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Dark Knight. Avengers. Skyfall. Behold the new cliché! (spoiler)

DOUBLEONOELDOUBLEONOEL
edited October 2012 in Skyfall Posts: 11
Watching Skyfall the other night and Silva's escape from MI6 HQ I was amazed to hear the words "Silva wanted to be captured! It was all part of his plan!". Hadn't they seen the Dark Knight? Gary Oldman uttered the same sentiment about the Joker and recently the evil Loki played the same trick on The Avengers. Can't wait to see who'll fall for it next.

Comments

  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,848
    I think they should do a reversal on that for the next bond Film have bond be captured then escape because getting captured was bond....


    Wait Jack Dalton did that lot in macgyver never mind but it should great thing for a film.
  • oo7oo7
    edited October 2012 Posts: 1,068
    A tojan horse scenario has happened in a majority of Bond films, from dr no, goldfinger, OHMSS to name a few. In these of course Bond is the one who allows himself to be taken into the stronghold.

    This is a rather pointless thread it could have been an addition to general skyfall chat
    http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/4130/skyfall-first-reviewsreactions-links-only-spoilers/p30#Item_875
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    DOUBLEONOEL wrote:
    Watching Skyfall the other night and Silva's escape from MI6 HQ I was amazed to hear the words "Silva wanted to be captured! It was all part of his plan!". Hadn't they seen the Dark Knight? Gary Oldman uttered the same sentiment about the Joker and recently the evil Loki played the same trick on The Avengers. Can't wait to see who'll fall for it next.

    was Chris Nolan the first to use this plot device?... No.... will Bond be the last?... No...

  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    Well said Haserot.

  • JamesCJamesC
    Posts: 121
    But it is a good point since it's been used in two big films this year plus TDK - which we all know Mendes was inspired by
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    And why do people always bring Nolan's trilogy up?

    I also agree with what 007 said.
  • JamesCJamesC
    edited October 2012 Posts: 121
    Because Mendes was inspired by it, hence the almost identical line. TDK is relevant to this topic.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    Movie directors have always been inspired by others.

    And the Bondseries have always taken influences from other movies. I don't see the big fuss.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    JamesC wrote:
    But it is a good point since it's been used in two big films this year plus TDK - which we all know Mendes was inspired by

    inspiration only goes so far though - i dont think Mendes set out to replicate Nolan's work... i also think Mendes was equally inspired by some of the earlier Bond films as well (ie: FRWL)
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    And having seen Road To Perdition, Mendes certainly brought his own directing style to SF.
  • JamesCJamesC
    Posts: 121
    For sure, but if there have been comparisons between Silva and The Joker, interrogation, both were dressed as police officers, similar soundtrack etc more than a coincidence.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    Interrogation, how?

    It was more similar to Hannibal Lecter in Silence Of The Lambs. The soundtrack does not sound like Zimmer, but I'm probably totally wrong.
  • JamesCJamesC
    Posts: 121
    I haven't seen the film yet, but the whole villain being interrogated thing. Heck, even the interrogation room in the teaser trailer looks the same as TDK.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited October 2012 Posts: 4,399
    JamesC wrote:
    I haven't seen the film yet, but the whole villain being interrogated thing. Heck, even the interrogation room in the teaser trailer looks the same as TDK.

    i think you mean Bond's interrogation? not Silva's.... and interrogation rooms are not all designed in varying degrees of complexity - they all look similar.. Nolan didn't invent that style...

    Silva in his glass cage i would say is more inspired by Hannibal Lector's cell in Silence Of The Lambs than anything in TDK... and as far as comparisons between Silva and The Joker - i think one could make the same connection between The Joker and about 20 different Bond villains that came before him... again, Nolan invented nothing new (if anything, he ripped off a lot from the Bond franchise, and openly admits using it for inspiration)...

    in terms of the score - i have to concede a bit to that one.. there was a moment or two in the score that i felt sounded almost identical to Zimmer's Batman theme.... but - that is movie music composition as a whole nowadays - you can't simply point to SF and say they are copying Zimmer..... almost every film does it now, and it's a trend that started before Zimmer started doing it..... but since the Chris Nolan films are treated as the Alpha and Omega of filmmaking, i can see where there can be confusion..

  • Pierce2DanielPierce2Daniel
    Posts: 4,409
    It’s a nce touch, however it is very similar to the Dark Knight, which imo did it better than SF. However, it serves a different purpose in SF. Here Silva simply just wants to see M one last time before he kills her, simple. With the joker its more about mind games, he dosent want to kill Batman it just about creating choas. Silva on the other hand has an aim.
  • JamesCJamesC
    edited October 2012 Posts: 121
    HASEROT wrote:
    in terms of the score - i have to concede a bit to that one.. there was a moment or two in the score that i felt sounded almost identical to Zimmer's Batman theme.... but - that is movie music composition as a whole nowadays - you can't simply point to SF and say they are copying Zimmer..... almost every film does it now, and it's a trend that started before Zimmer started doing it..... but since the Chris Nolan films are treated as the Alpha and Omega of filmmaking, i can see where there can be confusion..


    Yep, there were a few instances in the Skyfall score where it does, like you say, sound almost like Batman's theme.

    And the Nolan trilogy is hardly a pinnacle of filmmaking, but what do I know, I think BB is the best of the lot.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    JamesC wrote:
    I think BB is the best of the lot.

    i actually agree with you... it's full of realism, but still maintains a comic book quality about it... TDK is essentially the film HEAT with Batman characters.

  • JamesCJamesC
    Posts: 121
    Yep, I even love the third act with the monorail and Shane Rimmer!
  • DRush76DRush76
    Posts: 533
    DOUBLEONOEL wrote:
    Watching Skyfall the other night and Silva's escape from MI6 HQ I was amazed to hear the words "Silva wanted to be captured! It was all part of his plan!". Hadn't they seen the Dark Knight? Gary Oldman uttered the same sentiment about the Joker and recently the evil Loki played the same trick on The Avengers. Can't wait to see who'll fall for it next.


    God, how unoriginal of EON.

  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    Yeah.

    They should stop making these films. Next time, they'll include sparkling vampires.
  • forgotmyusernameforgotmyusername
    Posts: 2,782
    Yeah that whole escaping from MI6 HQ thing which leads to that cracking chase through the London underground and onto the streets of London...yeah that was really unoriginal EON...boring...... You're sooooooooooooooooooo right messers 00onoel and Rush sooooooooo right.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    forgotmyusername wrote:
    Yeah that whole escaping from MI6 HQ thing which leads to that cracking chase through the London underground and onto the streets of London...yeah that was really unoriginal EON...boring...... You're sooooooooooooooooooo right messers 00onoel and Rush sooooooooo right.

    Bond is no longer relevant.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    Exactly! I mean really? Bond and the villain fighting on a train? Hey EoN Batman Begins called, they want their ideas back!!
  • UnivexUnivex
    Posts: 6,709
    Risico007 wrote:
    Wait Jack Dalton did that lot in macgyver never mind but it should great thing for a film.

    What a WONDERFUL reference! And on that note, Mac rules!
  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,848
    Univex wrote:
    Risico007 wrote:
    Wait Jack Dalton did that lot in macgyver never mind but it should great thing for a film.

    What a WONDERFUL reference! And on that note, Mac rules!

    I created a macgyver thread also including a Macgyver trailer i made would lvoe your thoughts.

  • DOUBLEONOELDOUBLEONOEL
    Posts: 11
    This thread was a comment about predictability not originality. I've not seen this twist used prior to Dark Knight (regardless of who directed that) and to have seen it again in the Avengers and now Skyfall with almost the exact phrasing once the protagonists realised their mistake was amusing. But I think audiences will be wise to it now and rather than making the villain look clever it merely makes the heroes look stupid for underestimating their foe. 'twas just an observation, not making a fuss, I don't want a refund, I'm looking forward to seeing Skyfall many times over the next few months.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,187
    Please continue here. Posts can be copied there. We try to centralise things as much a possible. Thanks for your cooperation!
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