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It goes back to the books. In the book she is no modern woman. But Bond is attracted to her sexually and gets intrigued watching her play the instrument. It's kinky in a way. The short story by Fleming describes why Bond does get turned on.
Kara is there in the story to contrast her with Bond. Dark and light. Beauty and the beast, though Dalton is no beast. Innocence and guilt as it were.
And many Bond girls were not exactly smart cookies. Roger Moore was an intelligent Bond but Britt Eckland and Barbara Bach were no way believable as his equals and they both were agents.
In fact Solitaire is hugely naive and not versed in the ways of men. Rosie Carver?
Connery played Bond differently than Fleming wrote him, not better.
Quick story, I had seen a whole passel of Bond movies in the theatre by my teens, but Dr. No was not re-released right away in my area, suddenly it was, and I was there. When Bond shot Dent, and then again, and then seemed to half regret it... I was like "Who the F is this??? Not the Bond I know!!" For years I avoided Dr. No because that was the movie where Bond didn't act like Bond... now I know it was Connery's closest performance to the literary Bond- each film evolved a cinematic Bond, more palatable to audiences wanting real heroes...
I also agree- the anti-hero thing would have meant a short franchise run.
At least this way we got to touch on the literary Bond now and again, whilst delivering mainly the hero Bond that keeps the franchise alive, or so it seems.
How's that, sirsean?
I must admit @acoppola, you nearly lost me with the Dracula analogy but I see what you getting at. The difference is though that Dracula is a bloodsucking vampire from the 1800's while Bond is a playboy super-spy from the 1960's, so it's difficult to find any real common ground between them, especially where sexuality is concerned...
If you want 1960's Bond then that ship sailed almost 50 years ago. It won't come back and when they try to make it Connery-esque it backfires. The man had a unique personality and is a one off. That is high compliment.
You cannot recreate the past or Connery. You have six films to enjoy which is a lot.
The Dracula analogy is exactly the same as the Bond one. Some prefer the severely altered versions of the character which are removed from the literary source. Like you for instance. But there are those of us who like to see the character played closer to the books for the very reason that it is good to have that documented on film.
I think in a 50 year history there is room to accomodate a truer to Fleming and a Bond who is less colourful superficially but just as sophisticated and experienced.
The Bond Novels are just over 50 years ahead in time to Bram Stoker's. Dracula was 1897. If Bond lasts another 50 years, then the 1960's will not be relevant to the new generation who will prefer styles relateable to their generation.
Bram Stoker's Dracula has sexuality, though subtler than Fleming's books. But women were particularly the biggest readers of the character in Bram Stoker's Dracula as he was someone who could do things not accepted as decent in their era.
Dracula like Bond in some cases is very far removed from the actual character in the novels when it concerns the cinematic representations so my point is valid. In fact it is you who are alleging that Fleming got it wrong and Connery got it right.
But the author is always the supreme authority as they created the work.
Let me ask you, but if you wrote a book and someone came along and changed huge aspects of it for a film, would you be happy even if it was more successful?
Dracula like Bond in the literary sense are not jump off the screen characters. They are not easily liked when you read the books. But there is something in those books that to this day still fascinates. Yes Connery did not like Fleming's vision but it does not mean he did it better. Connery made it easier for himself as an actor by changing the persona of the man in the books to that of his.
You want all Bond's to be like the Connery blueprint. But unfortunately had that been the case, then the series would not have survived. Impersonators only go so far in this world. Is a band as good as The Beatles by copying them or their style? Because that is what you are asking for essentially of the Bond series.
Stephen King the horror writer was furious with Kubrick for instance when he saw The Shining which effectively misrepresented his novel.
By no means am I saying Connery was wrong, but then again how could Dalton be wrong for being closer to the books? It makes no sense and you said it not me. You really need to think about that one.
I have rarely heard of some criticising an actor for being close to the written version. Usually that is a source of admiration.
Bond is a complicated character and sometimes you need a trained actor to be able to take advantage to dig that out. Dalton had the training to do so.
And Bond survived on the actor's differences not similarities of personality. There are those in this world who prefer Roger Moore to Connery. There is not one way to play Bond or it effectively becomes a straight jacket of restrictiveness for any actor.
^ This. Exactly my case. This really does it for me and it's the main reason why I got hooked on 007. It was Dalton that did it, despite the fact that I grew up in the Brosnan era. Now this is not to bash Brosnan at all, because I don't believe in bashing any Bond actor, period. But for me, personally, the ham-fisted one-liners and overall womanizing and smarminess just never worked. I prefer more complex, darker interpretations that also happen to be psychologically engaging. I am a sucker for the dark almost anti-hero hero, the brooding, flawed, yet romantic lead. It's insanely sexy.
^^ And this too. Every single word of it. To the OP, some men just want to project their sexual desires onto the character and they rate actors based on how much they womanize, how "cool" they are, etc. How much "swagger" they have (according to them) and how "sexy" too. How subjective and utterly superficial. I personally believe Connery had swagger, of course, but so does Craig, and hell to the ever-loving YES, even Dalton has swagger.
swagger:
Noun: A very confident and typically arrogant or aggressive gait or manner.
They just have different styles of acting and different styles of showing it. Ok, you like the Connery style best, good for you, I wish you all the enjoyment in the world watching and rewatching those first 6 movies while we appreciate all the other shadings of Bond and fantastic blends of cinematic and Fleming found in both Dalton and Craig. The above definition I found in both of them, beautifully multi-layered and darker, as I like it. We move with the times. Although Connery was great and that is not arguable, I don't want to be stuck there and there was so.. SO much more to be done with the character, which is why here we are 50 years later. The Bond franchise proved to the world that it was not about Connery, it was about Bond itself, and who created Bond? Fleming and it's when you go back to Fleming that the best Bond has to give truly surfaces.
We all know he was capable of more. I think.
Yes, indeed... you read me well ;). I did sound a tad harsh on Pierce, not my intention... it's just that there was something to the way the character was played and scripted during that era that always kept me at bay. (Ah, there I go... did it again.)I just prefer the Dalton version more but I can understand the people who prefer Brosnan. What I can't understand is people who claim Craig and Dalton are the worst because they're "too Fleming" and unsexy to boot.
Just saw Skyfall and I enjoyed the film but not in the loose term of enjoyment. This was not a popcorn movie and far better than the descriptions I read. The film is a psychological thriller and rather than make me forget Dalton, it reminded me of how good a younger Tim would be.
I think Daniel did a great job in the film, because like Tim, he was playing James Bond not as a cliche. I believed he was capable and he had all the elements I like in the books. Also he had the psychology of the character fleshed out.
There is no way this film is in the style of a Goldfinger or Dr No. No way. But it is a fine film and a disturbing one too like the scene where Severine dies.
Nicely written @Regan particularly the part of some men wanting to project their sexual desires onto the character.
I have seen men in real life approach women like it is a James Bond film and women find it creepy. Especially if the man has an unattractive personality.
I don't think any woman is attracted to the James Bond character because he is similar to a sex offender.
The James Bond character is clearly shown as a man that in general a woman would happily go to bed with him rather than a woman who feels the need to call the police the next day after they have done the business.
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdlp3y8qzQ1r77kqzo1_r1_250.gif
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdlp3y8qzQ1r77kqzo2_250.gif
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Http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdlp3y8qzQ1r77kqzo6_r1_250.gif
What can I say.. it gets a gal goin' :))
One more...
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcynn1wnaX1r3i95ho1_500.gif
I'll stop there before I get too carried away... ahem.
Very true @Regan I was surprised at how a departure this film was considering they said it would be classic Bond. It has the references to the past but not in a DAD wink, wink way.
In fact I found the references almost like saying a goodbye to the style of past Bond like the Q scene.
And when the DB5 gets destroyed to nothing, I personally felt it was symbolic and the film saying goodbye to the formula of the old Bond.
This is a film a young Tim would have loved and I can see him in it. Even the dialogue with Severine by the bar is not tacky and Bond is treating a woman as an equal not an object of inferiority. That is how women should be represented. Benerice was great in that bar scene as was Daniel in how he handled Bond's psychology in the situation.
Hey, did you notice the LTK reference at the bar when he mentions her Beretta strapped to her thigh? LTK was the first film to show a woman with the gun on her thigh. Oh and his signature gun was LTK reference for sure.
I remember Dalton saying he would have killed for the scripts Daniel is getting.
I could not picture Roger in SF at all. Daniel is a very unique Bond and his direction is very different.
Dalton looked great and like a real man too. He does smile and it is perverse because he knows he is about to interrupt Pushkin's romantic interlude.
I always liked that scene and am sometimes surprised what the F people are talking about when they unfairly criticise or in a way that is clearly not thought out and copied from what they read somewhere.
Good to know you liked SF @acoppola (just a heads up, you might want to edit your posts instead of double or triple posting, the mods might bother you for that).
Hi @Sandy Thanks for the heads up. Last night when I made a post, it doubled it. I got an error message and it posted me twice.
SF was a fine film and I enjoyed it without having the need to put down past Bond films. A Bond film must be judged in it's own era. Just like in 40 years time, SF will look so different to modern film styles of 2052.
I love that scene, from the moment he's sitting in the car watching the hotel to the very last moment of the interrogation scene. There is something so perverse indeed, about it, but also so "spy/secret agent", and the way he just crashes Pushkin's private little party and turns it into this deeply frightening affair. It's just a very dark scene all around and it always gets my blood pumping.
This screencap I particularly love:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/571/bscap0071x.jpg/
There was always something a little wicked about Dalton's Bond.
Love it @Regan He had a wickedness in his smile. He is a timeless Bond who understood the character beyond the cliche. His nuances were missed by the mass audience who needed Austin Powers obviousness.
I also noticed that Dalton did not act like he had never been around a woman before. In fact in his body language, he gave me the impression he had so many that he was bored of sex. Like when he looks at the bikini clad woman on the yacht in TLD's pre-credits sequence. His eyes say "Oh go on then!" 8-|
When I first watched that "yacht" seen on TLD's pre-title sequence, when he swings down from the top and lands right in front of the bikini woman... I thought that was one of the sexiest things I'd ever seen. Not kidding. And when he throws the name Bond, James Bond so casually out there, like he doesn't give a rat's behind, not like he is TRYING to be... but like he simply, is Bond. That screamed confidence to me more than if he'd delivered the line while milking it for all it had. Some people claim it's one of the worst deliveries, I saw behind all that to the uniqueness of it. I don't need to be hit over the head with.. "hey! look how cool I am?! You should be sleeping with me". In fact, that's a turn off.
I didn't notice the gun strapped to the thigh reference. I did hear the line, I just didn't think it was a reference to LTK but now that you mention it, that's awesome. The signature gun I totally got and it put a huge smile on my face. I was all like, that's the gun from Licence to Kill! Straight lifted from it!
Did you notice Craig's overpowerment of Severine at the bar in SF? It was similar to how Dalton totally overpowers Lupe in the casino and tells her how it is going to be. His terms and his conditions.
Both actors show attraction to women in their characterisations by not being just charming but threatening.
The concealed Beretta is a reference to the scene in the lift in LTK where Bond looks down as she is undoing her dress to reveal. Dalton gives a look of sexual frustration in the sense that the timing could not be worse as he thinks there is danger ahead in the hotel room. But he has the manliness in how he handles her and tells her to wait outside the room.
That was very sexy and those men who criticise Dalton I would love to see attempt that and do it better. My friend thought Dalton handled women like he wished he could.
Dalton is tough with women without showing a dependency. Some men will play psychological games with women but more out of fear of losing them rather than keeping them.
The situation, and hence each actors approach, is completely different in those two scenes. Craig is more relaxed yet at the same time direct. He playfully teases Eve before meeting Severine and shows he isn't afraid to break contact with her and take charge on his own. Once he meets Severine he's calm and cool around her. He explains that he can see through her "tough girl" act and demonstrates this further by reiterating her own nasty past to her (in the process showing his worldly knowledge of criminal organisations). Both actors play it extremely well.
Dalton, by contrast, is much angrier to the point where he goes a little over-the-top (IMO). He is meant to be angry and intense about the prospect of meeting the man who killed his friends wife...and its pretty clear from the outset from the scowling, snarling expressions on his face.
One is meant to be calm and cool, the other is seething with rage. One is business, the other is personal.
The main similarity is that Bond tells the female to take him to her employer/lover, however the style in which this is done couldn't be more different.
The female actresses are also worlds apart. Soto's delivery of the line "you should walk straight out of here, go to the airport and never come back" has made me wince in the past. Whereas the moment Marlohe's hands start shaking as the holds the cigarette actually made me feel quite uncomfortable (in a good way) as I sat in my seat.
I see your point and we all can occasionally ramble. But Dalton was very smart when he veered away from what Connery had done. He knew that Connery was brilliant and instead built a new Bond. In fact when he was asked to possibly replace Connery, he said no as Connery was "Too good!".
I give Dalton more respect than Brosnan. Brosnan in one interview said he wanted to be as good or better than Connery. Dalton was right all along. If you try to be Connery you are F***ed. The whole point of Bond and playing him is to have the courage to be who you are and not what you are not.
To me Connery was powerful in the role and had the right balances. But Dalton added his own dimensions and increased the character's brutality which to some is equally sexy but different. Dalton was sexy but used a different way to convey masculinity.
Oh the actress playing Severine is a better actress than the one playing Lupe.
Both actors are aggressive with the women in the scenes. Just look how Craig dominantly grabs her wrist. Both to me are excellent scenes in their own right. And both are sexy. Like the scene where Bond in LTK looks at Lupe's boobs when she becomes the card dealer to make him lose.
The situations in both films are different. But in both cases, you realise that Bond is not a man to be crossed and shows how he can dominate a woman even in a hostile environment. Both women also are brutalised by their association to the villain.
And you must also bear in mind that in LTK, Dalton has seen the scars on the back of Lupe and in the casino scene he knows Sanchez could be watching so cannot make it too obvious. Sanchez is a jealous man who will rip any man to shreds for hitting on his woman.
Dalton's Bond also knows that Lupe is a woman that needs to be severely dominated and he also disables her tough woman act. Lupe is reacting to Bond out of fear for her own life.
Trust me @Bain123 Both actors are a master class in handling women and it looks easy but damn hard to pull off in real life. Both Bonds are men who are supremely sure of themselves and this is what arouses both women's confidence in them as well as trust.