don't you also enjoy the CR stairwell fight scene (to me, akin to the novel GF, where Bond ruminates the ugliness of his business)?; or the wild fight vs Slate? I don't find these fight scenes boring, do you?

    The fight with Slate I find so unremarkable that I have little memory of it, much like the entirety of QOS. The CR stairwell fight is a good one, but whenever Craig-Bond begins "ruminating on the ugliness of the business" it detracts from the film for me. I like when Bond seems to be enjoying the adrenaline rush of his job, not when he's brooding about it. I do realize that this is the antithesis of Fleming's Bond, but I guess that's why I have more fun with the entries that stray farther from the source material. That said, in my last ranking of the films, I did have CR as high as 4th.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    I get where you're coming from @BMW_with_missiles ... That's not my kinda Bond, but I get where your roots are,and I still do enjoy these types of 007 adventures,
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,106
    peter wrote: »
    Controversial opinion: although I liked the fight on the train in SP, I never want to see another indestructible henchman ever again.

    As soon as Bautista (who was very charismatic in the role), was cast, it was a step backwards. A further step into the Moore-territory.

    I'd much rather see Bond battle "real" and desperate men, like Slate and Obanno (and his henchman).

    My controversial counter opinion: Hinx is far more believable as a menace and far more menacing than Jaws. So I'm very happy with him. Also glad he was not another poor man's Grant.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited July 2017 Posts: 11,189
    Hinx was largely played straight, whereas Jaws was comic relief. He was a nod to the henchmen of old but also wouldn't be out of place in a Christopher Nolan film.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    I don't deny he was played straight, I just like the visceral execution of two, well-trained enemies, fighting for their life, a la CR and QoS.

    The Hinx fight, although well shot and choreographed, takes me out of the film a little. It's a little too WWE for my tastes.

    I like to see the desperate battle with two "real" men-- drives the tension up. Both are getting cracked, bones smashed and they both bleed.

    The Hinx fight, with no blood, was a cartoon battle compared to the earlier DC films. Hinx was the dominating force, unharmed, even by fire (twice), knocking the crap out of the hero, but, it was too one way, there was no tension; we all know Bond would somehow win.

    But, in the earlier films, the fights were such a desperate struggle; there was an equal amount of give and take. They were well staged/performed, violent and visceral, and even as Bond was the victor, he was pretty mashed up, despite his best efforts.

    I don't have to see another unshakeable henchmen in Bond again (I love my Odd-Jobs and Jaws', but they're too much of another era to be believable in the present day)
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    I remember the audience I was with in the first screening I saw of SP applauded after the fight.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited July 2017 Posts: 9,117
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I remember the audience I was with in the first screening I saw of SP applauded after the fight.

    I'd lay a sizeable wager they didn't applaud after that?
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,767
    To me the Hinx fight was focused, intense, and brutal in a compelling way. Its best element is communicating a fit and capable Bond simply running out of steam against an unstoppable freight train of an opponent. It's actually pretty humorless until the final moments.
    Perfect for a Bond film. But they should mix it up over time, sure.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,106
    If you think about Grant himself was pretty much an unbreakeable henchman. Hinx remained serious throughout and that's good enough for me. I actually prefer him to how they depicted Oddjob in the movie.
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