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How did Eve qualify as a field agent in the first place?

MrSenorMrSenor
edited December 2012 in Skyfall Posts: 37
I don't mean to be sexist, but field agents are typically recruited from the special forces and as far as I'm aware, the SAS and SBS (of which Bond is a former operative of) don't recruit females. So what's Eve's story? Even if the special forces did allow women, her incompetency would argue against her being in such a line of work.

I know it's a movie and that it was pretty much a PC move, but since reboot Bond is meant to be moving into more realistic territory I thought it might well be worth asking. I can understand the earlier movies (Moore and Brosnan) having female field agents since they were fairly outlandish.[url][/url]
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Comments

  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    I don't know how she got the job, but she certainly wasn't completely incompetent. She handled the truck very well indeed, and her marksmanship wasn't that bad. It was a long shot at a moving target (on top of a moving target). She was maybe a foot out.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    edited December 2012 Posts: 13,978
    This isn't News, moved to Skyfall.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Lame film. Lame script and plot. There's your answer.
  • Major_BoothroydMajor_Boothroyd Republic of Isthmus
    Posts: 2,722
    I'm not sure of the regulations of the special forces but if I was to define her qualifications by her actions she was actually pretty good. I mean she might not be '007 good' - but who is?! What was exactly incompetent about her? I mean calling that shot on bond as the sole reason she shouldn't be in the field is a bit harsh. Many male operatives would have screwed that one up.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Major_Boothroyd wrote:
    I'm not sure of the regulations of the special forces but if I was to define her qualifications by her actions she was actually pretty good. I mean she might not be '007 good' - but who is?! What was exactly incompetent about her? I mean calling that shot on bond as the sole reason she shouldn't be in the field is a bit harsh. Many male operatives would have screwed that one up.

    Not even 007 on the basis of SF
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    I agree. How can we count the ways? Plowing through a market endangering people, shooting at Patrice while he is near more civilians that probably just got done running away from her crazy arse, and then she shoots her services best agent. When he returns she STILL muffs up by touching her ear. Yeah, I'd say Eve's time in the field was a little too extended.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    I agree. How can we count the ways? Plowing through a market endangering people, shooting at Patrice while he is near more civilians that probably just got done running away from her crazy arse, and then she shoots her services best agent. When he returns she STILL muffs up by touching her ear. Yeah, I'd say Eve's time in the field was a little too extended.

    If I hadn't gone into the film knowing who she was in the end, I would have probably expected that her and Bond would somehow team up again towards the ending and she would finally show her competent side by saving him.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    She did save him or help in the casino I suppose. But why is she back in the field when she's just messed up inTurkey?
  • actonsteveactonsteve
    Posts: 1,492
    To be fair, her boss was the one who messed up making the wrong decision.

    That woman was so incompetent I am surprised it was ONLY Silva coming after her.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    I'll be truthful, the more I watch Skyfall, the more irritated I get with the Harris character. I just can't quite take to her, and it's the first time that Moneypenny has been out in the field and taking risks etc. Even when she (accidently) shoots Bond off the moving train, why doesn't she then go and take out the other guy who's still there instead of doing nothing ? Just not a Moneypenny, or character I could quite warm to in the end, she's a definite step down from Samantha Bond before her
  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 5,745
    ^@Baltimore, you haven't even really seen her as full on Moneypenny yet, so I wouldn't go making 'bad Moneypenny' accusations quite yet.

    Plus, she was competent driving, competent in communicating with Bond and M, competent in the casino, even saving Bond let's not forget, and competent in the board room shoot out. She eyeballed Bond communicating for him to slide the gun over.

    She's not a bad field agent, like @NicNac said, she was only inches off her target, which happened to be a moving human on top of a train going 30-40 mph.
  • SpectreNumberOneSpectreNumberOne
    Posts: 129
    Firstly Bond was never a former member of either the SAS or SBS, he may have trained with them in various continuation novels, Bond was a commander in the Royal Navy Reserve. MI6 recruits directly from the general public & from all areas of society regardless of sex or ethnicity, it's more about your educational qualifications, no military experience required, all training is given plus most important you have to be a British citizen with at least 10 years residency. So Eve's character could have been a field agent.

    @Baltimore's point is good in the real world however if she had just shot the other guy, there wouldn't have been a movie.

  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    SpectreNumberOne wrote:
    Firstly Bond was never a former member of either the SAS or SBS, he may have trained with them in various continuation novels, Bond was a commander in the Royal Navy Reserve. MI6 recruits directly from the general public & from all areas of society regardless of sex or ethnicity, it's more about your educational qualifications, no military experience required, all training is given plus most important you have to be a British citizen with at least 10 years residency. So Eve's character could have been a field agent.

    @Baltimore's point is good in the real world however if she had just shot the other guy, there wouldn't have been a movie.


    To me, it was very obvious, that she was just shocked about shooting Bond and hence, didn't shoot Patrice, while she still could. This MIGHT make her a lesser agent, but that's a human explanation.
  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    Getafix wrote:
    Lame film. Lame script and plot. There's your answer.


    1051..and counting :))
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    JWESTBROOK wrote:
    Plus, she was competent driving

    She knocked a mirror off and knocked a
    bunch of market stalls over if I remember
    right.
  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    How would she have avoided that - knocking over the market stalls? I don't care, whether or not anybody sees her as competent or not, but this was hardly avpoidable, PLUS its a f***ing action movie guys. Relax. Where do we go next? How indiscutable it was to maybe ruining all those oranges?
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    I was just pointing out she wasn't a brilliant driver. I wasn't even criticising SF and you still jump in and defend it.
  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 5,745
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    JWESTBROOK wrote:
    Plus, she was competent driving

    She knocked a mirror off and knocked a
    bunch of market stalls over if I remember
    right.

    Yea, but she didn't lose Patrice, did she? It's not like she was grinding gears.

    I think some of us just want to not like her.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    I didn't mind her, I preferred Berenice
    though and I didn't want a
    big backstory for Moneypenny of all people.
  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    I was just pointing out she wasn't a brilliant driver. I wasn't even criticising SF and you still jump in and defend it.

    I just didn't think, your argument was valid and still don't. That's all...

  • MrSenorMrSenor
    edited December 2012 Posts: 37
    SpectreNumberOne wrote:
    Firstly Bond was never a former member of either the SAS or SBS, he may have trained with them in various continuation novels, Bond was a commander in the Royal Navy Reserve. MI6 recruits directly from the general public & from all areas of society regardless of sex or ethnicity, it's more about your educational qualifications, no military experience required, all training is given plus most important you have to be a British citizen with at least 10 years residency. So Eve's character could have been a field agent.

    @Baltimore's point is good in the real world however if she had just shot the other guy, there wouldn't have been a movie.

    Uh, Craig's Bond has directly been specified as having been in the SBS during his time in the Royal Navy. It was even on the official Casino Royale movie site. Perhaps you're a stubborn Fleming purist or don't understand the nature of the 'reboot' and the potential changes that can be made to a protagonist's history.
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited December 2012 Posts: 11,425
    actonsteve wrote:
    To be fair, her boss was the one who messed up making the wrong decision.

    That woman was so incompetent I am surprised it was ONLY Silva coming after her.

    This is my view completely. Just wondering how you square this with enjoying the film though? Didn't you find it intensely annoying that practically everyone within MI6 is depicted as utterly incompetent. M, Moneypenny, Q and even Bond are all pretty useless throughout, making weird decisions and not really being very effective.

    It makes the whole Tennyson thing seem like total bluster. M has totally cocked up but she's so arrogant she thinks she can lecture the committee on steadfastness (that coming from the woman who happily stabs her loyal agents in the back at the first opportunity). It comes across as monumentally arrogant that a civil servant (which is effectively what she is) shows such disdain to the politicians who are asking valid questions about her performance. I couldn't work out whether the script intended you to really dislike the M character or whether it was just Purvis and Wade being typically incompetent.



  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 5,994
    Well, given that there have been female field agents in the past, being SAS/SBS:Commandoes trained isn't a prerequisite to being a field agent. One could hardly say that Virginia Hill, for example, had been trained by the SAS, what with her wooden leg and all (although Pierre Bourgoin, of the french SAS, parachuted over Britanny in june/july 1944, despite being one-armed).
  • Tobester95Tobester95
    Posts: 117
    Is it me or do a lot of people nowadays find it difficult to suspend their belief and just watch a movie? People seem to expect characters in a film to react exactly how they would react, but that's not life. In real life, people make weird decisions and are imperfect. Things also sometimes happen a certain way. It's not even unique to Skyfall, people seem to have the smallest gripes with movies and then try to paint them as a massive flaw.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Tobester95 wrote:
    Is it me or do a lot of people nowadays find it difficult to suspend their belief and just watch a movie? People seem to expect characters in a film to react exactly how they would react, but that's not life. In real life, people make weird decisions and are imperfect. Things also sometimes happen a certain way. It's not even unique to Skyfall, people seem to have the smallest gripes with movies and then try to paint them as a massive flaw.

    I don't think so. I think it depends on how the movie deals with it's subject. Balancing a serious tone with moments that require you to suspend your disbelief is incredibly difficult. If a movie is flagged up as one or the other you know what you're getting but if it mixes the two you have to be aware that audiences now are more astute, more familiar with the film making process and as a result, expect more.
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited December 2012 Posts: 11,425
    RC7 wrote:
    Tobester95 wrote:
    Is it me or do a lot of people nowadays find it difficult to suspend their belief and just watch a movie? People seem to expect characters in a film to react exactly how they would react, but that's not life. In real life, people make weird decisions and are imperfect. Things also sometimes happen a certain way. It's not even unique to Skyfall, people seem to have the smallest gripes with movies and then try to paint them as a massive flaw.

    I don't think so. I think it depends on how the movie deals with it's subject. Balancing a serious tone with moments that require you to suspend your disbelief is incredibly difficult. If a movie is flagged up as one or the other you know what you're getting but if it mixes the two you have to be aware that audiences now are more astute, more familiar with the film making process and as a result, expect more.

    I just expect some consistency. The fact that M is suddenly cast as this arrogant, incompetent and not very sympathetic harpy breaks all the Bond traditions. And it makes it even more difficult to understand Bond's loyalty to her. The other characters are also equally off-key in my opinion. The tone just reminded me of the Brosnan era where nothing seemed to make much sense. 'It says here that Bond is x' and it 'says here that M is a y' so it must be true, except what you actually get on screen is the complete opposite.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Come to think of it, if she would have shot Patrice after Bond she could have made him fall off the train too, losing the drive completely. So maybe it's best she didn't do anything. I am sure Silva would have found another way to get to M, but still.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    Come to think of it, if she would have shot Patrice after Bond she could have made him fall off the train too, losing the drive completely. So maybe it's best she didn't do anything. I am sure Silva would have found another way to get to M, but still.

    If that happened, the next two hours of the film would involve her scanning the railroad and subsequent cliffs for the drive. Hilarity ensues.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Creasy47 wrote:
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    Come to think of it, if she would have shot Patrice after Bond she could have made him fall off the train too, losing the drive completely. So maybe it's best she didn't do anything. I am sure Silva would have found another way to get to M, but still.

    If that happened, the next two hours of the film would involve her scanning the railroad and subsequent cliffs for the drive. Hilarity ensues.

    It might actually have been more interesting...

    Only joking. Sort of.
  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    Tobester95 wrote:
    Is it me or do a lot of people nowadays find it difficult to suspend their belief and just watch a movie? People seem to expect characters in a film to react exactly how they would react, but that's not life. In real life, people make weird decisions and are imperfect. Things also sometimes happen a certain way. It's not even unique to Skyfall, people seem to have the smallest gripes with movies and then try to paint them as a massive flaw.

    It just looks this way Tobester - most here are actually able to enjoy the film, as does the rest of the world - they are just done with arguing with the few you read here. ;)
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