A place for disappointed skyfall viewers

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  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    In fact I think the move by EON is very representative of modern Britain.

    In 1971, Bond strangled women with their bras. We cannot have a Bond like that anymore. I think SF represented women in a better way than in the 70's where T & A got you the role. Though the main Bond girl in Moonraker, Lois Chiles was a modern woman who could handle Bond.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    It is sad to live in a world where casting a black woman is considered to be a studio/production company trying to be PC, instead of thinking she was chosen for her talent.
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,243
    It is sad to live in a world where casting a black woman is considered to be a studio/production company trying to be PC, instead of thinking she was chosen for her talent.

    Very true. I take an actor for their skill rather than their ethnicity. I remember Craig was also criticised in some English newspapers for looking like a Polish builder and not an Englishman. His acting was not even a factor or his ally for such journalists.

    Prejudice is alive and well but disguised in kind words.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    acoppola wrote:
    It is sad to live in a world where casting a black woman is considered to be a studio/production company trying to be PC, instead of thinking she was chosen for her talent.

    Very true. I take an actor for their skill rather than their ethnicity. I remember Craig was also criticised in some English newspapers for looking like a Polish builder and not an Englishman.

    prejudice is alive and well but disguised in kind words.

    Well, just look at the huge hatred Dan got just for the color of his hair. Some peoples' hatreds are simply not justified enough. When we attack a man for his hair color instead of maybe his habits or actions in the past, that is sad sad sad indeed. Of course, with Dan they didn't have much else to go on. Once a good man, always a good man.
  • DRESSED_TO_KILLDRESSED_TO_KILL Suspended
    edited November 2012 Posts: 260
    Why can't Bond smack a woman anymore? ohhh because it's going to offend the feminist movement? ohh its not acceptable in today's culture. ****** everything is so censored and politically correct these days. Why not just make Bond a gay black woman. That way everybody is happy! !

    Mod edit: swearing cut from post.
  • acoppola wrote:
    It is sad to live in a world where casting a black woman is considered to be a studio/production company trying to be PC, instead of thinking she was chosen for her talent.

    Very true. I take an actor for their skill rather than their ethnicity. I remember Craig was also criticised in some English newspapers for looking like a Polish builder and not an Englishman. His acting was not even a factor or his ally for such journalists.

    Prejudice is alive and well but disguised in kind words.

    It certainly is.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited November 2012 Posts: 28,694
    Why can't Bond smack a woman anymore? ohhh because it's going to offend the feminist movement? ohh its not acceptable in today's culture. everything is so censored and politically correct these days. Why not just make Bond a gay black woman. That way everybody is happy! !

    Bond isn't hitting women to be PC, he isn't doing it because it simply isn't right!!! In my opinion, anyone that hits a woman (across any time period) should be put to 50 lashings or worse. Simply unacceptable.
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    It is sad to live in a world where casting a black woman is considered to be a studio/production company trying to be PC, instead of thinking she was chosen for her talent.

    Very true. I take an actor for their skill rather than their ethnicity. I remember Craig was also criticised in some English newspapers for looking like a Polish builder and not an Englishman.

    prejudice is alive and well but disguised in kind words.

    Well, just look at the huge hatred Dan got just for the color of his hair. Some peoples' hatreds are simply not justified enough. When we attack a man for his hair color instead of maybe his habits or actions in the past, that is sad sad sad indeed. Of course, with Dan they didn't have much else to go on. Once a good man, always a good man.

    I am happy Daniel gets the last laugh and by the box office numbers those poisonous pens show how stupid they were and still are. I never enjoyed the venom against Tim either and all the more came to Dan's side knowing how unjust people are.

  • DRESSED_TO_KILLDRESSED_TO_KILL Suspended
    Posts: 260
    Im not prejudice at all. You are playing the race card now. MONEYPENNY WAS WHITE FOR 50 YEARS! COME ON PEOPLE HOW OBVIOUS IS IT THAT NAOMI WAS A POLITICALLY CORRECT CHOICE.

    I love all races and ethnicites. it was just a OC MOVE
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 11,189
    Bond doesn't smack women anymore.

    Firstly, to my knowledge, he never actually hit any women in the books. The closest thing he did was call them "bitch" (which Craig did in CR).

    Secondly isn't this is a good thing? He hasn't actually HIT anyone in the films since MWTGG anyway. He still shags, drinks and kills though. Isn't that enough?
  • SandySandy Somewhere in Europe
    Posts: 4,012
    I don't even answer anymore, I just flag. Suggest others do the same.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited November 2012 Posts: 24,159
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Bond doesn't smack women anymore.

    Firstly he never actually hit any women in the books. The closest thing he did was call them "bitch" (which Craig did in CR)

    Secondly isn't this is a good thing? He hasn't actually HIT anyone since MWTGG anyway. He still shags, drinks and kills though. Isn't that enough?

    It's best not to reply, @BAIN123. Some men just want to watch the world burn.
    Sandy wrote:
    I don't even answer anymore, I just flag. Suggest others do the same.

    Oh but we know. ;-)
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Im not prejudice at all. You are playing the race card now. MONEYPENNY WAS WHITE FOR 50 YEARS! COME ON PEOPLE HOW OBVIOUS IS IT THAT NAOMI WAS A POLITICALLY CORRECT CHOICE.

    I love all races and ethnicites. it was just a OC MOVE

    Yes you are and no you don't.

  • Posts: 11,189
    DarthDimi wrote:
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Bond doesn't smack women anymore.

    Firstly he never actually hit any women in the books. The closest thing he did was call them "bitch" (which Craig did in CR)

    Secondly isn't this is a good thing? He hasn't actually HIT anyone since MWTGG anyway. He still shags, drinks and kills though. Isn't that enough?

    It's best not to reply, @BAIN123. Some men just want to watch the world burn.
    Sandy wrote:
    I don't even answer anymore, I just flag. Suggest others do the same.

    Oh but we know. ;-)

    He sounds like a joker to me ;)
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    Why can't Bond smack a woman anymore? ohhh because it's going to offend the feminist movement? ohh its not acceptable in today's culture. ****** everything is so censored and politically correct these days. Why not just make Bond a gay black woman. That way everybody is happy! !

    Mod edit: swearing cut from post.

    Look in 1971, women's rights were not taken seriously. Women were there to clean the home, cook dinner and raise children. Women are now in the highest positions of power


    The new Bond can be tough with a woman but not in the wife beater sense.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,959
    Moneypenny has been white for the past 50 years, now lets make her black? it just feels very politically correct to me.

    Like others have said, Bond is moving with the times. Besides, we haven't had Moneypenny in ten years, so why is it a surprise now? It's not like we had a white Moneypenny in QoS and she just changed with this film.

    James Bond smoked for many, many years, and suddenly stopped. Why do you think that was? Moving with the times.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423
    acoppola wrote:

    I actually thought Bond's one liner about wasting a perfectly fine whisky or something like that was out of place considering she just got shot in the head with the whisky glass on top. That was bad timing and bad taste. I did not think it was cool or funny.

    I saw it differently. I think Bond was stupefied, and impotent, and not too emotionaly involved with Severine, thus he was doing what Bond has always done, make a quip, because he had nothing left to offer, nothing left to do, it was expected of him, by Silva.

    It reminded me, in QoS, when he kissed Camille; the only way he could relate to a beautiful woman, is by kissing her.

    Hope that's clear...

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,243
    royale65 wrote:
    acoppola wrote:

    I actually thought Bond's one liner about wasting a perfectly fine whisky or something like that was out of place considering she just got shot in the head with the whisky glass on top. That was bad timing and bad taste. I did not think it was cool or funny.

    I saw it differently. I think Bond was stupefied, and impotent, and not too emotionaly involved with Severine, thus he was doing what Bond has always done, make a quip, because he had nothing left to offer, nothing left to do, it was expected of him, by Silva.

    It reminded me, in QoS, when he kissed Camille; the only way he could relate to a beautiful woman, is by kissing her.

    Hope that's clear...

    No, the whisky line in my opinion was a bit cold considering her torment before she got shot. And especially knowing she died because she got close to Bond. Also her background as a sex trade worker and that implies she has been used and abused enough as it were.

    It was unclassy of Bond and apart from that I have no problems with all the other lines.

    Even Roger Moore's Bond would not make a joke that quickly or in that situation. This is where no one in the audience laughed anyway and it was not the best place for a one liner in that situation.

    Camille does not die in QOS.

    But at the end of the day, it is a film and we all perceive differently. I was emotionally attached to her because she made a positive impression on me.

    I would be the same if Bond made a one liner after M's death. Inappropriate and that is knowing the character can be a bastard.



  • edited November 2012 Posts: 3,274
    acoppola wrote:
    I think CR is closer to classic Bond than SF by a wide margin.
    But of course.
    The screenwriters already had the story arc in place, since this is a Fleming novel. Hence it's also by far the most interesting, wellwritten and exciting Bond-movie in the Craig-era, IMO.
    Creasy47 wrote:
    Like others have said, Bond is moving with the times.
    There's still a template that they have to be truthful to, and I want Bond to be special. I don't want him to be like most other "heroes" of today, who are flawed and troubled. I want him to be James Bond.

    Remember that Bond-movies have always "moved with the times." But the character has basically stayed the same. I don't need the fourth movie in the Craig-era to be yet another one focusing on Bond's character-development.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    edited November 2012 Posts: 4,423
    acoppola wrote:
    [
    Camille does not die in QOS.




    Didn't say that, old boy ;-)

    In my view the line wasn't meant to be funny, it was expected of Bond to "quip", by Silva.

    I guess we just read the movie differently. :)>- :)>- :)>-
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,243
    royale65 wrote:
    acoppola wrote:
    [
    Camille does not die in QOS.




    Didn't say that, old boy ;-)

    In my view the line wasn't meant to be funny, it was expected of Bond to "quip", by Silva.

    I guess we just read the movie differently.

    It's cool.B-) B-) B-) B-) B-) I know you didn't say Camille died and the scene's emotions are different. There is a difference between a kiss and getting shot in the head.

    It was my only problem with the film. Severine had the whisky on her head and the line was the worst time ever it could be. He said it too soon after she had her brains blown out which has raised complaints from some women.

    Had Severine been shown to be a nasty woman then the joke may have worked. But Bond knowing her background and not exactly happy life was in the wrong.

    Also we don't know how badly she has been treated but the bleeding adds an extra dimension of disturbingness to the scene. Her eyes give it away.

    In the torture scene of CR, he can joke as it is him getting the abuse and it gives some relief to the tension.

    Maybe I am looking at the scene from a woman's perspective.



    B-) B-) B-) B-) B-)
  • Posts: 7,653
    Why is it instantly considered a PC move to make a character black? I don't see that at all. Naomi was a popular choice, and she is very talented and beautiful. You should open your eyes to possibly suggesting that EON chose to cast her over her attributes as an actress, and not the color of her skin.

    Not often I agree with this chap but he does nail it for me here.

  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Im not prejudice at all. You are playing the race card now. MONEYPENNY WAS WHITE FOR 50 YEARS! COME ON PEOPLE HOW OBVIOUS IS IT THAT NAOMI WAS A POLITICALLY CORRECT CHOICE.

    I love all races and ethnicites. it was just a OC MOVE

    You really need to know what Political Correctness is before you start accusing people of it. I hazard a guess you have no idea about the origins or reasons for political correctness (as clumsy a term as it is). Stop being a c-word that I'm not allowed to write here.

  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,423

    acoppola wrote:
    royale65 wrote:
    acoppola wrote:
    [
    Camille does not die in QOS.




    Didn't say that, old boy ;-)

    In my view the line wasn't meant to be funny, it was expected of Bond to "quip", by Silva.

    I guess we just read the movie differently.

    It's cool.B-) B-) B-) B-) B-) I know you didn't say Camille died and the scene's emotions are different. There is a difference between a kiss and getting shot in the head.

    It was my only problem with the film. Severine had the whisky on her head and the line was the worst time ever it could be. He said it too soon after she had her brains blown out which has raised complaints from some women.

    Had Severine been shown to be a nasty woman then the joke may have worked. But Bond knowing her background and not exactly happy life was in the wrong.

    Also we don't know how badly she has been treated but the bleeding adds an extra dimension of disturbingness to the scene. Her eyes give it away.

    In the torture scene of CR, he can joke as it is him getting the abuse and it gives some relief to the tension.

    Maybe I am looking at the scene from a woman's perspective.



    B-) B-) B-) B-) B-)

    Ah, my mistake. I felt sorry for Bond, going back to the Camille scene, as he didn't know what to do, apart from kiss her. They had a special kind of relationship, and Bond didn't know how to deal with that.

    I agree with the bolded statement, very disturbing.

  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,959
    @Zekidk, do you think that's how 'Bond 24' will be? We have Q, Moneypenny, and a new M now. I think Bond is at his peak in the Craig world - I don't see a large amount of character development coming from him again in this film. I'm hoping for a separate film, totally unrelated to building up Bond as we see him now, and just a separate mission that doesn't put M or the like in jeopardy.
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    royale65 wrote:
    acoppola wrote:
    royale65 wrote:
    acoppola wrote:
    [
    Camille does not die in QOS.




    Didn't say that, old boy ;-)

    In my view the line wasn't meant to be funny, it was expected of Bond to "quip", by Silva.

    I guess we just read the movie differently.

    It's cool.B-) B-) B-) B-) B-) I know you didn't say Camille died and the scene's emotions are different. There is a difference between a kiss and getting shot in the head.

    It was my only problem with the film. Severine had the whisky on her head and the line was the worst time ever it could be. He said it too soon after she had her brains blown out which has raised complaints from some women.

    Had Severine been shown to be a nasty woman then the joke may have worked. But Bond knowing her background and not exactly happy life was in the wrong.

    Also we don't know how badly she has been treated but the bleeding adds an extra dimension of disturbingness to the scene. Her eyes give it away.

    In the torture scene of CR, he can joke as it is him getting the abuse and it gives some relief to the tension.

    Maybe I am looking at the scene from a woman's perspective.



    B-) B-) B-) B-) B-)

    Ah, my mistake. I felt sorry for Bond, going back to the Camille scene, as he didn't know what to do, apart from kiss her. They had a special kind of relationship, and Bond didn't know how to deal with that.

    I agree with the bolded statement, very disturbing.

    Indeed it is sir. Other than that, I thought the film was top notch and I got something fresh. They pushed the boundaries again which took me by surprise. I was on the edge of my seat throughout.

  • DRESSED_TO_KILLDRESSED_TO_KILL Suspended
    Posts: 260
    I too was on the edge of my seat, wondering if I should leave the film early due to its ridiculous story and absurd script.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,959
    I too was on the edge of my seat, wondering if I should leave the film early due to its ridiculous story and absurd script.

    Let me ask you to play the other side of this coin, then, for a moment: name one thing that you liked about SF. One thing. One tiny scene, one quip, one shot, an actor, something. Just one.
  • Posts: 3,274
    Creasy47 wrote:
    @Zekidk, do you think that's how 'Bond 24' will be? We have Q, Moneypenny, and a new M now. I think Bond is at his peak in the Craig world - I don't see a large amount of character development coming from him again
    That's what I said in 2006 after CR. And in 2008.

  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I too was on the edge of my seat, wondering if I should leave the film early due to its ridiculous story and absurd script.
    let-the-hunger-games-begin-queen.jpeg
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