HERE BE SPOILERS - Skyfall Codename Conspiracy

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  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    edited April 2016 Posts: 4,116
    We could throw in CR67 and confuse the h%ll out of everybody :D
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    After the codename theory, CR67 now looks quite sensible. :)
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    After the codename theory, CR67 now looks quite sensible. :)

    If only the same could be said for @Mendes4lyfe!
  • RC7 wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    Theonly instance in which this codename issue even comes close to making sense is with OHMSS, as has been described in this thread. With Lazenby taking over the role, EON seemed to play loose with this change, even allowing Lazenby's Bond to make reference to "the other fella." WTF was that?

    While codename makes little sense, we all have to admit: EON sure did their part with OHMSS to sort of put that out there. It wasn't until 1981, with FYEO, and the gravesite, that EON kind of put that theory to bed* (along with Blofeld as a villain).

    'This never happened to the other fella' is a device known as 'breaking the fourth wall'. Lazenby addresses the audience directly, not in character. It can be seen as a bizarre creative choice, but it has no narrative implications. As I have mentioned previously, later in the film there's the scene where Bond goes through his various possessions from previous missions, which is a deliberate device to show the audience that the fictional character you are watching is the same fictional character from the preceding films.

    So no, I don't have to admit EON put anything out there. They reference Tracy indirectly in TSLWM, explicitly in FYEO and indirectly again in LTK. All small nods to the audience to indicate the fictional character, while portrayed by different actors, is the same man.

    EDIT: Didn't see the above before posting - but glad to see most people understand the fourth wall moment in OHMSS.

    This is your problem. Anything which supports the theory, you have an out of film explanation for, which is missing the point when we're talking about the Bond universe.

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    RC7 wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    Theonly instance in which this codename issue even comes close to making sense is with OHMSS, as has been described in this thread. With Lazenby taking over the role, EON seemed to play loose with this change, even allowing Lazenby's Bond to make reference to "the other fella." WTF was that?

    While codename makes little sense, we all have to admit: EON sure did their part with OHMSS to sort of put that out there. It wasn't until 1981, with FYEO, and the gravesite, that EON kind of put that theory to bed* (along with Blofeld as a villain).

    'This never happened to the other fella' is a device known as 'breaking the fourth wall'. Lazenby addresses the audience directly, not in character. It can be seen as a bizarre creative choice, but it has no narrative implications. As I have mentioned previously, later in the film there's the scene where Bond goes through his various possessions from previous missions, which is a deliberate device to show the audience that the fictional character you are watching is the same fictional character from the preceding films.

    So no, I don't have to admit EON put anything out there. They reference Tracy indirectly in TSLWM, explicitly in FYEO and indirectly again in LTK. All small nods to the audience to indicate the fictional character, while portrayed by different actors, is the same man.

    EDIT: Didn't see the above before posting - but glad to see most people understand the fourth wall moment in OHMSS.

    This is your problem. Anything which supports the theory, you have an out of film explanation for, which is missing the point when we're talking about the Bond universe.

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    I simply have an explanation. Unlike your good self.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.
  • Posts: 9,860
    oddjob you still haven't answered why bond after going rogue and no longer 007 still well James Bond?

    Also do you know how exausting it is to leave flowers at all the cemeteries? It's quite tireing
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,452

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    Well, different people can have different opinions.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    Well, different people can have different opinions.

    Thanks for that philosophical nugget.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    edited April 2016 Posts: 4,116
    RC7 wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    Theonly instance in which this codename issue even comes close to making sense is with OHMSS, as has been described in this thread. With Lazenby taking over the role, EON seemed to play loose with this change, even allowing Lazenby's Bond to make reference to "the other fella." WTF was that?

    While codename makes little sense, we all have to admit: EON sure did their part with OHMSS to sort of put that out there. It wasn't until 1981, with FYEO, and the gravesite, that EON kind of put that theory to bed* (along with Blofeld as a villain).

    'This never happened to the other fella' is a device known as 'breaking the fourth wall'. Lazenby addresses the audience directly, not in character. It can be seen as a bizarre creative choice, but it has no narrative implications. As I have mentioned previously, later in the film there's the scene where Bond goes through his various possessions from previous missions, which is a deliberate device to show the audience that the fictional character you are watching is the same fictional character from the preceding films.

    So no, I don't have to admit EON put anything out there. They reference Tracy indirectly in TSLWM, explicitly in FYEO and indirectly again in LTK. All small nods to the audience to indicate the fictional character, while portrayed by different actors, is the same man.

    EDIT: Didn't see the above before posting - but glad to see most people understand the fourth wall moment in OHMSS.

    This is your problem. Anything which supports the theory, you have an out of film explanation for, which is missing the point when we're talking about the Bond universe.

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    There is no conclusive evidence from movie dialogue or filmmaker interviews to support any codename theory. Lack of continuity or character development does not prove or even strongly suggest any codename plot device.

    All evidence supports that Bond is Bond and that any inconsistency is due to revamping, reinterpretation, and/simple continuity errors.

    Oh and yes the Earth is round.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    Theonly instance in which this codename issue even comes close to making sense is with OHMSS, as has been described in this thread. With Lazenby taking over the role, EON seemed to play loose with this change, even allowing Lazenby's Bond to make reference to "the other fella." WTF was that?

    While codename makes little sense, we all have to admit: EON sure did their part with OHMSS to sort of put that out there. It wasn't until 1981, with FYEO, and the gravesite, that EON kind of put that theory to bed* (along with Blofeld as a villain).

    'This never happened to the other fella' is a device known as 'breaking the fourth wall'. Lazenby addresses the audience directly, not in character. It can be seen as a bizarre creative choice, but it has no narrative implications. As I have mentioned previously, later in the film there's the scene where Bond goes through his various possessions from previous missions, which is a deliberate device to show the audience that the fictional character you are watching is the same fictional character from the preceding films.

    So no, I don't have to admit EON put anything out there. They reference Tracy indirectly in TSLWM, explicitly in FYEO and indirectly again in LTK. All small nods to the audience to indicate the fictional character, while portrayed by different actors, is the same man.

    EDIT: Didn't see the above before posting - but glad to see most people understand the fourth wall moment in OHMSS.

    This is your problem. Anything which supports the theory, you have an out of film explanation for, which is missing the point when we're talking about the Bond universe.

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    There is no conclusive evidence from movie dialogue or filmmaker interviews to support any codename theory. Lack of continuity or character development does not prove or even strongly suggest any codename plot device.

    All evidence supports that Bond is Bond and that any inconsistency is due to revamping, reinterpretation, and/simple continuity errors.

    Oh and yes the Earth is round.

    @mcdonbb is rolling out the heavy artillery. I think it's safe to say that Oddjob no longer has a hat. It's a forensics job.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    Well, different people can have different opinions.

    Hello chaps he's back!

    Did you stumble across any evidence in your wanderings?

    It's been 24hrs now. I really think you should consider reporting it to the police soon.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited April 2016 Posts: 15,723
    I would like to see @Mendes4Lyfe make 3 pages worth of argumentation on how GE takes place after 2000, since Valentin says 'still working for MI6 or have you decided to join the 21st century?'
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,452

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    Well, different people can have different opinions.

    Hello chaps he's back!

    Did you stumble across any evidence in your wanderings?

    It's been 24hrs now. I really think you should consider reporting it to the police soon.

    Tim finally returned your calls then...
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    This may have already been covered but can I just check - is Blofeld a code name too?

    After all there is no plastic surgery in the world good enough to make that scar on Pleasance's face go away and at the end of OHMSS isn't Telly paralysed?

    I assume that after each failed SPECTRE scheme Blofeld is killed and then a new one elected - partly because of failure and partly to keep MI6 confused.

    I've got no evidence to back it up but there's also nothing in the films to prove I'm wrong so I presume you all believe me.

    An alternate theory is that Gray's Blofeld is the real Blofeld, and Pleasence/Savalas' Blofeld are merely doubles.
  • edited April 2016 Posts: 79

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    It is possible that Moore's Bond was good friends with Lazenby's. I have already said this but nobody seems to take much notice.

    You seem to think this absurd enough to dismiss, but don't find DAF's treatment of post Tracy Bond absurd enough to dismiss it's the same person. E.g. Moneypenny asking for a ring.

    That's the double standards going on here


    @mcdonbb agree there is no conclusive evidence. That's why there is a discussion to be had.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    Well, different people can have different opinions.

    Hello chaps he's back!

    Did you stumble across any evidence in your wanderings?

    It's been 24hrs now. I really think you should consider reporting it to the police soon.

    Tim finally returned your calls then...

    I told you. Just because he left flowers at Tim's wife grave, it doesn't mean he met him personally.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2016 Posts: 23,883
    It is possible that Moore's Bond was good friends with Lazenby's. I have already said this but nobody seems to take much notice.
    Good friends with Dalton's too, because Dalton's look at the memory of a lost wife in LTK is quite moving. I suppose we've moved on from the 'mind memory wipe & new memory insertion' concept advocated by @Mendes now? I am just concerned about losing the plot again with all these theories floating about.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117

    It would have been very easy for this theory to be debunked if there had been a scene with Bond discussing Tracy in any of the films, but that simply hasn't happened.

    Some might consider that Bond visiting her grave in FYEO might be sufficient to do that but of course your other account err I mean @Mendes4lyfe has 'proven' that that was merely the new Bond visiting the grave of the wife of Bond of 2 incarnations ago. As you do.

    Well, different people can have different opinions.

    Hello chaps he's back!

    Did you stumble across any evidence in your wanderings?

    It's been 24hrs now. I really think you should consider reporting it to the police soon.

    Tim finally returned your calls then...

    Still waiting.

    I'm starting to feel like Gary Oldman in Leon.

    'Bring me evidence. E V I D E N C E!!!!'
  • @bondjames no mention of 'Tracy' in LTK. No need for it be same wife.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    @bondjames no mention of 'Tracy' in LTK. No need for it be same wife.
    That is a valid point.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    @bondjames no mention of 'Tracy' in LTK. No need for it be same wife.

    Even if they mentioned Tracy, that could also be a codename.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    bondjames wrote: »
    It is possible that Moore's Bond was good friends with Lazenby's. I have already said this but nobody seems to take much notice.
    Good friends with Dalton's too, because Dalton's look at the memory of a lost wife in LTK is quite moving. I suppose we've moved on from the 'mind memory wipe & new memory insertion' concept advocated by @Mendes now? I am just concerned about losing the plot again with all these theories floating about.

    Lazenby's surely been pushed out of the back of a Bedford somewhere near Swindon by this point. I think it's unlikely he knew Dalts.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    bondjames wrote: »
    @bondjames no mention of 'Tracy' in LTK. No need for it be same wife.
    That is a valid point.

    It's an invalid point. Unless you're happy for the clunky dialogue, 'He was married once. She was called Tracy'. Or the more subtle former part that tells you all you need to know, unless you're a child, or again, (it's a recurring theme this) mentally ill.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    It is possible that Moore's Bond was good friends with Lazenby's. I have already said this but nobody seems to take much notice.
    Good friends with Dalton's too, because Dalton's look at the memory of a lost wife in LTK is quite moving. I suppose we've moved on from the 'mind memory wipe & new memory insertion' concept advocated by @Mendes now? I am just concerned about losing the plot again with all these theories floating about.

    Lazenby's surely been pushed out of the back of a Bedford somewhere near Swindon by this point. I think it's unlikely he knew Dalts.

    :))

    Perhaps Dalton was the driver? Probably as one of your two kills you have to kidnap your predecessor and sling him into the hard shoulder near Membury services at 70mph.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,723
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    It is possible that Moore's Bond was good friends with Lazenby's. I have already said this but nobody seems to take much notice.
    Good friends with Dalton's too, because Dalton's look at the memory of a lost wife in LTK is quite moving. I suppose we've moved on from the 'mind memory wipe & new memory insertion' concept advocated by @Mendes now? I am just concerned about losing the plot again with all these theories floating about.

    Lazenby's surely been pushed out of the back of a Bedford somewhere near Swindon by this point. I think it's unlikely he knew Dalts.

    :))

    Perhaps Dalton was the driver? Probably as one of your two kills you have to kidnap your predecessor and sling him into the hard shoulder near Membury services at 70mph.

    Dryden in CR did look like an older version of Brosnan. You're a genius!!
  • Posts: 4,325
    Just watched Inside For Your Eyes Only on the For Your Eyes Only blu ray and MGW talks about how John Glen wanted the Tracy grave scene to show that it's the same character - the SAME CHARACTER- Michael G. Wilson's very words, him who is currently co-producing James Bond films.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Every Bond film needs a scene where his life history is discussed in detail
    for those audience members a little, Slow on the uptake. ;)
  • RC7 wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    @bondjames no mention of 'Tracy' in LTK. No need for it be same wife.
    That is a valid point.

    It's an invalid point. Unless you're happy for the clunky dialogue, 'He was married once. She was called Tracy'. Or the more subtle former part that tells you all you need to know, unless you're a child, or again, (it's a recurring theme this) mentally ill.

    You're right, everyone who's ever lost a wife is the same person.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,723
    If MI6 has been using the James Bond 007 code name since 1962, how on earth Daniel Craig didn't get shot the very second he walked outside of the MI6 building after becoming James Bond? Shouldn't all foreign secret services and criminal organizations be aware of the same code name being used for 54 years? What if some random idiot happens to be named James Bond? He'd be an a potential target and be tracked down by every spies on earth.
This discussion has been closed.