It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
^ Back to Top
The MI6 Community is unofficial and in no way associated or linked with EON Productions, MGM, Sony Pictures, Activision or Ian Fleming Publications. Any views expressed on this website are of the individual members and do not necessarily reflect those of the Community owners. Any video or images displayed in topics on MI6 Community are embedded by users from third party sites and as such MI6 Community and its owners take no responsibility for this material.
James Bond News • James Bond Articles • James Bond Magazine
Comments
But Craig is so ruthless and tough and no-nonsense above all else. I'd feel safe enough
Second choice would be Dalton Bond.
If my life was in danger, I couldn't care less if the Roadrunner saved me! Mr Bond, you may very well be brooding patriotically on a London rooftop, as the old Union Jack flutters in the breeze, or lying with Britt Ekland on a romantic Chinese junk, in the brownest bedroom known to man, but I would still be dead!
Not sure I could trust any of them to save me. Think I'd hide behind M's desk instead. And not Dame Judi's desk, that would be far too dangerous - things always seem to explode near there. Nope, give me Bernie Lee's desk, the reassurance of a leather door, copious naval paintings on the walls, and a pipe I would no longer be allowed to smoke in an office these days. For all my admiration of Bond, it would have to be the cushy desk job for me.
My thoughts on this all:
So, what all this boils down to is this: The mission is to kill Silva. He thought anyone was expendable to get his way to M, and he would do anything to make it so. He caused massive chaos in London to get her. MI6 partly blown to bits, agents dead in high numbers, tube riders in severe danger in the tunnels and officials/guards/innocents put in the crossfire during the hearing. Bond makes the call to get M out so they have an advantage to draw Silva away where no innocents are hurt and his technology is meaningless. They fight honorably, 3 against dozens, and believe it or not folks, we lost M. It is inevitable. As I said previously, I truly feel that she knew death was coming. The whole film was filled with her staring at her own bad misfortunes getting the better of her, eating away at her until she realized that death couldn't be too far away. Her face in the hearing when she is about to be shot by Silva before Mallory intervenes is the face of someone who is expecting death. But at the end of the day she wasn't going to leave her duty without the situation pacified, and when Bond finally kills Silva she knows the job is done and she can pass honorably away, giving everything to protect the country she served, even at the ultimate cost.
And as I have said before in a Skyfall review thread, the ending shows us an important lesson about winning and losing, and if it really exists. Bond wins the fight, but loses M. Silva spends his basically nihilistic existence with the only objective of killing and old woman, and can't even do that. He ends up with a knife in the back, failed in his mission. But yet M dies, so did he win? Well, not quite. You see, M was killed by a random henchman. What does that prove? Well, it's the irony of it, you see. M had nearly gotten her card punched already from Silva, and even after all he does to try and get at her, all the ways he attempts to kill her through years of planning...one of his henchman takes away his only pleasure, his only meaning for existence. It shows how pathetic of a man he is, and also how no matter how vengeful and planned the villain is to get at M, she can be killed by someone as simple as a random thug with a gun. M was worried about Silva all this time, and never expected to die any other way but at his hands. Instead, she is shot and eventually killed by a man she didn't know, had no file on, and knew nothing about. A man from "the shadows" if you will, which harkens back to her speech during the hearing. Our enemies presently are no longer countries on a map or faces we can identify. Death can come from mere strangers to us now if they have the upper hand. So really, Bond and Silva both faced off, and though Bond killed Silva and technically won, and Silva died but M died (thought not by his hands) did he really win? No, here there are no winners or losers. Skyfall has shown us that maybe there is only the man who isn't as worse off that survives, while the one who dies (Silva) was just worse off than the former, having both lost so much.
Bond's "victory" if you could even call it such a thing in a situation where everyone lost something, is the very definition of Pyrrhic. He protects the country he has chosen to always serve by stopping Silva for good, but loses the one woman who was very much like a watchful protector over him in the process. So is the job, and so is life. But that very woman went out honorably, and kept her promise to leave her duty only when the situation was pacified, and for that M succeeded in her mission and deserved her eternal rest. Now, we must see a Bond that can move past this rough corner of his life and continue on with his duty, though the pain will never go away.
All I am trying to say is that it is a lazy argument (to put it lightly) to assume that Bond's only mission (even primarily) is to keep M alive when it goes so much deeper than all that hogwash.
Haha, good point.
And by the way...Does this look like a man with a whatever attitude?
http://7films.dendelionblu.me/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/From-Russia-with-Love.jpg
But do you see my point? I feel like most of my posts here defending both Sean's Bond and Skyfall have been ignored.
It's been released everywhere but China (I think), and as far as I know we don't have any chinese members. Also the DVD is out next month, and most, if not all, of us have seen the film now.
So when can we start talking about SF without spoiler tags? I don't see the point anymore to be honest.
Not even close to everyone. I still read plenty of people on here saying they are waiting to see it, and it isn't a film to be spoiled.
With SF:
As for Sean, I don't really see his 'I don't care' demeanor. He wants to take DN down even more after Quarrel's death. He's incredibly distraught over Kerim's death. He looks very saddened by Jill's painful death. He gets the job done one way or another, and I think in the three aforementioned cases, there was really nothing he could do to protect those who perished.
He and Quarrel had different objectives in taking the 'dragon' down, and Quarrel just happened to be too close. He had no idea Grant was there to kill Kerim on the train, and he was clueless - a nice drink was on his mind - that Oddjob had entered the hotel room.
Who? Because it's close to leaving cinemas in most places as far as I know.
He isn't just knocked aback at Jill's death, he almost gets taken off the mission by M because of his anger! And Tilly winds him up, as does Aki's passing. I have said all this before, but still.
Just because it is leaving theaters doesn't mean anything. I have friends that want to desperately see it but time isn't always on their side, the same to many members here who either can't get out to see it or whathaveyou.
I don't know anybody on this site now who hasn't seen the film.
Judging by some posts on here, I don't think many others have either.
Too much keeps me from doing a proper Bondathon anymore. I watched DN and FRWL the other day, but countless other films I need to see take up my time, along with hanging with friends and preparing to return to college. It's sad, but priorities. I'll get to the rest of the films eventually.
after fighting off a bunch of special trained henchmen singlehandly, i would forgive him that. I tell you never seen any other Bond do that with the sheer Coolness and asskickery of Craig plus he knows more then a karate chop and his use of weapons is pretty outstanding. Craig;s Bond i would trust with my life.
Your funeral.
Almost everybody who has trusted Craig during his era has ended up dead.
Solange, Vesper, Fields, Mathis, Severine and M. The only real exception is Camille. The man is cursed.
If he carries on this way he's definetly going to end up with the most dead allies/girls out of all the Bonds (or is that a title he's already taken?).
Vesper killed herself so thats struck of the list. Yeah he's had a bad run but thats life isnt it. the life of a secret agent isn't happy endings as past Bonds made you belived. Solange and Severine were pumped (excuse the pun) for information barely anything other then that plus they were involved with dangerous men. Mathis knew what the Job entailed. He protected M from a large group of men who were out to kill her and it wasn't exactly his fault she died. Fields i take pity for i admit she was an innocent.
Cursed or not the guy is specialy trained and looks like he's a ex soilder compared to other actors playing Bonds.
I'm not saying he caused any of those deaths but most of his allies and girls have ended up dead.
He's just really unlucky and I wouldn't take my chances with him.
If we're on about ex soldiers Lazenby actually did teach hand to hand combat to the Aussie military.
Here we go again. The lazy argument. Some of these aren't even his damn fault for crying out loud.
Did Bond hold Solange at gunpoint to have a drink? No. Her death is her fault, especially since she knew what she signed up for with Dimitrios. Did he tell Vesper to killer herself? Of bloody course not, fools. What the hell was Bond supposed to do? Did you not see him tearing at the damn elevator tirelessly and frantically trying to get to Vesper and save her, and then afterwards emotionally shattering to pieces when he couldn't resuscitate her? Did Bond ask Fields to become a thorn in Greene's side, started when she tripped Elvis down the steps? No. Fields died because of her own naivete. Bond didn't even know about the corrupt Bolivian cop, so how the hell did he know Mathis was headed to his death? Answer: HE DIDN'T. Don't you think Bond would give anything just to have another day with Mathis if he could? Of course he would. Severine is the one who got in bed (possible double meaning) with Silva and willingly took Bond to him and it is her own fault. It is a shame she died, but Bond couldn't stop it without dying himself. He had guns trained on him from all sides, and his death would have made M even more accessible in the future. And finally, M knew she was going to die. Bond did all he could to protect her, but 3 against a dozen or more aren't good odds. If anyone actually bothered to read my post I tagged a few hours ago, I explain how maybe M's death isn't the failure everyone likes to think it is. I will repost it below for anyone who cares...
My thoughts on M/Bond's mission in Skyfall:
I find it a bit lazy to say that Bond is the one who got M killed. She went along with the plan, and knew the risks. It was the best plan at the moment to trek to Skyfall, where they had the upper hand and that way no more innocents would have to die for M. Granted, I think M, just like Vesper knew she was going to her death. People act like keeping M alive was the primary mission, when it wasn't at all. Silva needed put down, first and foremost. He would do anything, kill anyone who got in his way to M. He is a pathetic human being whose only purpose in life for years now has been to kill an old woman. Obviously, he isn't going to let anyone stop him when he is that deranged. He was a rouge who outstepped his boundaries and deserved the torture he got, yet he blames M who in turn got more agents from the Chinese who wouldn't double cross her orders. She had no idea what the Chinese would do, but she got rid of one bad seed for better ripened apples.
So, what all this boils down to is this: The mission is to kill Silva. He thought anyone was expendable to get his way to M, and he would do anything to make it so. He caused massive chaos in London to get her. MI6 partly blown to bits, agents dead in high numbers, tube riders in severe danger in the tunnels and officials/guards/innocents put in the crossfire during the hearing. Bond makes the call to get M out so they have an advantage to draw Silva away where no innocents are hurt and his technology is meaningless. They fight honorably, 3 against dozens, and believe it or not folks, we lost M. It is inevitable. As I said previously, I truly feel that she knew death was coming. The whole film was filled with her staring at her own bad misfortunes getting the better of her, eating away at her until she realized that death couldn't be too far away. Her face in the hearing when she is about to be shot by Silva before Mallory intervenes is the face of someone who is expecting death. But at the end of the day she wasn't going to leave her duty without the situation pacified, and when Bond finally kills Silva she knows the job is done and she can pass honorably away, giving everything to protect the country she served, even at the ultimate cost.
And as I have said before in a Skyfall review thread, the ending shows us an important lesson about winning and losing, and if it really exists. Bond wins the fight, but loses M. Silva spends his basically nihilistic existence with the only objective of killing and old woman, and can't even do that. He ends up with a knife in the back, failed in his mission. But yet M dies, so did he win? Well, not quite. You see, M was killed by a random henchman. What does that prove? Well, it's the irony of it, you see. M had nearly gotten her card punched already from Silva, and even after all he does to try and get at her, all the ways he attempts to kill her through years of planning...one of his henchman takes away his only pleasure, his only meaning for existence. It shows how pathetic of a man he is, and also how no matter how vengeful and planned the villain is to get at M, she can be killed by someone as simple as a random thug with a gun. M was worried about Silva all this time, and never expected to die any other way but at his hands. Instead, she is shot and eventually killed by a man she didn't know, had no file on, and knew nothing about. A man from "the shadows" if you will, which harkens back to her speech during the hearing. Our enemies presently are no longer countries on a map or faces we can identify. Death can come from mere strangers to us now if they have the upper hand. So really, Bond and Silva both faced off, and though Bond killed Silva and technically won, and Silva died but M died (thought not by his hands) did he really win? No, here there are no winners or losers. Skyfall has shown us that maybe there is only the man who isn't as worse off that survives, while the one who dies (Silva) was just worse off than the former, having both lost so much.
Bond's "victory" if you could even call it such a thing in a situation where everyone lost something, is the very definition of Pyrrhic. He protects the country he has chosen to always serve by stopping Silva for good, but loses the one woman who was very much like a watchful protector over him in the process. So is the job, and so is life. But that very woman went out honorably, and kept her promise to leave her duty only when the situation was pacified, and for that M succeeded in her mission and deserved her eternal rest. Now, we must see a Bond that can move past this rough corner of his life and continue on with his duty, though the pain will never go away.
All I am trying to say is that it is a lazy argument (to put it lightly) to assume that Bond's only mission (even primarily) is to keep M alive when it goes so much deeper than all that hogwash.
Read my other post. I didn't say he caused any of those deaths but he's extremely unlucky and has lost almost every single girl/ally, so I wouldn't take my chances with him.
I agree with you on this @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7. It's a good assessment of Craig's Bond, as well as the fact that the third act of SkyFall was about much more than protecting M. Good analysis on your part, and I do agree. I also concur that Connery's Bond was not the cold-hearted bastard towards his dead allies that some seem to feel. He tried not to show his pain/discomfoft in many scenes cause he probably knows he shouldn't, but it's clearly there.
But why would you worry about "taking your chance with him" when you know that a near perfect majority were not his fault in any way shape or form? In a way, everyone that died died because of their own actions, and in no way connected to what Bond told them or made them do. That isn't really a showing of bad luck on Bond's part. Considering he is often the only one keeping a level and loyal head (as well as not being killed) I'd say he's quite lucky. But, to each his own. I have done enough analysis today. Both in Bond and today in a literature course. I'm tired out. ;)
@wildboonjive, I thank you for taking the time to read my thoughts as I know I can right novels at some intervals. I don't expect any of you to read it and agree, as you believe what you believe, I am just trying to show you another way of looking at it from my perspective.
Well then we can't count any collateral damage since it's never been Bonds fault has it.
I pick George "taught the army hand to hand combat and almost worked with Bruce Lee" Lazenby then.
Not unless it was genuinely Bond's fault that everything happened.