M from now on ( SKYFALL SPOILERS!)

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  • I just hope they put to rest the whole M talking to Bond in the field through a earpiece thing. I love Skyfall and the entire Craig era, but it's time to give that bit a rest. Time to have Bond in the field, on his own, with nothing but his own guile and wits to guide him.
  • edited December 2012 Posts: 6,601
    Getafix wrote:
    CR is a much better film all round than SF, not least due to a proper story at its heart.
    How doesn't Skyfall have that?


    You are asking HIM of all people? He has made clear in endless posts, how he things the plotline and everything else infact is crap. No need to engage him again on it IMO.
    I doubt anybody here is eager to hear it all over again...
  • SuperheroSithSuperheroSith SE London
    Posts: 578
    They brought it back to Bernie Lee.
  • I think it will be more old school with a much fresher dynamic. I expect the new M to be desk bound and a more peripheral character going forward. Bond needs to be out in the field on his own with M & co at the start and end of the movie only, just for a change.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Ludovico wrote:
    I agree with the posters saying we will have a relationship closer to Connery/Lee. I will also add something I don't think I have seen before: it may be akin to Sherlock/Mycroft Holmes, with M being able to see things Bond has missed.
    A funny comparison. And as with Sherlock and Mycroft, Bond is out doing all the work while M sits at his desk, much akin to Mycroft spending his hours at the Diogenes Club.
    ;))
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    I think it will be more old school with a much fresher dynamic. I expect the new M to be desk bound and a more peripheral character going forward. Bond needs to be out in the field on his own with M & co at the start and end of the movie only, just for a change.

    The question is: is that going to be enough to keep Fiennes happy?
  • edited December 2012 Posts: 1,143
    echo wrote:
    I think it will be more old school with a much fresher dynamic. I expect the new M to be desk bound and a more peripheral character going forward. Bond needs to be out in the field on his own with M & co at the start and end of the movie only, just for a change.

    The question is: is that going to be enough to keep Fiennes happy?

    Possibly not. Maybe his M can develop into a more central role at some point but for now I personally don't want to see M as a main central character as happened with Judy Dench's M as it now needs a change in direction where it is all about Bond, the girl and the villain. I think Fiennes is a splendid actor and choice BTW.
  • edited December 2012 Posts: 15,125
    Ludovico wrote:
    I agree with the posters saying we will have a relationship closer to Connery/Lee. I will also add something I don't think I have seen before: it may be akin to Sherlock/Mycroft Holmes, with M being able to see things Bond has missed.
    A funny comparison. And as with Sherlock and Mycroft, Bond is out doing all the work while M sits at his desk, much akin to Mycroft spending his hours at the Diogenes Club.
    ;))

    Yes. And M, just like the villain (but that is for another topic), should be smarter than Bond. More organised, more analytical. I dream to see in the movies a scene like in the novel TB, where M practically uncovers Blofeld's plan in front of Bond, simply through a series of deductions. I think Fiennes could deliver it perfectly.
  • Posts: 612
    I'd like to see Bond and Tanner more chummy.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    Ludovico wrote:
    Ludovico wrote:
    I agree with the posters saying we will have a relationship closer to Connery/Lee. I will also add something I don't think I have seen before: it may be akin to Sherlock/Mycroft Holmes, with M being able to see things Bond has missed.
    A funny comparison. And as with Sherlock and Mycroft, Bond is out doing all the work while M sits at his desk, much akin to Mycroft spending his hours at the Diogenes Club.
    ;))

    Yes. And M, just like the villain (but that is for another topic), should be smarter than Bond. More organised, more analytical. I dream to see in the movies a scene like in the novel TB, where M practically uncovers Blofeld's plan in front of Bond, simply through a series of deductions. I think Fiennes could deliver it perfectly.

    That's a great idea. While I find it amusing when Bond one-ups M a la DAF, M should be smarter.
  • I'd like to see Bond and Tanner more chummy.

    Agreed. I've mentioned before that I'd love a short, single scene of Craig's Bond and Wright's Leiter enjoying themselves together during a mission - either having a drink together or a meal in a restaurant, waiting for the next "event" to happen. But I'd love to see Bond and Tanner in their shirtsleeves with loosened ties playing cards together and having a drink in the office long after working hours (especially smiling and ribbing each other). Again, it could be a scene of a few seconds and then they're called in to an emergency briefing. But it would add so much to any future scenes with the two of them.
  • 007InVT007InVT Classified
    Posts: 893
    I'm so glad we have Fiennes installed as M. Judi Dench was becoming grating and overbearing with her 'Bloody Hell' this and 'Bloody Hell' that. M is more professional than that and it's not the character Fleming wrote. He's be content with Fiennes.

    I hope we get back to more scenes between them, I won't anticipate a full on Fleming-esque relationship but I grew tired of the naughty schoolboy act with Dench. Bond always had a lot of respect for M in the books and that needs to come back.
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    edited June 2013 Posts: 496
    He will be a good M and a true soldier because wasn't he in Northern Ireland or something as a Colonel and he was good at shooting when he got shot in the shoulder so yes he will be good. Just a question about M I know Robert Brown played M and Admiral Hargreaves so was he promoted to M because Bond was in the Navy too.

    @007InVT I know the bad word the really bad word the F word in Skyfall you know what I'm talking about don't you its worse than flipping.
  • 007InVT007InVT Classified
    Posts: 893
    Yes, I'd like to see M's military history played up going forward. If you read Moonraker (highly recommended) Bond and M work side by side.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    I was musing on Mallory the other day and a thought struck me.

    At the start of the film and in several scenes subsequent he is giving M a bollocking so its pretty clear hes her superior.

    So how come in the final reel he has been demoted to her job which from all that we have seen before is obviously a lesser role?

    It makes more sense for Tanner (although insipid Rory Kinnear as M fills me with terror) or Bond to be promoted rather than Mallory being forced to take a pay cut.

  • 007InVT007InVT Classified
    Posts: 893
    @TheWizardOfIce - I enjoyed Mallory, basically firing her. Fiennes is the master of cold.

    Agree about Kinnear, no charisma whatsoever.

    I'm not concerned about Mallory taking the lesser role, I think it restores order as Bond should respect M a lot more than he did Dench in that silly Mumsy relationship they had.
  • I was musing on Mallory the other day and a thought struck me.

    At the start of the film and in several scenes subsequent he is giving M a bollocking so its pretty clear hes her superior.

    So how come in the final reel he has been demoted to her job which from all that we have seen before is obviously a lesser role?

    It makes more sense for Tanner (although insipid Rory Kinnear as M fills me with terror) or Bond to be promoted rather than Mallory being forced to take a pay cut.

    Good point. Although it seems he's her nominal superior. As he's moving to a highly prestigious and active role I think it makes sense. There's a line in FYEO (the short story) where Bond reflects that Messervy turned down the guaranteed offer of Fifth Sea Lord to become head of the secret service so it sort of fits with Fleming.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited June 2013 Posts: 9,117
    007InVT wrote:
    Agree about Kinnear, no charisma whatsoever.

    I see a lot of people saying hes very good as Tanner but Michael Kitchen exuded more authority in a much smaller role. Kinnear just comes across more of a male Moneypenny. Of course this could be a fault with the script which basically makes him M's dogsbody.

    If they were going to bother to reboot everything why not have Tanner on the mission in the PTS and have him injured as in the books and let him be the field agent who is forced to give up office work and then have Eve just come in as Mallorys girl from the Shanghai scenes onwards and then reveal at the end shes Moneypenny and that Tanner has given up field work to be deputy.

    As it is I feel we have rather been foisted with Kinnear as a stock MI6 regular from now on, without any actual character being established. He might as well be the same character as Robinson or the guy in CR who googles Skyfleet.
    Good point. Although it seems he's her nominal superior. As he's moving to a highly prestigious and active role I think it makes sense. There's a line in FYEO (the short story) where Bond reflects that Messervy turned down the guaranteed offer of Fifth Sea Lord to become head of the secret service so it sort of fits with Fleming.

    Tentative but I'll give it you I suppose as youre backing it up with a quote from Fleming.

    Lets just say that the shootout in the select committee made him remember he likes to get his hands a bit dirtier than his current deskbound role so he applied after M died even though it was technically not as prestigious a role as he already had.
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    I would love to see Bond, M , Q and Moneypenny out in the field because they all have done and would be great. When I say Q I mean Llewelyen ( sorry about that hard surname to spell) and M because he was part of the army and was in action in SF , and then Moneypenny in SF too, but did anyone know that in FRWL Moneypenny says she would love to Istanbul and in SF she does! Only noticed it the 6th time I watched it.

  • Posts: 1,817
    One importat thing about Lee and Brown's M relationship with Bond, and then again with Mallory, is that his not only his civil superior in MI6 but also a military. That gives him additional authority over Bond so the expected interaction should be mostly vertical.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    then Moneypenny in SF too, but did anyone know that in FRWL Moneypenny says she would love to Istanbul and in SF she does! Only noticed it the 6th time I watched it.

    Thats the first interesting thing youve said.

    Does that debunk the crappy 'SF is a prequel to DN' theory as if it was true she wouldnt say this in FRWL as she has already been in SF?
  • 007InVT007InVT Classified
    Posts: 893
    0013 wrote:
    One importat thing about Lee and Brown's M relationship with Bond, and then again with Mallory, is that his not only his civil superior in MI6 but also a military. That gives him additional authority over Bond so the expected interaction should be mostly vertical.

    Quite agree 0013.

  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    then Moneypenny in SF too, but did anyone know that in FRWL Moneypenny says she would love to Istanbul and in SF she does! Only noticed it the 6th time I watched it.

    Thats the first interesting thing you've said.

    Does that debunk the crappy 'SF is a prequel to DN' theory as if it was true she wouldnt say this in FRWL as she has already been in SF?

    This is confusing since CR why dont we jsut say Bond had his Licence to Kill taken off him? Between DAD & CR and then he had to do the sam stuff to get it back?

  • Posts: 2,402
    I think Fiennes will have a lot of Lee's essence, which I welcome. Hes got the stature, the mannerisms, even a similar, though deeper, voice. And he can pull it off without looking like a second rate impersonator.
  • Posts: 15,125
    I was musing on Mallory the other day and a thought struck me.

    At the start of the film and in several scenes subsequent he is giving M a bollocking so its pretty clear hes her superior.

    So how come in the final reel he has been demoted to her job which from all that we have seen before is obviously a lesser role?

    It makes more sense for Tanner (although insipid Rory Kinnear as M fills me with terror) or Bond to be promoted rather than Mallory being forced to take a pay cut.

    Mallory was the head of a committee, not quite M's superior. Being the head of MI6 is a prestigious, vital position.

    M's position, or C's in real life's MI6, can be offered from someone from inside MI6 or outside. But if it was inside, a former head of stations or Deputy Head would be more logical choices than Tanner or Bond, especially the latter.
  • then Moneypenny in SF too, but did anyone know that in FRWL Moneypenny says she would love to Istanbul and in SF she does! Only noticed it the 6th time I watched it.

    Thats the first interesting thing you've said.

    Does that debunk the crappy 'SF is a prequel to DN' theory as if it was true she wouldn't say this in FRWL as she has already been in SF?

    I could personally never understand how SF could possibly be a DN prequel. CR and QOS, yes I could because Bond is new to the game. Not so in SF, it's more like where DAD left off , but obviously much improved.

  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    then Moneypenny in SF too, but did anyone know that in FRWL Moneypenny says she would love to Istanbul and in SF she does! Only noticed it the 6th time I watched it.

    Thats the first interesting thing you've said.

    Does that debunk the crappy 'SF is a prequel to DN' theory as if it was true she wouldn't say this in FRWL as she has already been in SF?

    I could personally never understand how SF could possibly be a DN prequel. CR and QOS, yes I could because Bond is new to the game. Not so in SF, it's more like where DAD left off , but obviously much improved.

    I think Mendes or someone said it as a throwaway remark meaning by the end of SF we have come full circle and are back where everything is in position for business as usual but some idiots (the same sort of people who believe in the codename theory or ask why Judi's M remains in place after DAD if we've rebooted) took it rather too literally.
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