A View to a Kill. Let's make it better!

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  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,344
    I guess considering Bond barely visits Chinatown, and when he does it's without Chuck, it is a bit of an odd one! :)

    I do think Bond having two chummy bloke mates in the same film might have felt a bit much though.
    It kind of makes me wonder though, does Bond make any attempt to find a phone once they're at the mine? That would kind of be the sensible thing to do!
  • DeathToSpies84DeathToSpies84 Newton-le-Willows, England
    Posts: 257
    Easy - Have Timothy Dalton debut as James Bond, re-write the script and have a better PTS, keep Max Zorin and May Day, keep Duran Duran’s banger of a theme and find a better Stacy Sutton = a solid debut for the Daltz.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,159
    Decide what story you want you tell. Microchips? Okay. Cheating at horse racing? Okay. Just don't throw it all into one big pot.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,344
    I don’t think cheating at horse racing is a world domination plot any more than Goldfinger's cheating at golf was though.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    Posts: 3,787
    Adapt the short story, have Dalton star in it (his debut would be in FYEO), so it would've been his second or third outing (depends).
  • Bring back Anya from TSWLM. UK and Soviets working together to bring down Zorin who is a thorn in both sides.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,344
    That'd be a cool ending, actually.
  • edited November 2023 Posts: 4,108
    It depends. I think if they wanted Moore as Bond then perhaps they could have leaned more into that ageing Bond/old vs new dynamic that's sort of (but sort of not) there. Hell, I'd argue a different director/cinematographer could have injected a bit more life into the film (I have a soft spot for it, but it has a distinct almost tv movie quality to it that's not quite there with FYEO and OP).

    If Dalton was to come onboard at this point it would have been a slightly different movie I reckon. I don't think his Bond would have come off quite as jaded as he does in TLD (the source material for that film certainly suits it) but I suppose Dalton's more Fleming-esque take on the role would have spurred them on to incorporate more of the material from the short story or at least hold back on some of the more absurd humour. It's debatable whether they'd have felt inclined to cast Jones in order to add some youth/contemporary figures to contrast with an older Bond. They would have been able to lean more into Dalton's physicality so I don't think we would have gotten as many fight scenes with older goons, and they may well have put in the effort at devising a bigger/more elaborate stunts to showcase the new Bond.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,344
    I find it very hard to imagine Dalton in this- when I do it just kind of confirms how lacking in charisma he was compared to Roger. And I think Walken would have blasted him off the screen.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,556
    As Bond and Chuck Lee stroll along the wharf, they discuss Zorin, Mortner, and Zorin's young protégé Nikolai.

    Bond: "What are the chances this 'Diavolo' is also a psychotic?"
    Lee: "There's little info on the guy. All we know is he looks like Willem Dafoe."
    Bond: *executes sideways glare at Chuck Lee*
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    Posts: 3,787
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Adapt the short story, have Dalton star in it (his debut would be in FYEO), so it would've been his second or third outing (depends).

    Clarification regarding this: make it similar to TLD, adapt the short story, then extend it by adding some plot points.
    I'd liked to see Mary Ann Russell on screen and the motorcycle courier being mysteriously killed is an interesting and intriguing premise.
  • edited November 2023 Posts: 4,108
    mtm wrote: »
    I find it very hard to imagine Dalton in this- when I do it just kind of confirms how lacking in charisma he was compared to Roger. And I think Walken would have blasted him off the screen.


    Like I said it would have been a slightly different film with Dalton, even if we had Walken and the basic plot. I do think Dalton would have been quite effective against Walken though, especially in the latter half of that film. He has this much more serious screen presence as Bond which I think would play nicely alongside Walken's more unpredictable take on Zorin. It would have hammered home the horror/insanity of Zorin's actions. I'd say that's kinda how Moore plays it during the latter half of the film anyway (he's much more tongue in cheek during their initial meetings when he's undercover, but even with Dalton we'd have probably gotten a take on the 'I'm a problem eliminator' scene between him and Sanchez in LTK - a bit more serious but essentially Bond 'playing the situation' - which would have worked and may even have enhanced Walken's performance).

    I think if it'd been a young Brosnan then he'd have struggled against Walken. But I think Dalton was seasoned enough an actor to play off of a young Walken.
  • edited November 2023 Posts: 1,324
    mtm wrote: »
    I find it very hard to imagine Dalton in this- when I do it just kind of confirms how lacking in charisma he was compared to Roger. And I think Walken would have blasted him off the screen.

    Roger wasn't in his prime here.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,277
    Add the "From" back.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    mtm wrote: »
    I find it very hard to imagine Dalton in this- when I do it just kind of confirms how lacking in charisma he was compared to Roger. And I think Walken would have blasted him off the screen.

    Roger wasn't in his prime here.

    Wait-- are you positive about this??
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    edited December 2023 Posts: 1,261
    I also like AVTAK despite the flaws.

    Walken is great as Zorin, one of my favourite villains. Grace Jones as May Day is a great hench woman. And Patrick Macnee as Tibbett (at that time I did not know THE AVENGERS, as I was not born or too young, when it aired in West Germany) is wonderul, the on-screen-chemistry between him and Moore is a joy to watch, they really seem to enjoy doing their scenes. John Barry's score is excellent, as is the Duran Duran title son.

    And they decided to ignore Moore's age, but having him bed four women half his age, does not help. And some other actress than Tanya Roberts should have cast as Stacy. The Beach Boys Song, ugh, no! And the silly Police Chief in San Fran... Funny and silly cops are okay, if they are funny. On the other hand, they do not even try to pretend, that Moore's doing his own stunts, you actually see, that it is his stunt double. And the plot is a GF-rip-off.

    Oh, in the German dubbing Dr. Mortner becomes a Polish doctor doing his genetic experiments in Soviet Gulags. Apparently German distributors were shying away from having a German Nazi doctor featurin in such a movie. in DIE HARD, Hans Gruber becomes Jack Gruber in the German version....
  • In hindsight, the Bond 17 storyline is a good basis for a rewrite of AVTAK. A villain who ensures that his microconductors are used by the two countries against whom he intends revenge, allowing him to take remote control of their defence systems.

    For Bond 17, the targeted countries were Britain and China, for AVTAK, considering Zorin's backstory and links with Nazi Germany, it could be Britain (or the US) and the USSR, the two countries he sees as the ones that caused Germany's defeat during WW2.

    Keep the pre-title sequence with Bond discovering the body of 003 in Siberia and recovering a microchip. As in the actual movie, MI6 begins to suspect Zorin Industries of leaking top secret technology to the Soviets, before Bond discovers that Zorin is double-crossing the Soviets and intends to turn both British and Soviet weapon systems against themselves.

    Ideally, such movie would serve as Dalton's debut and could borrow additional elements from Fleming's Moonraker.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    edited December 2023 Posts: 8,195
    I would have Rog resist having cosmetic surgery ; get in a bit better shape, and get a better haircut. At this point his hair was so coiffed into place, at times, it looked like cotton candy.

    Play Bond as a seasoned, but still charming agent with an age appropriate romantic interest.
  • Jwview008Jwview008 Ohio
    Posts: 11
    I would suggest extending the hot tub scene and more of Stacie’s legs
  • I think the best part of the film is the tightly plotted first hour. Once it goes stateside the movie loses its cold war thriller vibe and just descends into the madness.
    Firstly, Zorin playing both sides: this should be focused on more. Maybe Zorin is trying a terrorist attack, maybe he built a flaw in the tech that both services use that he plans to use for his own good (maybe something to make a plane of his crash with world leaders on it). The Russians are in and out too fast for me.
    Secondly, there are too many Bond girls in this film and they appear all at once; making things confusing. Mayday, Pola, and Stacey all "overlap" at times and this dynamic makes the last hour of the film feel crowded. Also, I'd have Tibbett first meet Bond in Paris, and Mayday fail to kill him, so that she at least has less blood on her hands.

    If I had to rewrite the film: Keep the film the same until the attempt on Stacey's life. Stacey is an engineer who reviewed Zorin's proposed plane for either a big detente conference (or maybe a NATO one if the TSWLM vibe will be repeated). They go to Stacey's office, where Zorin's men start to burn all her notes. Bond gets her out, and uses some gadget to trace the vehicle to a Zorin warehouse. Bond and Stacey sneak in, when Zorin and his inner circle (bar Mayday) get in the blimp and fly to start the ransom procedures.
    Then if the climax is kept the same, Zorin's blimp has to get to a specific spot to start the procedures.
    Or if different, we have a fight in the blimp, with Zorin thrown out, and Bond cancels the ransom. For a traditional Roger Moore ending, he forgets to end the radio and gets off with Stacey.
  • JonasTJonasT Washington
    edited March 26 Posts: 10
    Always think there's so much good in this film that it cant be considered bad but cant avoid its not feeling quite right. England, France, America is a bit too samey and the whole thing could have been filmed in one country really save for the Eiffel Tower and Goldengate Bridge.

    I find it a weak remark at the end on the bridge about a cab - something like 'a bridge too far' for Zorin. Self-referencing the struggle due to Bond's age like a weakened Bruce Wayne/Batman in Bale's last film, would just make the trendy opponents that bit more daunting and cooler to prevail over.
  • JonasTJonasT Washington
    edited March 26 Posts: 10
    Having watched the HD highlights videos on youtube to the main theme from films -
    If the cops in San Fran were serious threats and not Keystone Cops-esque it would have gone a long way. And a bit more night somewhere - maybe where Stacey's place is attacked and leading to a discussion about the scenario rather than Bond cooking.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,277
    JonasT wrote: »
    Always think there's so much good in this film that it cant be considered bad but cant avoid its not feeling quite right. England, France, America is a bit too samey and the whole thing could have been filmed in one country really save for the Eiffel Tower and Goldengate Bridge.

    I find it a weak remark at the end on the bridge about a cab - something like 'a bridge too far' for Zorin. Self-referencing the struggle due to Bond's age like a weakened Bruce Wayne/Batman in Bale's last film, would just make the trendy opponents that bit more daunting and cooler to prevail over.

    "I gave him the ax"?

    "Main struck out"?

    "He had the last laugh"?

    "Well, Z is at the end...of the alphabet"?

    "From Golden Gate to Heaven's Gate"?
  • peter wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    I find it very hard to imagine Dalton in this- when I do it just kind of confirms how lacking in charisma he was compared to Roger. And I think Walken would have blasted him off the screen.

    Roger wasn't in his prime here.

    Wait-- are you positive about this??

    He wasn't in his prime in For Your Eyes only, 2 films before!
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    peter wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    I find it very hard to imagine Dalton in this- when I do it just kind of confirms how lacking in charisma he was compared to Roger. And I think Walken would have blasted him off the screen.

    Roger wasn't in his prime here.

    Wait-- are you positive about this??

    He wasn't in his prime in For Your Eyes only, 2 films before!

    I know @Scaramanga1974 . I was responding to Deke’s ever informative knowledge (as in I was being sarcastic)…
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